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(12-13-2017, 12:55 PM)ACMILAN1983 Wrote: Interesting thoughts. Dru I do agree with your point that cyber bullying is a massive problem and people get a hive mentality (the sjw in this case) in using social media. In the case of August Ames, that's just a sad story to hear and she's ironically a victim of unfair and intolerant attacks.

People who claim she was homophobic are clearly missing the point based on what I've read. She didn't attack the gay community nor tried to restrict their freedom, but made a personal choice not to partake in activities involving men who have been involved in gay activities. She had every right to choose who she is professionally involved with and those attacking her are as intolerant as those who are homophobic, just extremist on the other end of the spectrum. I don't know if she communicated this poorly and so began to attract hate, but certainly from what I've seen, her choice should have been respected as she was entitled to it.

Reza, I agree with your points. Traditionally it was said you should never meet your heroes in life because you'll only be disappointed. People who follow their "heroes" need to understand that they are flawed human beings and may make mistakes or not live up to expectation. That comes down to ignorance on the part of the fan.

I agree totally on the bullying story. The response the boy got shouldn't be seen as a lasting or long term solution, instead it's up to people to help the boy, both by stopping the bullying at the root, but also helping him to learn to deal with people who may not like him in life (unfortunately, not everyone will like you) and helping him develop his self confidence and minimise insecurities at the core.

I agree with you about the Internet being a place where people have a very black and white view of the world, which is unfortunate because the world isn't that simple and there are a variety of shades of grey.

I mostly agree with your post....but I don't really think that cyber-bullying is a massive problem. I think that people being cunts towards each other is a problem, sure. But the "cyber" type is MUCH easier to ignore/dismiss/ or even report and get some form of redress.

The issue with August Ames isn't so much strictly an internet phenomenon...but a social mind-set one (aka "zeitgeist"). There are simply opinions that you're not allowed to have. And these opinions aren't necessarily WRONG/BIGOTED/RACIST/HATEFUL at all. They simply have to not coincide with a SUPER liberal mind-set.....and atuomagically you're a Nazi Wallbang

So in the August Ames case...it wasn't enough that she was actually a bisexual woman who preferred women....she had to LOVE having sex with guys that participated in gay sex otherwise she was homophobic Dodgy

And that sort of thinking....coming back to Reza's earlier post is being spread through social media...because, since everyone "sorta" knows everyone else....nobody is BRAVE enough to oppose the ppl who portray themselves as the most loving/compassionate/tolerant.

This is a suicidal situation (literally in the case of Ames) for an ACTUAL liberal Western Democracy - where free speech is a cornerstone of our civilization.

Here's another wacky example of the extreme Political Correctness gone haywire....The Christians who refused to bake a gay wedding cake story.
These poor ppl have been tarred and feathered in the media as the most vile sort of homophobes....But was this necessary? If someone doesn't approve of your lifestyle but doesn't IMPACT upon it..shouldn't they be free to think whatever they wanted?

It gets worse, when you consider that there are other religions where gays are treated infinitely more harshly.....that the social media mobs (other than a few right wingers) come after....and this is because most ppl fear to criticize these other ideologies...for fear for either their own personal  and physical safety...or for fear of being called a racist/Islamophobe.

The funny thing is that social media has created an artificial power dynamic that often pops easily in the real world such as was the case in the Brexit vote or the election of Trump....The bubble that these online communities creates pops swiftly and sometimes violently....leading to another cycle of backlashes and reprisals.

I wish ppl would just sit down and talk TO eachother rather than post or Tweet AT eachother.  Undecided
Milan is a rose
Love even the thorns
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Dru, I don't think the effects of cyber bullying should be diminished, I think it's as serious as bullying in person. I get what you're saying, but I think the effects of Internet culture can be very damaging.

I do disagree on the wedding cake example to be honest, not that the owners of the business were vilified extensively (I honestly don't know what happened after seeing the story), but their actions imo were wrong. They discriminated and against the gay community and while this might be on religious grounds, I fundamentally disagree with their actions of refusing to cater to the couples' wedding. This sort of discrimination isn't acceptable imo and is no better than someone who might have refused to serve someone else because of race. That said, I'd rather have dialogue with the business owners and maturely debate the subject than to demonize them as inhumane and post vitriolic abuse at them on the net.

In general though I think our views are the same. We agree that people need to talk to rather than immediately judge one another.
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(12-15-2017, 02:22 PM)ACMILAN1983 Wrote: Dru, I don't think the effects of cyber bullying should be diminished, I think it's as serious as bullying in person. I get what you're saying, but I think the effects of Internet culture can be very damaging.

I do disagree on the wedding cake example to be honest, not that the owners of the business were vilified extensively (I honestly don't know what happened after seeing the story), but their actions imo were wrong. They discriminated and against the gay community and while this might be on religious grounds, I fundamentally disagree with their actions of refusing to cater to the couples' wedding. This sort of discrimination isn't acceptable imo and is no better than someone who might have refused to serve someone else because of race. That said, I'd rather have dialogue with the business owners and maturely debate the subject than to demonize them as inhumane and post vitriolic abuse at them on the net.

In general though I think our views are the same. We agree that people need to talk to rather than immediately judge one another.

I hear you....and your principles are not wrong imho.

BUT

Will the State EVER think to force a Muslim Establishment to bake a gay wedding cake? I'm betting no. I'm betting that our society has been conditioned well enough to not even consider asking. Actually, there was an experiment done by Steven Crowder on this very same issue....and he was rejected by ALL of the Muslim establishments. But the rules are often applied differently for some religions....and there is nothing anyone could tell me to convince me otherwise. I've seen, read and documented these cases far too much.

I believe in freedom of religion (with the obvious exceptions such as if said religion is breaking the existing law etc).

And if it's against someone's religion to bake a cake....AND post pro-gay messages (keep in mind that this wasn't simply an issue of discrimination against homosexuals...the baker was requested to basically support the gay marriage with the requirements of the cake - which I contend that he's not obligated to do so) then the owner is within his rights to withhold his services from this request.

What I would opposed is if the baker somehow found out that this particular patron was gay and refused him service or treated him abusively in some way....then I'd WANT the State to step in and restore justice.
Milan is a rose
Love even the thorns
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Avaiting for arrival of exorcist into our boardroom.
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Merry Christmas to everyone!
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Merry Christmas to everyone(not so Merry for Milan fans)

I hope Santa gifts us Todibo, Ibra, a Right Winger, a Left Winger, a Playmaker and take away Kessie, Suso, Biglia, Hakan, Paqueta in his sack. Angry
"Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it"
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Merry Christmas
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Merry Christmas, happy holidays all.
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RIP

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Whoever lives in Beirut, Lebanon, be safe, A large blast has hit the Lebanese capital near the port area, with unverified casualties. prayers for all.
"Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it"
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