Poll: Should Allegri be fired rite now?
This poll is closed.
Yes Musik005
44.12%
15 44.12%
No Facepalm
35.29%
12 35.29%
Can't say ... Blank
20.59%
7 20.59%
Total 34 vote(s) 100%
* You voted for this item. [Show Results]

Allegri Thread
#31
Dev, I completely agree with everything you said.

I personally want the players and management held accountable too. But our season is slipping away. We can't get rid of ALL the players and we obviously can't get rid of Berlu and Galliani. So this may sound stupid, but the only change that we can make at the moment is Allegri.....and change is needed. If these players won't play for Allegri, then we need someone else to motivate them. Someone to bring a spark and bring enthusiasm back to Milanello. Again, I don't think this is all Allegri's fault, but we need a way out as our season is slipping away and soon we'll find ourselves with no objectives to play for.

We have lost points this season because of players mistakes and coach mistakes. How do we fix it? These players are better then what they've shown and we need someone to get the best out of them. Allegri hasn't (and I don't think it's entirely his fault) and you yourself pointed that out in your post. You also pointed out that his constant changing of the system has not helped. About player selection, he's gotten it wrong MANY times, which is why like you said he's had to make changes to claw out results.

Players make mistakes in every team and all teams lose points because of players mistakes...so naturally so will Milan. But coaching mistakes should be held at a MINIMUM (not saying this is fair, but coaches are always first to go and easier to get rid of....even though I actually think Allegri has exceded this minimum already this year) If you have players making mistakes + coach making mistakes you are double screwed. You have to eliminate at least one of the parts that is constantly making mistakes. Allegri has tried to eliminate the players that consistently make mistakes (Boateng, Nocerino, Antonini, Flamini, etc.) and it hasn't worked. So it may be time for the management to eliminate the other half of the mistakes that have been made - Allegri. In our situation, it seems more and more that players are even making CARELESS mistakes because Allegri has lost their heads, motivation, sacrifice....which is even a bigger problem.

Also, if this (http://football-italia.net/27240/allegri-rant-revealed) is true then he HAS to go as he's clearly lost control of the locker room.
Even Emanuelson is indirectly criticizing him. (http://football-italia.net/27244/emanuel...square-one)

My question to you my friend is.....what do we do to save our season? I am not saying this is Allegri's fault. As a matter of fact, the management is at fault the most. The players are underperforming and making stupid mistakes too. But again, what are the things that we can do to save our season? I think that Allegri needs to be replaced if he doesn't win against Napoli. NOT because all this mess is his fault, but for the GOOD of the TEAM he has to take the fall. Someone new that can bring enthusiasm and a new start to the team needs to be brought in. It sucks to be Allegri now as he is taking the blame for anything and everything....but this is a tough world and it is the way it is. All I want is a decision to be made for Milan's best. It may not be fair, but something needs to be done.

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#32
Nefremo you expressed my thoughts perfectly. Fact is, allegri isn't too bad of a coach but I still don't think he's milan quality, ontop of that he should be fired for new enthusiasm and motivation as it is in fact the only thing we can do even if its not fair to him it's the only risk that could potentially save our season because we are seriously under performing our potential. In short, allegri out + half decent winter Mercato could = that 3rd place.
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#33
(11-13-2012, 05:26 PM)LebRN Wrote: I never said Allegri is the ONLY one to blame for our results here...again, I repeat what I said up there and that the quality of players we have is good enough for 4-7th position or maybe 3rd if the coach is great or the other teams suck....which means we all know the players are not good enough to deliver consistently excellent performances and therefore the mistakes or poor performances that they will definitely produce from time to time is already accounted for above....so yes, we expect Mexes, Bonera, De Jong, Ambrosini, Urby,....(all our squad) to fuck more often than we would like because they are not Thiago Silva, Ivanovic, Ramires, Fabregas....whatever....
That is something we all know and can discuss in a "underperforming players" thread or B&G in a "management 101 - what not to do" thread....but here we are discussing how bad Allegri is fucking up and is it bad enough that he should be fired for it and, for me, the answer is YES

I would say if players play to expectations then we have a squad good enough for 3rd to 7th positions. The truth is the players aren't playing up to the standards expected of them (which aren't even that high). Guys like Abate (until the last couple of weeks), Pato (who also had injuries), Boateng, De Jong and Nocerino haven't played to expectations. Even those like Montolivo haven't played up to expectations.

Now the argument we've had here is whether the players are held responsible for them not playing up to the standard expected of them or the coach. The more I think about it, it becomes a chicken and egg situation. Personally, I think both are equally responsible for the mess and as a result all should be held accountable.

(11-13-2012, 05:38 PM)nefremo Wrote: Dev, I completely agree with everything you said.

I personally want the players and management held accountable too. But our season is slipping away. We can't get rid of ALL the players and we obviously can't get rid of Berlu and Galliani. So this may sound stupid, but the only change that we can make at the moment is Allegri.....and change is needed. If these players won't play for Allegri, then we need someone else to motivate them. Someone to bring a spark and bring enthusiasm back to Milanello. Again, I don't think this is all Allegri's fault, but we need a way out as our season is slipping away and soon we'll find ourselves with no objectives to play for.

We have lost points this season because of players mistakes and coach mistakes. How do we fix it? These players are better then what they've shown and we need someone to get the best out of them. Allegri hasn't (and I don't think it's entirely his fault) and you yourself pointed that out in your post. You also pointed out that his constant changing of the system has not helped. About player selection, he's gotten it wrong MANY times, which is why like you said he's had to make changes to claw out results.

Players make mistakes in every team and all teams lose points because of players mistakes...so naturally so will Milan. But coaching mistakes should be held at a MINIMUM (not saying this is fair, but coaches are always first to go and easier to get rid of....even though I actually think Allegri has exceded this minimum already this year) If you have players making mistakes + coach making mistakes you are double screwed. You have to eliminate at least one of the parts that is constantly making mistakes. Allegri has tried to eliminate the players that consistently make mistakes (Boateng, Nocerino, Antonini, Flamini, etc.) and it hasn't worked. So it may be time for the management to eliminate the other half of the mistakes that have been made - Allegri. In our situation, it seems more and more that players are even making CARELESS mistakes because Allegri has lost their heads, motivation, sacrifice....which is even a bigger problem.

Also, if this (http://football-italia.net/27240/allegri-rant-revealed) is true then he HAS to go as he's clearly lost control of the locker room.
Even Emanuelson is indirectly criticizing him. (http://football-italia.net/27244/emanuel...square-one)

My question to you my friend is.....what do we do to save our season? I am not saying this is Allegri's fault. As a matter of fact, the management is at fault the most. The players are underperforming and making stupid mistakes too. But again, what are the things that we can do to save our season? I think that Allegri needs to be replaced if he doesn't win against Napoli. NOT because all this mess is his fault, but for the GOOD of the TEAM he has to take the fall. Someone new that can bring enthusiasm and a new start to the team needs to be brought in. It sucks to be Allegri now as he is taking the blame for anything and everything....but this is a tough world and it is the way it is. All I want is a decision to be made for Milan's best. It may not be fair, but something needs to be done.

You're right, we can't change half the players (we've had enough turnover as it is) and Berlu and Galliani. That leaves Allegri. If rumours are true and he has lost the dressing room, then it's hard to keep him. Truth is, I tend to take rumours with a pinch of salt and therefore I'm hesitant to believe this and will assume the players are still backing him (player interviews suggest they're with him despite odd comments suggesting otherwise).

If you'd asked me after Lazio should we sack Allegri, I would have said probably, as like you I think we needed a change. Since then we've finally shown signs of progress, actually sticking to a system and starting to get an understanding of the core players in the team and playing with some enthusiasm. Even against Fiorentina, look at the match stats and you see that the team wasn't really inferior to Fiorentina, although our mistakes cost us. Had we played them just 3 weeks ago, I guarantee there would have been one clear dominant side on the pitch. One loss shouldn't let us go back to square one as Urby suggests, we should accept that we will face problems on the journey. For these reasons, I'm prepared to give a little patience to Allegri.

There's another reason why I wouldn't sack Allegri yet. We have no alternatives. Tassotti's made it clear he's not keen on the job, Guardiola or even Montella won't take over in a time of crisis and would expect certain guarantees before taking on the job. Who else does that leave that can seriously bring the steadiness we need? I like to believe many of the ex-players and coaches also know more than us about how things work. I've yet to find one, and I mean fellow professionals not journalists, to say Allegri should be sacked. If anything, they are saying the exact opposite and ex-players like Coco and Lentini have come out against the quality of the players instead.

To answer your question about what we should do. Well, let's say I'm in Berlu and Galliani's shoes, I would hold meetings with Allegri, Tassotti, the coaches and I would speak to the players. The key goals of this finding out what the root problem appears to be, whether it be Allegri losing the group or a lack of conviction in the group. Once I know what the problems are I'd figure out a plan of actions to start sorting this mess out, whether it be to sack Allegri or instill greater discipline in the group. Most important is Galliani and Berlu need to make their presence felt at the club right now. As the heads, two guys with a huge amount of authority and experience in football, they need to give a sense of calm to everyone in the club by being by their side right now when they need it. It's also important that now they also make it clear what it means to play for Milan, how important the shirt is and motivating the group to drag themselves out of the predicament.
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#34
Well the thing is that.....I'm sure that's been done already.......and obviously it hasn't helped.

I think you are right and one loss shouldn't take us back to square one. I don't think it has and I never suggested that it did. I put Urby's comment out there for the fact that he said "we don't have a core group of players and most of the line up constantly changes". But that loss did pile a ton of pressure back on the team and Allegri. I don't think we were bad against Fiorentina, but I tend not to look at statistics for a game that I already watched as they can be decieving. Yes we had more possession but what did we do with it. We barely created a goal scoring opportunity. We had more of the ball but barely put Fiorentina under pressure. Had we scored that penalty, it may have been different but we didn't. So we continued holding the ball without any real opportunities. Again, we didn't play bad, but we also didn't play well enough to win. Statistics of how many balls we won, how many shots we took (where did we take them from? favorable positions?), how much possession we had....etc, don't tell the whole picture. Everyone that saw the game will know that we simply weren't good enough to take anything out of that game.

I do agree that there are no great options out there to replace Allegri though. However, if we lose against Napoli I don't see how he will be able to take the pressure off the squad this time.
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#35
It now feels like a dream that this loser actually won Scudetto in his first season. Its unbelievable that the coach of AC Milan doesn't have the sense to figure it out that Bojan must play, CB's should remain the same and Boateng is not a CAM. If you don't know that, then you don't deserve the salary you getting. AC Milan's current squad is good enough to be in top 3 rite now. Maybe its time to kick Allegri out and bring on Maldini. I can bet my whole savings in the bank that Maldini would be a better coach than this dumbo.
Argentina will win the World Cup 2018

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#36
(11-14-2012, 03:38 PM)nefremo Wrote: Well the thing is that.....I'm sure that's been done already.......and obviously it hasn't helped.

I think you are right and one loss shouldn't take us back to square one. I don't think it has and I never suggested that it did. I put Urby's comment out there for the fact that he said "we don't have a core group of players and most of the line up constantly changes". But that loss did pile a ton of pressure back on the team and Allegri. I don't think we were bad against Fiorentina, but I tend not to look at statistics for a game that I already watched as they can be decieving. Yes we had more possession but what did we do with it. We barely created a goal scoring opportunity. We had more of the ball but barely put Fiorentina under pressure. Had we scored that penalty, it may have been different but we didn't. So we continued holding the ball without any real opportunities. Again, we didn't play bad, but we also didn't play well enough to win. Statistics of how many balls we won, how many shots we took (where did we take them from? favorable positions?), how much possession we had....etc, don't tell the whole picture. Everyone that saw the game will know that we simply weren't good enough to take anything out of that game.

I do agree that there are no great options out there to replace Allegri though. However, if we lose against Napoli I don't see how he will be able to take the pressure off the squad this time.

When was it done? As far as I'm aware Berlu's not made his presence felt at Milan much at all. Galliani I think addressed the squad the odd time, but there's no suggestion he's spoken much to individuals besides Allegri.

No you didn't suggest we're back to square one, but Urby did do and him even thinking that does annoy me.

About the match against Fiorentina, we weren't brilliant by any stretch of the imagination and Fiorentina deserved the victory, but if you look for the key differences between the sides, it's they were very clinical with the chances they got and they didn't make many individual mistakes, we did and we were wasteful. My use of the statistics is simply to highlight that we weren't totally dominated and we weren't worse than them in ability, just they did things right and we didn't.

The pressure can't increase right now, so if we lose to Napoli, we're just stuck in the same situation.

Interesting thing, earlier I mentioned how ex-players/coaches aren't criticising Allegri, but the players haven't avoided harsh remarks. This interview with Costacurta is again following the same line.

http://www.milannews.it/?action=read&idnotizia=96201
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#37
I don't think we would be informed every time the team meets. I don't think we would know if Galliani has or has not spoken to individuals or the squad in general. A serious club like Milan I am sure has addressed issues with the coach and the team. I played for a small semi-pro club and played college soccer also here in the USA and even WE had those meetings after games. That's why I am suggesting that the club has held meetings in order to resolve the issue. I don't think something like that will be a publicized event. It would be silly to think that one of the biggest clubs in the world, Milan, after collecting 14 out of 36 possible points in the league (and 5 from possible 12 in the CL) has not held multiple meetings in order to resolve the situation. I am sure Galliani as the general manager constantly speaks to individuals besides Allegri. That's his job after all. As a matter of fact....there already was a "ritiro" after the game with Lazio where Galliani himself stated that everyone will have time to think about what needs to be done during the squad retreat.

About Urby suggesting that we are at square 1, it does annoy me too brother, but it is an indication of what the players are feeling.....and it's not good. Me, you, everyone else in this forum, the media.... can say that we are back at square 1 or can say that we are doing great. It can matter, but not really. What the players are feeling however is what matters most because they are the ones that have to go and perform against Napoli on Saturday. So if they are feeling down and they feel like they are back to square 1, then we might be in a bit of trouble.

The fact of the matter is that I am like you....I don't think it's all Allegri's fault and I don't thinik that replacing him will magically improve everything. But if things don't improve under Allegri, then how long can we support him for? At this point I think there are still objectives this season. We can still climb up the table but very soon those will be gone. So as long as we start winning, I'm ok with Allegri there. If we lost against Napoli and we don't beat Anderlecht then I don't see how he can stay any longer.
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#38
It is tough to read too much into Urby's comments, but the fact the players question the regular rotation of the line-up seems striking.

I didn't see this posted: http://forzaitalianfootball.com/2012/11/...-ac-milan/?
This kind of makes Allegri sound crazy, no?

So we are getting to the point where the Allegri decision will be meaningless. If poor form continues we will have essentially no chance of the CL. If we wait much longer then fire him, we will essentially damn ourselves to the same result.

Serie A
2011/12 Third place was 64 pts
2010/11 It was 70
2009/10 It was 70
2008/09 It was 74
2007/08 It was 72

We have 14 points out of 12 games (36 max points). If we take the Champions league average of about 70 then we just need 56 more points in 26 games.

We obviously need the CL to keep the books near balanced. So what does 56 points mean? We need about 17 wins and 1 draw in the final 26 games.

If we did get a new coach ASAP, we can assume a slow start as he implements his tactics to the side. Maybe in the first 6 games we get 6 points (1 win and 3 draws). If that were the case, this new coach would then be forced to get 50 points in 20 games or 15 wins and 5 draws (perfection) or 16 wins and 2 draws. That is pretty tough considering our current squad.

Whatever the case regarding Allegri may be, if we move on him it has to be soon. Seeing as he is the only realistic big change we can make for this team before further destabilizing it from sales due to not making the CL, it may be worth it. In the end, is there a real difference between Allegri missing the target or a mid-season replacement? Money is money and we are running out Undecided


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#39
The only reason I voted no is because I never wanted him in the first place as a coach and we won with him. Now I hope i'm wrong again.
I Heart ACM !!
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#40
Let's ask to Leonardo to be our coach for 3-4 months ... Yes, as well in Milan as in Inter, it's more or less the time he is able to do something good/great, then, the teams just disappear and become so bad !!

Leonardo, come back, do what you did with Inter (a serie of wins), and leave as far as possible from Milan and never come back for the best of everyone !!

Wouldn't it be a good solution ? Devilol
One should not speak ill of the dead.
So stop laughing at Juventus !
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