Serie A Week 3: Torino - Milan, Saturday, September 14, 2013, CET 20:45
(09-16-2013, 05:24 PM)xudong Wrote: and there may be some serious issues too with his training methods, otherwise, how come so many players have had muscular problems?

Actually, the muscular problems concern 2-3 players.
Kaka' can't be considered into this as he just joined. Abate was injured with the NT and didn't really take part to the physical preparation. Pazzini's been injured since last season. Saponara arrived very tired and injured very quickly.
De Sciglio, Niang, Silvestre : it's not muscular for example.
One should not speak ill of the dead.
So stop laughing at Juventus !
But don't you guys find it strange how Pato goes back to Brazil and suddenly he's all fit and scores seven in thirteen? Not a hint of muscle injuries at all...

Didn't we already revamp our entire medical staff like a few years back?
What the Hell is with all these injuries at the start of the season? Something just doesn't seem right.

I remember when Galliani used to praise the Milan Lab for extending the careers of Paolo and Billy, what the heck happened to our Lab?
We got the young 'un's. We take out big gunz  Devilcool
The San Siro pitch has been pretty poor over the last few years so I can only imagine what the practice fields look like. That probably contributes to players getting injured as well..
Siamo a posto cosi.
(09-17-2013, 10:30 AM)ACMILAN1983 Wrote: Last season we made changes to avoid injuries and for the most part we saw an improvement as there weren't many long term absences barring De Jong.

This year, something must have changed for us to be in the situation we are in now.

About Allegri, I'd give him until the end of October to get results in order. I don't think he's a bad coach and I don't think we've been bad under him, but I am tired of seeing the same problems occurring under him every year. I agree with nefremo that changing system for a 31 year old seems bizarre too, although I'm open to new interpretations of 4-3-1-2, which is what I thought I saw vs Cagliari in the early period of that game.

I remember that too. This season is nothing like last season, and I wonder too what the hell changed to induce such an outburst of injuries at such an early stage.

(09-17-2013, 04:10 PM)Mystik Wrote: The San Siro pitch has been pretty poor over the last few years so I can only imagine what the practice fields look like. That probably contributes to players getting injured as well..

Didn't we upgrade the pitch at San Siro to some type of high-tech hybrid turf before last season? I believe that I read a report on that, but can't remember for sure.
aka xudong
Formation 4-3-1-2 was a request by Berlusconi. And that's the formation that Allegri preferred in Cagliari and that's the formation that we played when we won the title with Allegri.
He abandoned 4-3-1-2 because Ibrahimovic and Cassano left and there was no-one to compensate the lack of creativity of our attacking midfielder, Boateng.

I don't know about some of you guys, perhaps I don't remember clearly, but if my memory is correct, and mind you that I watched at least 90% of games last season, 4-3-3 only worked for a few games when Niang was in form. After that it worked like shit.

The thing is, we were looking for an (creative) attacking midfielder for the whole summer, and it was evident that we're back to 4-3-1-2. It was coincidence that it was Kaka, it could've been Honda, or someone else.
We were first looking at Cerci (confirmed by Galliani). So in the beginning of the summer we were still looking at playing a 4-3-3. But anyhow, a creative midfield can still play in a doesn't necessarily have to be 4-3-1-2.

It just looks like we change our plans every few months. It's so frustrating. Last year Galliani came out and said that they are setting the entire youth system to play as the senior side (4-3-3). Then this year we change our minds again. It's unbeliavable.

In any case, the biggest problem I have is not the formation. I think formations are overrated (especially offensively....defensively it is important to keep the balance and positioning in a formation and shape). Movement is everything in this game and fluidity is very important. In any given point a RB can become a RW and a CF can become a CM; and a CM can become a ST, etc, etc. So I don't really care what formation we play as long as our football is fluid and with movement. We go back and forth with that and we fail to show consistency and that's what's frustrating. Every season it takes us 3 months to get going and by then it's too late. I hope we see a change very soon (in the way we play)
When you said the biggest problem is not the formation, did you mean that it is the quality of our players? If so, I fully agree.
aka xudong
Yes, kind of.

What I mean is that I don't mind the 4-3-1-2 because you can play fluid football with it (you can play fluid football with any formation).
You are right order to do that you also need quality players. You can't expect to do that with Traore, Nocerino and Birsa. However, you also need a coach that'll make it all work.

All of this is more then one man's responsibility. It doesn't help that the owner demands that we play a certain formation (and then fails to bring us the adequate players for it). It doesn't help that Allegri takes too long to figure things out (last year he insisted on playin 4-3-1-2 in the beginning and we lost way to many took him forever to finally settle on a CB duo; he kept trustig players that kept letting him/team down game after game). It doesn't help that we change market strategies a few times during the summer. It doesn't help that we wait until the last minute to sign players.

In any cse, to go back to my main point.....I think the formation is not the problem. The way we play (static, slow ball and player movement) is the problem. Clearly, quality players will help us achieve that. It just seems like we always miss some of the essentials for good attacking it width, depth, penetrating passes/dribbles, quick movement off the ball and interchanging, etc, etc. Sometimes we miss all of them and wait for a star player to do his thing. It was first Ibra, now Balotelli. This is also my biggest problem with Allegri as he was supposed to be known for that. For all his attacking mindness. Yet we just haven't seen it. But again, as I noted earlier, it's not all his fault.
Agree completely nefremo. Our constant changes are detrimental, but theoretically shouldn't be as big a problem as they have been. Formations in the modern game are little more than numbers to give a rough layout of a side. I remember Bilic once said they are meaningless, while Capello has said something similar this summer as every team needs to be compact in the modern game.

It's for this reason I've always thought the philosophy we play by (something I think should be dictated by the club and our past) is fundamentally more important (see my posts in the Allegri's system for next season thread)