Winter Mercato 2011 - Page 3

nefremo · 11-09-2010, 09:55

Like Reza said, demands 3,4 and 7 are ridiculous.

3.Behavior should be expected on and off the field as a human being not just as a player. I don't understand what kind of freedom they want here. The club pays them millions upon millions and they want the players to keep the club's name respectful. Do the players want to make millions and then just go and create trouble around the city...etc. This is the same in every profession = if you do something stupid outside of work, it might very well cost you at your job (depending on what that is).

4.The club pays for the players to be fit. The club has their own doctors and approved medics. They pay millions. So it's only right that they have their trusted medics to perform care on the players that they pay millions to in order to be able to play. I don't see the point in this demand. On top of that, the players want the clubs to pay for everything yet be able to choose their own doctors. Come on, the clubs have some of the best medics in the world working for them anyway. Just be reasonable.

7. This probable is tied to the Pandev case (and many others that we are not aware of) where he was excluded from the group for 6 months and trained on his own because he didn't want to sign an extension.
But again, the players are taking this way too far. The club pays the money and gives you the contract. They want success and they should be able to prepare for that success in any way that they think is good. Splitting the groups, not splitting the groups. Whatever it is (physical or psychological issues.....or bad influence on the group, etc.). Any company in the world is able to do this in their own way. Nowhere does it say that a player must play with the group or in the game. Is it right? Maybe not, but you can't possibly standardize everything.

So basically, if the players want to be able to reject clubs (demand 8) then why aren't the clubs able to split players who won't sign contracts. Basically what players are saying in #8 is that the club gives them a 4 yr contract (example) and the players don't have to leave anywhere until that runs out. In other words saying to the clubs, "I don't want to go anywhere. It's not my problem that you signed a 4 year contract with me." So that is absolutely right. But therefore I don't see how you can counter the group thing in #7 because it is the same and the clubs can say, "For the benefit of the group I will split you from it because of the dispute. You have a contract with me that you get millions from. What were you thinking when you signed this contract and now you want to leave to go play elsewhere before it's over."

Pretty much both 7 and 8 sound wrong, but they are in a way connected to each other. And as current things work....depending on the situation both these things can hurt the player or the club (again, depending on what the situation is).

Sorry for the long post. I'm just irritated with some of these "demands". I feel like these players forgot the days when they were dreaming to be footballers. Now they are there, and making more money in a year then most people make in a lifetime (most working extremely hard jobs for 10/12 + hours) and yet the demand these ridiculous things. I understand that human rights are an issue here......but come oonn....you gotta give some rights to the companies that pay you millions and millions and millions for playing football.

hwmook · 11-09-2010, 10:31

Other than point 8, the players have no rights to complain. Even for point 8, i can see the reasoning behind it so.......really the strike is stupid IMO.

Kaka1899 · 11-09-2010, 11:21

not worthy of its own thread but something about Leo

Quote:

Former Milan Coach Leonardo has confirmed he’s taking a year out in order to work for English television.

He had been linked with the job of Brazil manager, while there were also offers from Flamengo and Serie A side Bologna.

“Football has given me so much. This year I want to have a different experience,” he told journalists as he received the Il Torrazzo award.

“I will go to England in order to work in television and I’ll study.

“However, next season I could make an important choice.”

Leonardo walked away from Milan after one year at the helm, having taken the team to third place in Serie A.

The Brazilian, who speaks five languages fluently, has already worked as a pundit for the BBC.

Aficio · 11-09-2010, 11:35

Good luck, Leo.

Udinese equalized 1:1 against Inter. A heading from corner.

I didn't watch Inter's goal from Lucio, maybe same as Udi's

Udi defend with confidence & calm. How will Inter break it?

ACMILAN1983 · 11-09-2010, 12:28

hmm...the demands of AIC are very mixed imo. I've put my thoughts against each point in the quote.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gio-mania

At first it seemed very funny too. It sort of pissed me off; these guys are the last ones who should be going on strike. But having looked at the proposed contract, the players aren't 100% wrong…

1. WAGES
Clubs want: Flexible contract, tied to results
AIC* wants: Only up to 50% variable

Thought: Whilst both parties have their points, this is something that must be agreed at the time a contract is drawn imo, not something that can be generalized in a rule.

2. EXCLUSIVE
Lega Calcio: Players can be exclusively players.
AIC: players should be free to do what they want when they dont work

Thought: Not sure what Lega Calcio wants here. Players should be free in their own time, but are responsible for their own behaviour as with any other profession. If this means players shouldn't contact other clubs when in contract, then this should be in the contract.

3. BEHAVIOR
Lega: Strict behavior code even off the field
AIC: total freedom off the field

Thought: Same as in point 2.

4. MEDICAL TREATMENT
Clubs: Only from club specialists.
AIC: freedom to choose, making the clubs pay.

Thought: agree with clubs. If players want to go see their own private specialists, it should be out of their own pocket.

5. SANCTIONS
Clubs: Automatic incase of absence
AIC: To be decided on occasion by the the referee board

Thought: It's up to the clubs to sort out internal discipline, not the referee board.

6. REFEREES
Lega: reform the board, with a president external to football
AIC: no change.

Thought: Agree with Lega. Referees are a mess in football and having an external structure outside of football makes it more difficult for foul play.

7. PREPARATION
Lega: The manager/coach can decide to separate players into different training groups
AIC: keep an only group

Thought: Agree with Lega, managers and coaches decide on how they train the team.

8. REJECTIONS
Lega: A player cannot reject a transfer to a club of the same quality and with guaranteed money. If he refuses, the contract will be resolved with 50%
of the salary being paid, and the player is free to sign with whom he pleases.
AIC: no change.

Thought: Agree with AIC. No player (or person for that matter) should be forced into decisions of their career. If they have a contract that the club has agreed to, then it's the club's fault for agreeing if they no longer desire to uphold it.

Rabia15 · 12-09-2010, 07:17

Lets be a little pessimistic here, According to my opinion what Milan needs;

1-World Class CB, considering Nesta's injury problems and other alternatives, we should have signed a world class CB instead of signing both Yepes and Papa for instance, 1 player instead 2 would be better for us.

2-World Class Right wing back, we dont have world class wing back for there, Bonera, he is even not solid defensively, Abate just a good runner, he adds dynamism nothing more, Papa, he is not ideal RB for there, Oddo? Zambrotta? we have many players who can play there yet we dont have solid wing back.

3-2 way midfielders, Seedorf is missed for instance, cuz he is effective in further area and he covers many ground, he adds something different to us other than the rest of midfielders. Pirlo is good with long balls, yet without this kind of players and quality wing back, he is too predictable. Ambro covers many ground, he is good yet he is soft on tackling, he is not a Gattuso, though he is better passer and moves a lot. its not enough. Gattuso in this system he cant do much, though he is trying hard. Flamini and Boateng always considered in second place. Flamini and Boateng can add more than Ambro and Gattuso, Flamini defensively better than Ambro, he is good passer, moves well, his shooting is good though he tries so much. Play 1vs 3-4 with Ambrosini, i doubt he can tackle the ball with this soft game, slow and he stays far away from the player, he should have closed his angle, yet Ambro always let them cross or pass. Flamini is harder so i think he should play.

We need one 2 way midfielder there as well, considering Seedorf is not getting younger, a player who can win games offensively and effective in furhter area and someone who can track back as well.

Then, We should have kept one of Borriello or Huntelaar. We need our Julio Cruz. inzaghi is not enough.

bijon · 12-09-2010, 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rabia15

Lets be a little pessimistic here, According to my opinion what Milan needs;

1-World Class CB, considering Nesta's injury problems and other alternatives, we should have signed a world class CB instead of signing both Yepes and Papa for instance, 1 player instead 2 would be better for us.

2-World Class Right wing back, we dont have world class wing back for there, Bonera, he is even not solid defensively, Abate just a good runner, he adds dynamism nothing more, Papa, he is not ideal RB for there, Oddo? Zambrotta? we have many players who can play there yet we dont have solid wing back.

3-2 way midfielders, Seedorf is missed for instance, cuz he is effective in further area and he covers many ground, he adds something different to us other than the rest of midfielders. Pirlo is good with long balls, yet without this kind of players and quality wing back, he is too predictable. Ambro covers many ground, he is good yet he is soft on tackling, he is not a Gattuso, though he is better passer and moves a lot. its not enough. Gattuso in this system he cant do much, though he is trying hard. Flamini and Boateng always considered in second place. Flamini and Boateng can add more than Ambro and Gattuso, Flamini defensively better than Ambro, he is good passer, moves well, his shooting is good though he tries so much. Play 1vs 3-4 with Ambrosini, i doubt he can tackle the ball with this soft game, slow and he stays far away from the player, he should have closed his angle, yet Ambro always let them cross or pass. Flamini is harder so i think he should play.

We need one 2 way midfielder there as well, considering Seedorf is not getting younger, a player who can win games offensively and effective in furhter area and someone who can track back as well.

Then, We should have kept one of Borriello or Huntelaar. We need our Julio Cruz. inzaghi is not enough.

I second this motion. what is needed is two quality all round box to box players on either side of Pirlo and a RWB capable of crossing and defending well.

sheva-gila · 12-09-2010, 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by bijon

I second this motion. what is needed is two quality all round box to box players on either side of Pirlo and a RWB capable of crossing and defending well.

since carleto has gone you can forget a box to box player in our system of playing

nefremo · 12-09-2010, 22:48

By the way....Giovinco, again the source for Parma. Scored from a free kick from about 25m out. Also hit the post from a free kick. Last week he was probably the man of the match for them and had an assist and numerous other dangerous opportunities created by him.

Juventus are really idiots for letting him go like that and treating him the way they did. I know that he is co-owned (or loaned with the option of a co-ownership/purchase ???....not sure) with Parma, but I'm not so sure that he'll want to go back to Juve after saying that they treated him like crap and never believed in him. If he keeps this up the whole season, I'm sure there will be many clubs knocking on the door for him. And I hope Milan will be one of them.

Kaka1899 · 13-09-2010, 14:58

Serie A wages revealed

http://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/07-09-...55134426.shtml

GeoTav · 13-09-2010, 19:43

A rumour we're probably going to have to follow for months ...

It was revealed that Cassano has a 20M clause on his contract. That means he can leave where he wants as long as clubs offer 20M to Sampdoria. It seems this kind of option isn't active during the season but only at the end.

Juventus is reported to be the club being the most interested, but on TMW, you can now read that Milan will try to get Cassano if there is no new agreement between the club and Ronaldinho before January (so we would keep Ronaldinho until June, we would let him leave for free, and with the money we would save from his wages, we would be able to easily pay the 20M for Cassano).

I have a mixed feeling about that: the Cassano of nowadays is worth being in Milan, he has the required level, but there's something in this player that makes me hope he won't be a Milan player. I'm unable to say what.

Link: http://www.tuttomercatoweb.com/milan...d&idtmw=229137

nefremo · 13-09-2010, 22:33

I'm with you on that Geo. I don't want Cassano in Milan....and just like you I don't really have a reason or i simply can't describe it. Don't know what it is about him (maybe his past) that makes me not want him here.

Regardless of all that though he is a great player. One that can turn the game. He was great against Juve over the weekend. Trouble whenever he touched the ball. It bothers me though that talents like him can be real lazy at times and want everything on a platter for them.

Anyhow, I think that we should keep Dinho here beyond his contract. Of course, as long as his demands fit within Milan's offers and capabilities. We should definitely try to keep "the 4" together.....unless it all somehow goes terribly wrong with the egos. Galli worked in the market this summer, and now if we can keep "the 4" here, we should be set in that department for a few years to come. Which should allow us to calmly work on improving other departments. I don't view Cassano as a necessity after the arivals of Ibra and Robinho. I just don't see the point of splashing out 20mil on something that we already have in the team. I would rather see that money spent on a CM/ACM to take over for Seedorf and/or a fullback.

And if Ronaldinho does actually leave, I would still be against the idea of Cassano replacing him. I would much rather go for Ganso, who obviously would not be a like-for-like replacement since he plays at a different position then Dinho....but that's completely fine. or better yet....just get Ganso anyway.

MilanMikey · 13-09-2010, 22:39

we need a fb more then anything r midfield can hang on this year.. my dream would be to finish the squad buy poli or marcelo

mrki · 14-09-2010, 02:56

I adore Cassano as a player! My big YES to this...

Aldough, Id rather take the money and use it on a FULLBACK.

Jay Crisp · 14-09-2010, 03:18

Yep I'd prefer a quality RB or LB and move Antonini to the right and maybe a Poli type player 8-10 million and 10 million on said left or right back , thats presuming that we would spunk 20 million on Cassano.

11-09-2010, 09:55	#31
nefremo Registered User Join Date: 03 2001 Location: USA; Macedonia Fave Players: All Milan players!	Like Reza said, demands 3,4 and 7 are ridiculous. 3.Behavior should be expected on and off the field as a human being not just as a player. I don't understand what kind of freedom they want here. The club pays them millions upon millions and they want the players to keep the club's name respectful. Do the players want to make millions and then just go and create trouble around the city...etc. This is the same in every profession = if you do something stupid outside of work, it might very well cost you at your job (depending on what that is). 4.The club pays for the players to be fit. The club has their own doctors and approved medics. They pay millions. So it's only right that they have their trusted medics to perform care on the players that they pay millions to in order to be able to play. I don't see the point in this demand. On top of that, the players want the clubs to pay for everything yet be able to choose their own doctors. Come on, the clubs have some of the best medics in the world working for them anyway. Just be reasonable. 7. This probable is tied to the Pandev case (and many others that we are not aware of) where he was excluded from the group for 6 months and trained on his own because he didn't want to sign an extension. But again, the players are taking this way too far. The club pays the money and gives you the contract. They want success and they should be able to prepare for that success in any way that they think is good. Splitting the groups, not splitting the groups. Whatever it is (physical or psychological issues.....or bad influence on the group, etc.). Any company in the world is able to do this in their own way. Nowhere does it say that a player must play with the group or in the game. Is it right? Maybe not, but you can't possibly standardize everything. So basically, if the players want to be able to reject clubs (demand 8) then why aren't the clubs able to split players who won't sign contracts. Basically what players are saying in #8 is that the club gives them a 4 yr contract (example) and the players don't have to leave anywhere until that runs out. In other words saying to the clubs, "I don't want to go anywhere. It's not my problem that you signed a 4 year contract with me." So that is absolutely right. But therefore I don't see how you can counter the group thing in #7 because it is the same and the clubs can say, "For the benefit of the group I will split you from it because of the dispute. You have a contract with me that you get millions from. What were you thinking when you signed this contract and now you want to leave to go play elsewhere before it's over." Pretty much both 7 and 8 sound wrong, but they are in a way connected to each other. And as current things work....depending on the situation both these things can hurt the player or the club (again, depending on what the situation is). Sorry for the long post. I'm just irritated with some of these "demands". I feel like these players forgot the days when they were dreaming to be footballers. Now they are there, and making more money in a year then most people make in a lifetime (most working extremely hard jobs for 10/12 + hours) and yet the demand these ridiculous things. I understand that human rights are an issue here......but come oonn....you gotta give some rights to the companies that pay you millions and millions and millions for playing football. __________________ MILAN FOREVER! Last edited by nefremo; 11-09-2010 at 09:58.

12-09-2010, 22:48	#39
nefremo Registered User Join Date: 03 2001 Location: USA; Macedonia Fave Players: All Milan players!	By the way....Giovinco, again the source for Parma. Scored from a free kick from about 25m out. Also hit the post from a free kick. Last week he was probably the man of the match for them and had an assist and numerous other dangerous opportunities created by him. Juventus are really idiots for letting him go like that and treating him the way they did. I know that he is co-owned (or loaned with the option of a co-ownership/purchase ???....not sure) with Parma, but I'm not so sure that he'll want to go back to Juve after saying that they treated him like crap and never believed in him. If he keeps this up the whole season, I'm sure there will be many clubs knocking on the door for him. And I hope Milan will be one of them. __________________ MILAN FOREVER! Last edited by nefremo; 12-09-2010 at 22:55.

13-09-2010, 14:58	#40
Kaka1899 Registered User Join Date: 08 2005 Location: La terra della bella gente Fave Players: Kakà, Andrea Pirlo and Paolo Maldini	Serie A wages revealed http://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/07-09-...55134426.shtml __________________ ALWAYS ROSSO ALWAYS NERO ALWAYS A ROSSONERO San Paolo 600 Serie A Appearances Living Legend Grazie Paolo! Heroes Are Remembered Legends Live Forever San Paolo

13-09-2010, 19:43	#41
GeoTav Registered User Join Date: 02 2008 Location: Dunkerque (France) Fave Players: Almost all AC Milan players	A rumour we're probably going to have to follow for months ... It was revealed that Cassano has a 20M clause on his contract. That means he can leave where he wants as long as clubs offer 20M to Sampdoria. It seems this kind of option isn't active during the season but only at the end. Juventus is reported to be the club being the most interested, but on TMW, you can now read that Milan will try to get Cassano if there is no new agreement between the club and Ronaldinho before January (so we would keep Ronaldinho until June, we would let him leave for free, and with the money we would save from his wages, we would be able to easily pay the 20M for Cassano). I have a mixed feeling about that: the Cassano of nowadays is worth being in Milan, he has the required level, but there's something in this player that makes me hope he won't be a Milan player. I'm unable to say what. Link: http://www.tuttomercatoweb.com/milan...d&idtmw=229137 __________________ One should not speak ill of the dead. So we should stop bashing Juventus ... Serie A Fantasy League The topic on MM The avatar to use by MM members

13-09-2010, 22:33	#42
nefremo Registered User Join Date: 03 2001 Location: USA; Macedonia Fave Players: All Milan players!	I'm with you on that Geo. I don't want Cassano in Milan....and just like you I don't really have a reason or i simply can't describe it. Don't know what it is about him (maybe his past) that makes me not want him here. Regardless of all that though he is a great player. One that can turn the game. He was great against Juve over the weekend. Trouble whenever he touched the ball. It bothers me though that talents like him can be real lazy at times and want everything on a platter for them. Anyhow, I think that we should keep Dinho here beyond his contract. Of course, as long as his demands fit within Milan's offers and capabilities. We should definitely try to keep "the 4" together.....unless it all somehow goes terribly wrong with the egos. Galli worked in the market this summer, and now if we can keep "the 4" here, we should be set in that department for a few years to come. Which should allow us to calmly work on improving other departments. I don't view Cassano as a necessity after the arivals of Ibra and Robinho. I just don't see the point of splashing out 20mil on something that we already have in the team. I would rather see that money spent on a CM/ACM to take over for Seedorf and/or a fullback. And if Ronaldinho does actually leave, I would still be against the idea of Cassano replacing him. I would much rather go for Ganso, who obviously would not be a like-for-like replacement since he plays at a different position then Dinho....but that's completely fine. or better yet....just get Ganso anyway. __________________ MILAN FOREVER!

11-09-2010, 10:31	#32
hwmook Registered User Join Date: 05 2003 Location: singapore Fave Players: maldini/gattuso/shev	Other than point 8, the players have no rights to complain. Even for point 8, i can see the reasoning behind it so.......really the strike is stupid IMO.

11-09-2010, 11:35	#34
Aficio Registered User Join Date: 11 2006 Fave Players: Maradona & Paolo Maldini	Good luck, Leo. Udinese equalized 1:1 against Inter. A heading from corner. I didn't watch Inter's goal from Lucio, maybe same as Udi's Udi defend with confidence & calm. How will Inter break it?

12-09-2010, 07:17	#36
Rabia15 Registered User Join Date: 08 2009	Lets be a little pessimistic here, According to my opinion what Milan needs; 1-World Class CB, considering Nesta's injury problems and other alternatives, we should have signed a world class CB instead of signing both Yepes and Papa for instance, 1 player instead 2 would be better for us. 2-World Class Right wing back, we dont have world class wing back for there, Bonera, he is even not solid defensively, Abate just a good runner, he adds dynamism nothing more, Papa, he is not ideal RB for there, Oddo? Zambrotta? we have many players who can play there yet we dont have solid wing back. 3-2 way midfielders, Seedorf is missed for instance, cuz he is effective in further area and he covers many ground, he adds something different to us other than the rest of midfielders. Pirlo is good with long balls, yet without this kind of players and quality wing back, he is too predictable. Ambro covers many ground, he is good yet he is soft on tackling, he is not a Gattuso, though he is better passer and moves a lot. its not enough. Gattuso in this system he cant do much, though he is trying hard. Flamini and Boateng always considered in second place. Flamini and Boateng can add more than Ambro and Gattuso, Flamini defensively better than Ambro, he is good passer, moves well, his shooting is good though he tries so much. Play 1vs 3-4 with Ambrosini, i doubt he can tackle the ball with this soft game, slow and he stays far away from the player, he should have closed his angle, yet Ambro always let them cross or pass. Flamini is harder so i think he should play. We need one 2 way midfielder there as well, considering Seedorf is not getting younger, a player who can win games offensively and effective in furhter area and someone who can track back as well. Then, We should have kept one of Borriello or Huntelaar. We need our Julio Cruz. inzaghi is not enough.

13-09-2010, 22:39	#43
MilanMikey Registered User Join Date: 02 2010 Location: Toronto Fave Players: Rivaldo,Ronaldinho,Pirlo	we need a fb more then anything r midfield can hang on this year.. my dream would be to finish the squad buy poli or marcelo

14-09-2010, 02:56	#44
mrki Registered User Join Date: 04 2005 Location: Croatia Fave Players: Maldini, Boban, Inzaghi	I adore Cassano as a player! My big YES to this... Aldough, Id rather take the money and use it on a FULLBACK. __________________ "Where others have succeeded, I have always failed..." Jacques Clouseau

14-09-2010, 03:18	#45
Jay Crisp Registered User Join Date: 06 2009 Location: Cork , Ireland Fave Players: Maldini , Boban , Van Basten , Pato , Albertini ,	Yep I'd prefer a quality RB or LB and move Antonini to the right and maybe a Poli type player 8-10 million and 10 million on said left or right back , thats presuming that we would spunk 20 million on Cassano. __________________ Somwhere in the world a woman gives birth every 90 seconds , she must be found and stopped.