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I must say I've never understood what was the hype with Alex. I never liked him, he always seemed clumsy and in the wrong place. Even back from his PSV days when fellow MM members hyped him like hes the next Maldini, I never saw anything great in him.
(07-17-2015, 04:14 PM)WCmilan Wrote: [ -> ]Mihajlovic is our best signing IMO. Regardless of whether we finish putting together a complete team of superstars, he will make the biggest difference.. Other than Ibra. 30m is too much for Romagnoli, I wouldn't even pay 25. 15 max, he's no Laporte from what I've seen I'm sorry. He'll probably end out a Bonucci level defender, which is worth 15m in his prime. I don't see him being the next Nesta,Silva, or any of the likes tbh.

It is early, but idk, I have a thing with Italian players in this generation. Apart from Verratti, our national team is not producing anywhere near what they used to. Everyone flops.. Immobile,Borini,Destro,Balotelli, we are almost becoming like England and their players, where they are all hyped, overpaid for in EPL and then flop. Being Italian, I worry about our NT tbh, now that Pirlo and Buffon are close to the end, and players like Chiellini,Marchisio,De Rossi are not getting any younger.

That's where Italian clubs importance come.
for instead of letting players such as Veratti, ELS and others go to France/Spain and flourish, they must let the youngsters take their
chances and prove themselves within Italian clubs.

every single one of the 2006 world cup winning team were Serie A superstars and back then Serie A was the best League.

Agree, Romangoli might not be the next big thing, but he surely deserves a chance to prove himself with a big club.
(07-17-2015, 04:48 PM)Stitch Wrote: [ -> ]I must say I've never understood what was the hype with Alex. I never liked him, he always seemed clumsy and in the wrong place. Even back from his PSV days when fellow MM members hyped him like hes the next Maldini, I never saw anything great in him.

Same here. And now he's also old and slow...
(07-17-2015, 05:22 PM)Ace Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-17-2015, 04:14 PM)WCmilan Wrote: [ -> ]Mihajlovic is our best signing IMO. Regardless of whether we finish putting together a complete team of superstars, he will make the biggest difference.. Other than Ibra. 30m is too much for Romagnoli, I wouldn't even pay 25. 15 max, he's no Laporte from what I've seen I'm sorry. He'll probably end out a Bonucci level defender, which is worth 15m in his prime. I don't see him being the next Nesta,Silva, or any of the likes tbh.

It is early, but idk, I have a thing with Italian players in this generation. Apart from Verratti, our national team is not producing anywhere near what they used to. Everyone flops.. Immobile,Borini,Destro,Balotelli, we are almost becoming like England and their players, where they are all hyped, overpaid for in EPL and then flop. Being Italian, I worry about our NT tbh, now that Pirlo and Buffon are close to the end, and players like Chiellini,Marchisio,De Rossi are not getting any younger.

That's where Italian clubs importance come.
for instead of letting players such as Veratti, ELS and others go to France/Spain and flourish, they must let the youngsters take their
chances and prove themselves within Italian clubs.

every single one of the 2006 world cup winning team were Serie A superstars and back then Serie A was the best League.

Agree, Romangoli might not be the next big thing, but he surely deserves a chance to prove himself with a big club.

If you think about it though, the Italian 2006 generation had proved themselves at a time when the quality in Serie A was higher than it is now. They were literally competing against the best players in the world, and still managed to become superstars themselves.
It might actually be that Serie A's drop in quality has negatively affected the growth of the best young talents. Think about Milan 10 years ago. Players like El Shaarawy and De Sciglio would have had absolutely no chance of establishing themselves as part of the first team unless they were able to learn from and perform at the same level as the truly world class players that we had back then.

A lot of young players will fail a challenge like that and end up playing for mid-table teams in Serie A, but I think the most talented of them will work really hard to improve their game, and they will eventually reach that level. Imagine if De Sciglio was competing with and learning from defenders like Cafu, Nesta, Jaap Stam, Maldini etc., rather than Abate, Mexes, Zapata and so on. I think he would have been a much, much better player today.

For this reason I think it's good to see Italian clubs spending money on talented foreign players this summer. As I see it, this is the best way to raise the level of the most talented Italian players as well.
(07-17-2015, 01:27 PM)somedevil Wrote: [ -> ]Zapata was actually pretty good in his Udinese days and when he signed for Milan i was actually excited. The only reason I am not sure about ALex is coz of his injuries but I somehow feel confident that with Mihajlovic, Palletta will excel.

Zapata was good at Udinese, I think many considered him a future star. He never lived up to the hype, but I don't think he's a bad defender when in a relatively decent side. I'm concerned about Alex remaining fit too, but let's see. On Paletta, tbh the guy's not bad, but he's so slow, which is a worry both when facing pace, but also because we look likely to play a higher line this season.

(07-17-2015, 04:48 PM)Stitch Wrote: [ -> ]I must say I've never understood what was the hype with Alex. I never liked him, he always seemed clumsy and in the wrong place. Even back from his PSV days when fellow MM members hyped him like hes the next Maldini, I never saw anything great in him.

Alex's positioning was never particularly bad imo. He's not as good as others were, but he's always played at the highest level. I think his strengths are his physical strength, he's actually quite quick for his size (less so at his age today), he's very strong in the air and he's a good man marker (such as the times he marked Sheva out of games when at PSV). He's competent on the ball, though not particularly great.

Btw, I never thought he'd reach Maldini's quality as a defender, I've always seen him to be a very good option, but never world class.

(07-17-2015, 04:14 PM)WCmilan Wrote: [ -> ]Mihajlovic is our best signing IMO. Regardless of whether we finish putting together a complete team of superstars, he will make the biggest difference.. Other than Ibra. 30m is too much for Romagnoli, I wouldn't even pay 25. 15 max, he's no Laporte from what I've seen I'm sorry. He'll probably end out a Bonucci level defender, which is worth 15m in his prime. I don't see him being the next Nesta,Silva, or any of the likes tbh.

It is early, but idk, I have a thing with Italian players in this generation. Apart from Verratti, our national team is not producing anywhere near what they used to. Everyone flops.. Immobile,Borini,Destro,Balotelli, we are almost becoming like England and their players, where they are all hyped, overpaid for in EPL and then flop. Being Italian, I worry about our NT tbh, now that Pirlo and Buffon are close to the end, and players like Chiellini,Marchisio,De Rossi are not getting any younger.

Not sure I really agree with your points here.

On Mihajlovic, I'm hopeful he'll turn out good and the early signs have been positive. However, at this point his work is completely up for judgement. This guy's not been a sure thing in his managerial career.

On Romagnoli, I don't think you'd get many quality defenders for 15m in today's market. Not to say I disagree with you on his value, I think 15m is more than fair, but with inflation of the market and particularly Milan's market, it's not overly surprising what the numbers being listed are. On saying he's no Laporte, I really don't think there's a significant difference in quality between the two. They're around the same age (actually Laporte is almost a year older, which is a difference at that age), both have broken through in the last couple of years and have put in good performances at the top level. For me, Laporte's ability on the ball, or rather his ability to direct play from the back, is what gives him the edge, but Romagnoli is no slouch on the ball.

Thing is, if Romagnoli is worth 15m, then imo Laporte isn't worth any more than around 20m at most. Fact is, the price rises because Bilbao don't seem prepared to accept anything but the buyout clause for Laporte (50m). It's similar for Romagnoli, Roma want 30m and until now have been very difficult to negotiate with. Fact is, regardless of who we get, if we want a young quality defender, it's going to cost a lot to get anyone. Even Maksimovic at this point looks difficult to get for less than 20m.

About the "Bonucci level defender", I think Romagnoli has the potential to surpass Bonucci. That said, I really rate Bonucci, who I'd say is probably in the top 2 Italian defenders right now (Chiellini being the other) and I'd probably argue he's one of the top 10 CBs in the world right now. He's a good defender, one with a strong personality, in his prime and has excellent passing qualities, able to play the ball out from the back. I've rated him a long time from his Bari days and I don't see how he can be valued at 15m, I'd say he'd be valued at around 25m in today's market, not even factoring in inflation.

On the Italian players succeeding I think a lot of it comes down to how these players have been developed. I have said numerous times in recent years that in Italy there wasn't a culture to trust and give opportunities to young Italians. If a player doesn't get regular opportunities at the top level, how are they going to get better? Verratti's a perfect example of this, he went to PSG and was given the keys to the midfield. If he'd stayed in Italy, does anyone think he'd be the player he is today? If he'd come to Milan of the past 5 years, we'd probably be talking about a player that's either had injuries destroying his career or a player that's been sold on and probably lost in the lower leagues or at best a lower level Serie A team.

However, the problem is also the fault of the players themselves imo. Those being developed are of good quality, that's evident in the fact that a lot of the Italian youth teams still generally perform to decent levels and you see them competing with other nations. However, for whatever reason, these players seem to lose focus, become arrogant or lose themselves to the flash lifestyle a lot of money can bring. This isn't new, it was something guys like Borriello were known for.

I do think there's a change coming though in the last year or so that will hopefully cultivate into growth for Italian football again. In Italy we're seeing more teams use young Italian players than previous years. With the successes of teams like Sassuolo, Empoli, Sampdoria and Carpi I think a lot of teams will see the benefits and potential gain from trusting young Italians to play at the top level. Not just that though, Juve returning to the top also benefits this, because they traditionally always trust Italian players and that's not different today. Milan could also play a massive role in this too, as this year the club has a group of relatively young Italians in the squad and if they have a successful year (top 3), then it's a big boost for the national team and the Italian players in general.

I suspect, and might be totally wrong on this, that there is a mental shift coming with the young Italians too. As the previous generation screwed up and lost focus from football, the general feeling I get is that Italian footballers can't lead the celebrity lifestyle so much today, because if they do, you know fans and the general public won't appreciate it as there's no success to fall back on.
Still no word on Romagnoli. The pervious bids were rejected very quickly. I think Roma is waiting to see how everything in England plays out with Dzeko, Salah, etc. I think there are three options for them. Sell him outside of Italy (assuming interest is real from Chelsea and Arsenal); include him in the Salah deal; sell him to us! NOT selling him I think isn't an option at this point. They are openly looking for attackers and they have limited funds. They COULD possibly get Salah on a cheap loan sort of deal, but that's still not the striker they've been looking for. So they have to sell to get that striker (Dzeko) but are having trouble doing that. It seems like they'll give Destro to Viola for cheap or maybe even a loan, so that won't bring funds in. I think we are sitting pretty and unless Chelsea or Arsenal make a crazy offer I think we'll get him. I think the reason why everything is so quiet is because Sabatini has told Galliani to wait so he can do business in England. I don't think this last €25mil offer is rejected, I think it's on hold.

It'll be a domino effect and a few players will end up moving clubs all together.
Prediction.....Salah and Dzeko to Roma; Gomez out of Fiorentina - Destro to Fiorentina; Romagnoli to Milan. All in all, we will spend 25mil on Romagnoli, Roma will spend 30-35 for both Dzeko and Salah; Fiorentina will get Destro on loan + option/obligation; Gomez out of Italy (Besiktas,Bundesliga).
This romagnoli business has me very concerned. He's not the type of player we can gamble on at this point. 25-30mm for what? He's inexperienced. We need an established player for that money. The high price tag comes NOT for what he is, but what he COULD be. Better said, the high price is based on his potential.

A few years ago, Zapata and Alex were players we all salivated for. "The next Nesta". Well we have them both now and what do we have to show for it?

If we had two established CBs, then by all means spend the money on him. But spending the cash on "potential" is not wise, considering what's at stake. WE NEED TO GET TOP THREE FOR CL! We need players now, and I think our wallet is thin at this point.

Just my opinion.
I understand what you are saying...we DO need players now. But who's to say that Romagnoli won't perform NOW.

The fact that we are willing to pay this kind of money for a 20 yr old I think says a lot. It means that we have done our homework, so let's trust our scouts for once.

The problem with what you are saying (I actually agree with you) is that we can no longer sign class CBs in their prime like we did with Nesta. We can't sign Ramos now for example. Or even someone younger like Varane that hasn't hit his prime yet. The only established CBs we can sign are the types of Alex and Zapata like you mentioned. And exactly, look how that's turned out......although we signed both abut late, they never lived up to the hype. I'd rather splash money on someone like Romagnoli right now. Sure it may not work out, but the benefits if it does are huge. I just don't see what established CB we can get right now with this money. The other names in circulation are the likes of Maksimovic and Savic....and they are just as much of a gamble as Romagnoli. Sure they are cheaper and have another year or two of extra experience, but I think the potential that Mihajlovic and the management see in Romagnoli is what has him at the top of the list.

Ideally, we would buy Romagnoli + someone alongside him with a lot of experience that is top class. I don't think that'll happen. But I also think people underrate Paletta quite a bit. I think he is a very very solid CB and just as good as Maksimovic or Savic imo. As a matter of fact, these guys are exactly the type of players that fans want so bad only to look back a few years later and laugh at it. (Kind of like you mentioned with Zapata and Alex.)

The fact of the matter is that it's impossible to say how players will turn out. It's exactly the same argument that you brought up that is the reason for Verratti playing in PSG now. Nobody wanted to pay 12.5mil because he was a gamble. Teams like Juventus and Milan wanted players that will perform NOW. I Know that it's easy to speak now as we all know how that turned out....but the act of the matter is you have to take gambles and trust your scouts that you pay big money to. I would hate for another Verratti case to happen with Romagnoli. It's impossible to say now, but you have to gamble and trust the scouts.
[undefined=undefined]Nobody wanted to pay 12.5mil because he was a gamble. Teams like Juventus and Milan wanted players that will perform NOW[/undefined]

Milan wanted players that will perform now? Braida is the person who offered Verratti to PSG. Milan didn't have money to sign Verratti at that time. i don't even remember the last time when Milan has spent double figures on a midfield except Bertoacci. We also overpayed him too much.

Milan should have signed Miranda, Miranda and Romagnoli partnership would be good. i don't rate Paletta much, he is slow and always will be a problem for Milan in high line.

Milan is a team which can't develop young players, unlike Juve. Milan has a defence which lacks coordination and organization, this is why Romagnoli will fail here.
Our team is not enough for top 3 even if we sign Romagnoli. Romagnoli and Bertolacci won't be enough to fix the defence and midfield. im expecting a 5th-8th next season. Anyone who expects more, are dreamers.

My post from last summer(we didn't sign D.Lopez at that time)


''-GK We signed one of the worst Gk's in Serie A. in the last 2-3 season showed us that we cant rely on Abbiati who is not a solid Gk anymore)
-2 Wing backs(Considering De Sciglio's injuries and he didnt improve his offensive game too)
-Fast and ball playing CB, who can lead the defence. Alex and Rami are smilar typee of defenders, i dont know how they will co-exist.
-2 way midfielder, since Montolivo is injured, we need 2 this kind of players.
-Striker problem?
-El Shaarwy sub? if he is injured again, who'll replace him?
-First choice RWF? Menez is good player and howver he is too inconsistent. We cant rely on him full season, he is good as rotation player.

i dont have any hope for next season. i expect 7th-11th in Serie A.''