Summer mercato 2009

IMHO it helps. Every one can have off-day, and I think the Curva in SS understand that clearly. But what annoys them is that it happens every so often. That's what happened to Gila last year, and to Seedorf last week.

You can't find any bigger source of motivation than what you can find in yourself. Paolo is the perfect example. I don't remember exactly who, but I read somewhere that a Milan player said that he admired that Paolo show the enthusiasm of a teenager every day in the training session. Can you imagine that? Please take some time to think before you nod, my friend. In the training session, after all these years!

Now, some player may say that he's motivated enough even after winning 4 UCLs with 3 different clubs. And since we don't have the chance to watch the training, the only place where he can prove it on the field! Seeing is believing, and from what I see, I don't buy it, not a bit!

Originally Posted by Ceceves

Fans always have expectations that border on what's possible for their team - it's the same for all clubs, and it shouldn't be a hindrance to the management or the team. If anything the fans should spur the club to performing better and staying focused on the job at hand. If people at the club can't handle the fans, then they aren't cut out for being in a competitive club (if that's what we are these days ).

Nalx got a good point:
- the fans want trophies (on MM: no result = sack Carlo and Galliani or even sell the club)
- the fans want young players (on MM: look at Arsenal, they have so many very good young players)
- the fans want star players (on MM: look at Inter or Barcelona, they bought "this" player)

Last year was horrible, this year is averagely good (could be a lot better), if we sack Carlo at the next bad result ... what will happen ? We find the best coach in the world (the one that noone knows yet) and thanks to him, we win all the games we have to play to end on the first or second place of Serie A. Or we take the bad coach or, other solution, our players don't like the fact that Carlo is fired, and we lose many games to finish ... 5th again at the end.

If you take the example of the young players, Arsenal didn't win any major trophy since they started their "let's sell the experienced players at a high price and let's buy cheap young talented players" strategy. So if we have a young team, people will bash our management for the previous reason (no result whereas they have had what they wanted: plenty young talented players).

And if you take the other example, the clubs with many stars ... so people want us to spend 100M in one single mercato. If we fail (like Real Madrid and even like Inter in CL), so the fans will ask for new young players and a better coach ...

So the fans have always something to protest against ...

PS: Of course, this post has to be taken ... in a funny way, there is no personal attack !!

Originally Posted by GeoTav

Last year was horrible, this year is averagely good (could be a lot better), if we sack Carlo at the next bad result ... what will happen ? We find the best coach in the world (the one that noone knows yet) and thanks to him, we win all the games we have to play to end on the first or second place of Serie A. Or we take the bad coach or, other solution, our players don't like the fact that Carlo is fired, and we lose many games to finish ... 5th again at the end.

If you take the example of the young players, Arsenal didn't win any major trophy since they started their "let's sell the experienced players at a high price and let's buy cheap young talented players" strategy. So if we have a young team, people will bash our management for the previous reason (no result whereas they have had what they wanted: plenty young talented players).

And if you take the other example, the clubs with many stars ... so people want us to spend 100M in one single mercato. If we fail (like Real Madrid and even like Inter in CL), so the fans will ask for new young players and a better coach ...

So the fans have always something to protest against ...

PS: Of course, this post has to be taken ... in a funny way, there is no personal attack !!

Dont agree. Nobody wants us to be like arsenal and play with a kiddies team. It doesnt work! same as a team full of ex-players like us doesnt work! you need a good mix! like at Barca and Man utd. Some experienced players, some normal age players and some quality youngsters. We have WAY too many of the experienced players who look unmotivated against the smaller teams. On top off that they arent at their best anymore and we cant compete with teams like inter anymore. They are miles ahead off us again...

Originally Posted by Filipéz 182

Dont agree. Nobody wants us to be like arsenal and play with a kiddies team. It doesnt work! same as a team full of ex-players like us doesnt work! you need a good mix! like at Barca and Man utd. Some experienced players, some normal age players and some quality youngsters. We have WAY too many of the experienced players who look unmotivated against the smaller teams. On top off that they arent at their best anymore and we cant compete with teams like inter anymore. They are miles ahead off us again...

I read so many times people saying things like "look at what Wenger does at Arsenal" etc that I have to tell you that I think some people here would like us to have a team mainly made of youngsters ...

About what you said, in bold, you see, isn't it what our management is trying to do nowadays ?!

If we say that young is under 25, normal is between 25 and 30, and experienced is after 30 ...

Looking at our current team (and adding the new players), and then speaking about potential signings for next year, just let's have a look ...
I don't put Emerson - experienced (looks like he's not in the first team anymore + leaving), Cardaccio - young (was never used, isn't used and won't be used I think), and Viudez - young (called once but won't play except if we have all our strikers injured, what I don't hope).

GK:
Abbiati - experienced
Dida - experienced <= leaving ?

Defence:
Antonini - normal
Bonera - normal
Favalli - experienced <= retiring
Jankulovski - experienced
Kaladze - experienced
Maldini - experienced <= retiring
Mattioni - young
Nesta - experienced
Senderos - young <= sent back to Arsenal (please !!)
Thiago Silva - young => for next year
Zambrotta - experienced

Midfield:
Ambrosini - experienced
Beckham - experienced
Flamini - young/normal
Gattuso - experienced
Kaka' - normal
Pirlo - normal
Ronaldinho - normal
Seedorf - experienced

Strikers:
Borriello - normal
Inzaghi - experienced
Pato - young
Shevchenko - experienced <= sent back to Chelsea (please !!)

2008-2009
Young: 4
Normal: 6
Experienced: 14

2009-2010 (I count only the players who will be there for sure)
Young: 3
Normal: 7
Experienced: 10

To them, we could, maybe, add:
Paloschi - young
Gourcuff - young
Probably a normal aged player for the defence ...
Others - we don't know who so we don't know in what category they fill

Of course, it's only speculations, but the number of young and normal players is probably going to increase while at the same time, the number of experienced players will decrease ... it's what everyone wants, but still, what some seem not to see (or just don't want to see).

PS: Actually, the "best mix" in a 25 players roster is probably something like 5 young, 15 normal, 5 experienced, something like that, but knowing we like to have a bit more experience than other teams ... I would say that if we can have a 25 players roster looking like 5 young, 12 normal and 8 experienced, that'll be enough.

my perfect first team would be with 3 experienced players, 2 youngsters, and 6 normal....
young= 17-23
normal=24-30
experienced=over 30

Originally Posted by Filipéz 182

Dont agree. Nobody wants us to be like arsenal and play with a kiddies team. It doesnt work! same as a team full of ex-players like us doesnt work! you need a good mix! like at Barca and Man utd. Some experienced players, some normal age players and some quality youngsters. We have WAY too many of the experienced players who look unmotivated against the smaller teams. On top off that they arent at their best anymore and we cant compete with teams like inter anymore. They are miles ahead off us again...

That's true. Milan shouldn't be like Arsenal. Some Milan fans want to see young players to have chances but it doesn't mean that they want Milan to be like Arsenal.

Just like you said, the key is the mix and you told it precisely about the bad mix of our team.

I doubt anyone here want Milan to pull an Arsenal, but we all don't want Milan to become a retirement home for players who pasted it.

I mean, if we still have Coloucini now, our defense would have look much better.

Now I am not saying Coloucini is a rock at defense, but he is certainly miles ahead of Sanderous, and Kaladaze.

I am afraid that will happen again, if guys like Gourcuff, Darmian or Antonini don't get enough chance to play in Milan.

Having a good mix of players as Geo listed are great, but lets look at the starting 11, can u say that we have that type of balance there.

Now you might say that, well we don't have players good enough to start in the starting 11 in the mid twenties....well, then I guess the MGT is at fault for not buying them and the Coaches is at fault for not developing them properly.

Originally Posted by Gabriel489

Now you might say that, well we don't have players good enough to start in the starting 11 in the mid twenties....well, then I guess the MGT is at fault for not buying them and the Coaches is at fault for not developing them properly.

But if the management doesn't bring them, how can the coach develop them ?

I know that someone is probably reply "Albertazzi, Darmian, etc" and I will again reply "what in the world can make us thinking they are good enough ?". Of course, I'd like them to play if they're as good as we hope (where comes this hope from ? Not from their games ... not from their training sessions we don't see ... just from the management who said sometimes "These young players are good" or things like that).

And looking at the players we could bring (or bring back), I think the balance/mix is going to be restablished ...

We are heading into the right direction with transfers as Mattioni, Silva and maybe agger. + we could add Paloschi, Di Gennaro, Abate and Gourcuff. Wich would make our balance even better, but we have to PLAY THEM!! Carlo keeps playing old farts over our youngsters and that way they cannot improve. Who knows if Albertazzi, darmian etc. are good enough players? Players like kaladze, seedorf, emerson... can make mistake after mistake, show no passion or motivation but they still are preffered over the young guns.
Carlo isnt even trying to include them into the team. Look what happend with gourcuff, the kid had talent but everytime BROCCHI was preffered to him.

Originally Posted by Filipéz 182

We are heading into the right direction with transfers as Mattioni, Silva and maybe agger. + we could add Paloschi, Di Gennaro, Abate and Gourcuff. Wich would make our balance even better, but we have to PLAY THEM!! Carlo keeps playing old farts over our youngsters and that way they cannot improve. Who knows if Albertazzi, darmian etc. are good enough players? Players like kaladze, seedorf, emerson... can make mistake after mistake, show no passion or motivation but they still are preffered over the young guns.
Carlo isnt even trying to include them into the team. Look what happend with gourcuff, the kid had talent but everytime BROCCHI was preffered to him.

Maybe the coach during the training sessions ?

Originally Posted by Filipéz 182

Look what happend with gourcuff, the kid had talent but everytime BROCCHI was preffered to him.

In a nutshell, that's the core of the problem with Gourcuff.

I'd be surprised if he comes back. Simply put, Milan wasted him.

Originally Posted by GeoTav

Nalx got a good point:
- the fans want trophies (on MM: no result = sack Carlo and Galliani or even sell the club)
- the fans want young players (on MM: look at Arsenal, they have so many very good young players)
- the fans want star players (on MM: look at Inter or Barcelona, they bought "this" player)

Last year was horrible, this year is averagely good (could be a lot better), if we sack Carlo at the next bad result ... what will happen ? We find the best coach in the world (the one that noone knows yet) and thanks to him, we win all the games we have to play to end on the first or second place of Serie A. Or we take the bad coach or, other solution, our players don't like the fact that Carlo is fired, and we lose many games to finish ... 5th again at the end.

If you take the example of the young players, Arsenal didn't win any major trophy since they started their "let's sell the experienced players at a high price and let's buy cheap young talented players" strategy. So if we have a young team, people will bash our management for the previous reason (no result whereas they have had what they wanted: plenty young talented players).

And if you take the other example, the clubs with many stars ... so people want us to spend 100M in one single mercato. If we fail (like Real Madrid and even like Inter in CL), so the fans will ask for new young players and a better coach ...

So the fans have always something to protest against ...

PS: Of course, this post has to be taken ... in a funny way, there is no personal attack !!

Although you have a good point in that fans are difficult if not impossible to satisfy, I think you are not getting the center of the problem here.

The fans, before anything else, wants this club to have a direction! Whether we are going to be Arsenal or Barcelona, at least we'd know where we are going. The way this team is structured now is like a hybrid between everything. They are old and young; they are over the hill and immature; they have heavy wages and high price tags. The result of this hybrid is a team has no balance in its personnel. Our old players don't seem like they care any more; our young players are either too immature to play a major role or simply not talented enough to handle such a heavy load. We pay the highest wage bill in Serie A for a boat load of players who can't perform and handicap ourselves in the transfer market. In this situation, you simply cannot expect the fans to be happy. Especially since the management insist on lying to our faces year after year.

The fans are hard to satisfy, but winning will cure a lot of things. I can guarantee you that there won't be nearly as many complainers here if we are dominating european soccer like we did 6, 7 years ago.

When you don't have Kaka`, R80, and players who have past their primes like Inzaghi and Shevchekno, and with only a Pato it's really difficult to see how Milan can even score.

Oh well.. too many problems that the Milan management did not see... the purchase of R80, Sheva etc. now inevitably raised many eyebrows: Is it ever the right move?

I think that Silivo will open is eyes now and also is wallet.
We need a GK= Ochoa/Viviano+Abbiati
We need 2 CB= Santacroce+Bonera+Nesta+Silva+Kjaer+Darmian+M.Rossi+Albrtazzi(loan out 2 from the last 3)
We need 2 Full backs= Zambro+Antonini+Dessena+De Silvestri+Flipe
WE need 2 Mid= Kaka+Ronnie+Gorky+Abeta+Chigarini+Pirlo+Rino+Flamini (We can also sell Pirlo and change the formtion to 4-2-3-1 and buy Canna+Hamsik\Hernanes)
We neek 3 striker= Pato+Pippo+Palochi+Rossi+Di Gennaro

From all of this players 4 will cost us nothing (coming back from loans)+GK will cost 8 mil+CBs will cost 25-30+Full backs will cost 18 mil+Mid will cost 6 mil (or if we sell Pirlo for 20 and buy Hamsik\Hernanes and Canna this will cost 30 mil)+Rossi and Plaoschi and Di Gennaro will cost 25 mil.
All will cost=8+30+18+6\30+25=85\110 mil - selling KK+Ambro+Seedorf (this 3 will give us 15 mil)=70\95
This a lot of money but that team is MINMUM for 5 years and will win a lot of titles!
Line up-my favorite:
Ochoa\Viviano
Zambro\Felipe Nesta Stanacoce\Silva De Silvestri\Desnnea
Rino Canna\Flamini
Hamsik\Hernanes or Gorky
Ronnie Kaka
Pato
or:
Ochoa\Viviano
Zambro\Felipe Nesta Stanacoce\Silva De Silvestri\Desnnea
Rino Canna\Flamini
Kaka Gorky Ronnie
Pato

Plz!!!!!Berlu!!!!

Santacroce and De Silvestri would be a great buy, BUT i really dont think this will happen just for the fact that all milan managment are arrogant.