Banter 2009/2010

Originally Posted by Nalx

A bit off-topic guys, but does anybody know what happened after the court sentenced Berlu's Fininvest to pay some hundreds millions to their rival company a couple months ago? I bet Berlu go for appeal, but any recent news about this case?

Article written some hours ago: http://www.italia-news.it/?lang=it&idcnt=35007
I can't tell you what it says because I don't want to translate (too long article) ...

PS: By just reading the first lines, I'm not even sure it is about what you asked for !! Ahah

EDIT:

Here's an article about economics of Fininvest
http://it.reuters.com/article/itEuro...63D2BI20100414

And a funny article on the Italian version of Goal.com ... Conspiracy by Leo and Galliani to force Berlu to spend this summer !!
http://www.goal.com/it/news/7/calcio...olo-teatro-per

Originally Posted by Stitch

look, a few pages ago you asked someone (can't remember who, the discussion was about Leo) something like "Do you think that THIS GROUP of players in Milan CAN NOT perform better than it already does. If you think they can not, the discussion ends."

It is clear that 99% of people here (actually, everybody but you) think that Leo did manage to pull THE BEST out of our players. So the discussion ends here.

On the other side, if you really (and not speaking like a fan) expected this retirement home that is today's Milan to win anything, and now you're blaming our coach for not making it true..well, it speaks more about your football knowledge

5 times we've had the chance to close the gap, or increase the gap against inter, 5 times we've failed. 5 TIMES!!!!! How many matches has Leo changed with his in-game substitutions? How many tactical battle's has he won this season? How then can you say that Leo has gotten the best out of this 'old' team?
I didn't expect the team to win anything at the beginning of the season, i admit that much, for one reason and one reason only: I DIDN'T EXPECT INTER TO DROP THIS MANY POINTS!
Leo has done a good job, nothing more. The only reason we should commend him is that he's a rookie.

Originally Posted by GeoTav

Article written some hours ago: http://www.italia-news.it/?lang=it&idcnt=35007
I can't tell you what it says because I don't want to translate (too long article) ...

PS: By just reading the first lines, I'm not even sure it is about what you asked for !! Ahah

EDIT:

Here's an article about economics of Fininvest
http://it.reuters.com/article/itEuro...63D2BI20100414

And a funny article on the Italian version of Goal.com ... Conspiracy by Leo and Galliani to force Berlu to spend this summer !!
http://www.goal.com/it/news/7/calcio...olo-teatro-per

LOL.. They're all in Italian. So, could somebody with much more leisure time than Geo be kindly tell me what's in those articles please? I'm not even asking to translate the whole articles, just tell me if the articles say anything about Fininvest getting bankrupt. If not, then don't bother. Haha..

Gotta ask this question here...how do people expect an owner to pour HIS MONEY into a club and support it year after year? The club has to make its own money or else the owner would go bankrupt ! Has it always been this way?

Originally Posted by xvr11

Gotta ask this question here...how do people expect an owner to pour HIS MONEY into a club and support it year after year? The club has to make its own money or else the owner would go bankrupt ! Has it always been this way?

In Italy, I think the answer is yes. MU, Madrid, and Barca have already became huge, profitable companies because they have their own stadiums (while in Italy the stadium is owned by the city council if I'm not mistaken) and more importantly, they're very good at marketing.

Originally Posted by shegs1157

5 times we've had the chance to close the gap, or increase the gap against inter, 5 times we've failed. 5 TIMES!!!!! How many matches has Leo changed with his in-game substitutions? How many tactical battle's has he won this season? How then can you say that Leo has gotten the best out of this 'old' team?
I didn't expect the team to win anything at the beginning of the season, i admit that much, for one reason and one reason only: I DIDN'T EXPECT INTER TO DROP THIS MANY POINTS!
Leo has done a good job, nothing more. The only reason we should commend him is that he's a rookie.

If 5 hot women come to you on 5 different occasions for a lil action but you're suffering from e.d. did you just throw away five glorious opportunities??

No as long as you don't have the tools for the job no amount of opportunities matter. We don't have a proper left back. We don't have a right back at all. ALL our keepers range from the inconsistent to the average.
Pirlo has become utter rubbish and the one person who can play in his position Seedorf can only play well every other game. We don't have any good strikers other than Pato and not only does he play out of position but has been injured a lot. We don't have a single player in Pato's mould, which is why we got Mancini. Of course he's a rather pale imitation of the duck but heyyy he's free.

Thus Leonardo has been forced to rely on the flawed genius of Ronaldinho as the main thrust to achieve results and truth be told he has done admirably. However a lot of Ron's success depend on having other players run into space for him to work his magic. It just so happened that Antonini was also injured a lot this season so the effectiveness of that strategy has been curtailed.
Look at our players:
Defense
Favagol, Gooch, Kaladze} Very error prone defenders without pace
Anto, Oddo, Zambro Abate} flawed in either the offensive or defensive dept

Midfield
Pirlo- slow, pass rate worsening from game to game, overworked, terrible fk's
Seedorf- Slow and usually forced to play out of position
Flamini-card machine
Gattuso- slow, old, poor passer

Attack
Ron- not as fast as he used to be, no help in defense
Huntelaar- slow and can't dribble
Borriello- poor decision making and not clinical in front of goal
Inzaghi- slow and seems to have lost his scoring instincts/positional sense

This leaves us with only two players that don't have MAJOR faults Ambro, Pato and Nesta...two of these have been injured for huge portions of the season.

Management also waves a bunch of red herrings in front of us like the so-called emphasis on youth. Only that we NEVER see any of them and those we do see (Zigoni, Di Gennaro and Darmian) look HORRIBLE

Look at Inter, Manure, Chelsea, Barca, Bayern and Real- these are teams with a realistic shot at winning titles because they have squad depth and don't have to force their champions of last decade to work uphill at rolling back the years each game. I mean Ambro was a SQUAD player back in the day and he's now our captain ffs....and you still have the nerve to knock Leo

Galliani about Leo's future

Leonardo had no intention of managing Milan I persuaded him last year. And I will convince him to stay this year too, regardless of his two-year deal. I think I will manage it. And Berlusconi wants it too, you must believe me…

Originally Posted by shegs1157

5 times we've had the chance to close the gap, or increase the gap against inter, 5 times we've failed. 5 TIMES!!!!! How many matches has Leo changed with his in-game substitutions? How many tactical battle's has he won this season? How then can you say that Leo has gotten the best out of this 'old' team?
I didn't expect the team to win anything at the beginning of the season, i admit that much, for one reason and one reason only: I DIDN'T EXPECT INTER TO DROP THIS MANY POINTS!
Leo has done a good job, nothing more. The only reason we should commend him is that he's a rookie.

if his subs are inzaghi,Mancini or other useless players,how can you expect him to change the game?

For instance Leo changed Catania game and we won the game 2-1 with Huntelaar's goals,as he fielded both there playing with Seedorf,Ronaldinho and Pato at the same time if im not mistaken...

Milan missed the chances,Roma,Parma,Napoli,Catania e.t.c...

we cant create and score without Pato,How can you expect us win games without Pato?Borriello is easily erased from the game if CB's are solid,
Milan is offensively weak without Pato,with Pato Milan would be league leaders now...we are predictable with Ronaldinho,Huntelaar failed at Right,with Borriello,our team defence is weak,Midfield trio works harder and they finished toward the end of the game,we even couldnt keep the ball there without Pato.Pato is key man...very very important for us,we cant win without him...he is only match winner player,Ronaldinho is great assist man.
yet Pato finishes all of them...Borriello is not alone because Pato always move with him and create space to him,we failed 5 times because we were missing Pato,our most important weapon for the attack and we dont have a replacement...

Mancini,Beckham...are not Pato replacement,they can win games and score,move the box like Pato does...they can score 20 goals a season?...
They are not Pato replacement...Your coach have to play poacher Huntelaar there...Leo even did it...i'd do it as well if i were him...was the right thing...Huntelaar failed at there...Huntelaar is the reason why we lost one or 2 of that chances...at Roma,he missed 2 clear chances,Catania lost the ball...
if someone is quilty,its Huntelaar more than Leo...

you want Leo to play and score the goals and change the game...with the squad he had,he did the maximum...The maximum is that...

Just look at the improvement of Pirlo,Ronaldinho,Abate,Antonini,Silva(with Ancelotti,he would be a bench warmer after Kaladze and Bonera),Ambrosini,
Flamini,even Seedorf is better...Borriello...

if you expect a team with Silva,Nesta(who is injured),Ronaldinho,Pato and Pirlo win the scudetto vs a inter side?Off course inter would lose so much points cuz of they are missing ibrahimovic so much,they changed much...

just look at Mou's subs and look at Leo's...Balotelli,Stankovic,Motta,Muntari,
Pandev...

inzaghi,Huntelaar,Gattuso,Zambrotta...thats the difference and you expect Leo change the game with them...its not possible...

if we had signed Pandev and Hernanes in january,free agent Pandev,we didnt sign him cuz he is getting high wages...we are not the club who pays 4 m euros to Kaladze,4 m euros 3 m euros 3.5 m euros to players who does nothing?Hernanes cost 20 m euros,who needs Hernanes we have Beckham...

if we need to find a quilty,its not Leonardo...

we would have a valuable sub for Pato and Dinho there,with Hernanes we would have better and more compact midfield,stronger midfield...

i want Leo to play Flamini more and more,we all know he is forced by Mgt to play Gattuso more and Ambrosini cuz he is the captain...

Originally Posted by Vulli

Galliani about Leo's future

Leonardo had no intention of managing Milan I persuaded him last year. And I will convince him to stay this year too, regardless of his two-year deal. I think I will manage it. And Berlusconi wants it too, you must believe me…

a closed mouth gathers no foot

Originally Posted by Vulli

Galliani about Leo's future

Leonardo had no intention of managing Milan I persuaded him last year. And I will convince him to stay this year too, regardless of his two-year deal. I think I will manage it. And Berlusconi wants it too, you must believe me…

Off topic yet i have to ask...

Why do you have Valentino Rossi on your avatar?

He is an inter fanatic...

Originally Posted by Rabia15

Off topic yet i have to ask...

Why do you have Valentino Rossi on your avatar?

He is an inter fanatic...

And a close friend of Materrazzi ... but nobody is perfect.
If you love motorbike sports, you have to admire Rossi !!

Forza Milan, and forza The Doctor !!

@ drucurl, you talk about not having enough material, bt Bari drew inter home and away with far less 'equipment' than Milan! Sampdoria and Palermo have limited 'equipment' yet they have realistic shots of making CL! How did they do it? By PROPERLY UTILIZING EVERY MEMBER OF THE SQUAD (and using the right tactics.)
Man u and Bayern (apart from attack in Bayerns case) have incredibly thin squads, bt you don't hear fans say 'kuscaz is a disaster' or 'Van Bommel is too old'!
@ Rabia, kiko Macheda can't possibly be better than Inzaghi or Mancini, yet SAF has found a way to use him.
And Hunt's case isn't rocket science- the guy is a scorer, pure and simple, not a dribbler/passer/speed merchant etc etc- why's Leo making it look that way? Always sticking him on the right and expecting a miracle, whats that about? And the only reason H11 missed those chances is lack of confidence, and who do we blame for that? Leo! Ramos shattered H11's confidence, and instead of Leo to help Hunt regain that confidence, he further erodes it! Well done coach, well done.

Originally Posted by shegs1157

@ drucurl, you talk about not having enough material, bt Bari drew inter home and away with far less 'equipment' than Milan! Sampdoria and Palermo have limited 'equipment' yet they have realistic shots of making CL! How did they do it? By PROPERLY UTILIZING EVERY MEMBER OF THE SQUAD (and using the right tactics.)
Man u and Bayern (apart from attack in Bayerns case) have incredibly thin squads, bt you don't hear fans say 'kuscaz is a disaster' or 'Van Bommel is too old'!
@ Rabia, kiko Macheda can't possibly be better than Inzaghi or Mancini, yet SAF has found a way to use him.
And Hunt's case isn't rocket science- the guy is a scorer, pure and simple, not a dribbler/passer/speed merchant etc etc- why's Leo making it look that way? Always sticking him on the right and expecting a miracle, whats that about? And the only reason H11 missed those chances is lack of confidence, and who do we blame for that? Leo! Ramos shattered H11's confidence, and instead of Leo to help Hunt regain that confidence, he further erodes it! Well done coach, well done.

Wow guess you really owned me there I mean...it's not like
1)Bari have an excellent defense...Who wants Ranocchia and Bonucci? They're crap
2)"Manure and Bayern have incredibly thin squads" - right on the money no comment again. Manure's squad clearly isn't enough to compete for the Premiership neither does Bayern have the two best wingers in the game etc.
3)"The only reason K.Hunt missed a bagful of sitters is because Leonardo eroded it" What a brilliant theory
4(my favourite))"kiko Macheda can't possibly be better than Inzaghi or Mancini, yet SAF has found a way to use him." Yes everybody knows that one of Fergie's brightest young players is no match for a 37 year old striker with limited technique and no pace.

Dear Sir,

Honestly I apologize for ever questioning your WEALTH of footballing and general knowledge. Long ago I concluded that mzk57 was indeed a beacon of intellectual fortitude such as has not been seen since Stephen Hawkin. You have however forced me to reconsider my assessment. From the bottom of my heart sir, I salute you and request that you let me off the hook just this one time

Regards,
drucurl

Originally Posted by shegs1157

@ drucurl, you talk about not having enough material, bt Bari drew inter home and away with far less 'equipment' than Milan! Sampdoria and Palermo have limited 'equipment' yet they have realistic shots of making CL! How did they do it? By PROPERLY UTILIZING EVERY MEMBER OF THE SQUAD (and using the right tactics.)
Man u and Bayern (apart from attack in Bayerns case) have incredibly thin squads, bt you don't hear fans say 'kuscaz is a disaster' or 'Van Bommel is too old'!

You use one game to compare teams ...

- Well, we beat Catania away and Inter lost, it's because Leonardo used our players in a better way than Mourinho does with Inter players despite the fact that we have "less equipment" !!
- We drawed in Roma and deserved the win, some people on the forum said after that game that the Scudetto race was over because this Roma side would be destroyed by Inter (I replied them not to do such statement by giving examples and we know the story then ). Roma finally beat Inter. We can again make the same conclusion as in the previous paragraph.

The fact is that if you delete the games between Roma, Milan and Inter, you have this table (I don't count the game of last night as Milan and Roma didn't play their 34th game yet):
Roma - 63 points
Inter and Milan - 60 points

So Roma is the best team of the trio against all the other teams, Inter and Milan have exactly the same amount of points (if you add Roma and just compare Milan and Inter, Milan has more points).

Now, if you compare the squads, I think we can rank the teams this way:
Inter
Roma
Milan

And there is a big difference between Inter and Milan.

So I really don't understand how some people can think our team is underachieving like you tend to say in this post I quoted ...

PS: And when you see that, it's there that you understand we can't say we had 5 chances to take the lead, etc. The fact is that Milan has had the same results as Inter against the 17 other teams (and so, I repeat, with a worse squad). Our problem was during our direct confrontations. While we did well against Roma, we will probably lose the title (there's still some hope if we win this W-E, but Roma has to draw !!) because of one of the derbys, and more especially because of the second one: we were in an excellent form before that game, and we just forgot how to play football without any noticeable reason.This second derby should be the game we will regret (or maybe Inter and Roma are going to suddenly lose their last games after this W-E and we will have no regret in Serie A !! ) if we lose this title.

Originally Posted by mrki

I told everyone in here 2 years ago what are Berlusconi and Galliani doing with Milan and what will happen. And no one took me seriously, people like to live in fantasy worlds where its all ok and we are grande Milan and will be ok. That is why Brasiliero Im considered "pessimistic", while still correctly predicting our failures in serie a and as a club.

In the moment Galliani leaves Milan Maldini can come back. Same story I told you 2 years back when I read the article Boban wrote about his visit to Milanello - about Maldini not wanting to work with Galliani.

As soon as Milan is sold we can think about Grande Milan again, not before.

So once again: go to hell Silvio and Galliani! Forza Leo, good luck! At least the man is not a puppy like Carletto.

I confess that I was a little worried, but as you know, I was more pro-mgt, not a blind supporter, but in no way I would predicted the mess we are right now. Wow!

Btw, can you tell me more about this article? I didn't saw it... just the important topics.
Thanks, my friend.

Originally Posted by GeoTav

The main problem is that Galliani seems to have no more ideas and is seems unable to innovate. Without money (let's change that: without big amounts of money), Galliani is not able to attract potentially useful players in Milan because all he knows is how to attract new stars, established players and former stars (since he doesn't have money to spend).

It's actually the main problem. If we can't spend big, why don't we try to invest on young players ? But not Grimi, Viudez or Mattioni (who maybe will all turn to be good players, who knows, but they were useless in Milan), we should look for players like Thiago Silva (let me be correct: T.Silva is an excellent player, we will probably find it hard to buy another player of that kind at the price we paid in Brazil, but the world is big ...). We should also look at some prospects in Belgium (young Belgian players and young African ones as some Belgian clubs have very good connections with African clubs), in Netherlands, in Portugal, in France, in Ukraine ...

Good points, Geo...
We clearly looks clueless when the subject isn't a hyped player... at least in Brazilian market. Hernanes is amazing, but he is well recognized.

Do you know what shocks me? How a guy like Jucilei isn't one of our main objectives here in Brazil? Corinthians needs money, NOW! They also aren't hard sellers, and there are 2 players that are more hyped(for the market) than Jucilei in the squad, Elias and Dentinho.

I understand that for the normal fan, I mean, the one didn't care about scouting, Jucilei doesn't appear a high priority, because in Brazil, 99% the press just know to hype offensive players. So he's clearly a unknown and the ugly duck right now.

But you just need to watch some games, and see what he's doing without be a focal point of Corinthians... and in big games, as in Libertadores this week. The DM set up the 2 goals, showing dribbling skills in the first and power and pass in the second.

I'm starting to doubt we have scouts here, because every time we were linked with a no hyped name, the result was a disaster(Mattione, Cardaccio, Vudez, Grimme). It's easy(and dangerous) just to keep an eye on the Darlings of the media here in Brazil. First, because some are clearly overrated, some don't fit in Serie A game, and third, because we let several gems escape between our hands.

Jucilei is screaming a future WC player, and more important, playing for Corinthians, what means a more reasonable price... I just want to know what these so called scouts are doing right now(regarding Brazil).

But to do that, we need excellent scouts, something we don't have anymore (we had the best scout for Brazil, we don't have him anymore as he's our coach right now).

How you dare?!?!? I'm still here!!