Serie A Suspended!!

From another rumor I heard in another Milan forum, it seems that three rounds will be suspended, though it hasn't been publicly announced yet.

Any news wouldn't surprise me at this point.

3 rounds will mean going directly to CL matches. It may be good for all 3 Italian teams there, especially for Milan.
It could be a great period to catch up what was lost during this summer because of the early CLQ matches .

And maybe Inter will lose the momentum ...... eh, then it won't be as good for them as i thought it'll be.

Btw, do you guys think there's a chance Italian teams in Europe to play behind closed doors ? At least these 1/8 final matches ?
I think it won't be fair to Milan, Inter and Roma, but is htere such a possibility ?

I'm sure some of Celtic, Lyon or Valencia will demand something similar from UEFA !

Originally Posted by Tony29.

Btw, do you guys think there's a chance Italian teams in Europe to play behind closed doors ? At least these 1/8 final matches ?
I think it won't be fair to Milan, Inter and Roma, but is htere such a possibility ?

I'm sure some of Celtic, Lyon or Valencia will demand something similar from UEFA !

I wouldn't be surprised if that happens. And I don't think it is unfair either. The image of Italian calcio can't afford any more stupidity like this.

In my opinion, any news won't surprise me; 'closed-door' would not be the end of the world, not at all. Even if Italian teams would all be kicked out of Europe for one year, they would just have to face the music and pay for it.

I can assure you that the Serie A will resume shortly, maybe they'll have a minute of silence and play with black armbands, and that's it. Television rights and millions, got it?

Sounds harsh? Nope it's realist, and that's coming from someone who was 16 in may 1986 and went to see a C1 Final between Liverpool and Juventus, my card was for blok Z where all the people got killed, but due to coincidence I ended up in blok X just next to it.

And nothing changed in 22 years, it can happen again, anytime, anywhere.

And society created the disease and you won't get rid of it with bans, violence, or strong words, that only makes it stronger and more angry.

The people who have no jobs, no future, no love they identify themselves with colours, logos, political parties, whatever that makes them feel respected, a part of it. It becomes their life, the place to release their frustrations, to vent their anger. They feel they have to settle the score if their team loses, and for every opposition fan they can send in the hospital, that's a goal they score for their banner.

Frightening isn't it? But it's the truth, I can assure you. You won't solve it by suspending the games or closing the stadiums, they will surface elsewhere, find other grounds, other ways to vent their anger. And locking them up won't do no good because they will come out 10 times worse and the next generation is already waiting, another generation of unemployed, homeless, people with no future who have nothing but a depressing gray life in perspective.

Fortunately there is a way out, a way to stop it. For me it stopped a long time ago, probably even before most of the people on this forum were even born. That way is love, a wife, kids, a future, something else to live for. Something to think about.

Heysel didn't happen in England Rahul.

true and Hillsborough wasnt anything to do with fan violence too. It did help change the laws for stadiums though, as did the Bradford City fire.

Mrs. Thatcher's method of nabbing down hooligans was effective but you can't completely say that they have completely vanished from England. They are controlled because of effective measures such identifying the audiences, creating a black list of people with a record of crimes, CCTV in the stadium and limiting on what is supposed to be brought to the stadiums (no flamable stuff, etc.). If we bring about these measures then there will be a fall in such incidents.

Most of these measures are supposedly in place already though, thats the problem. Maybe now with all the negative attention on calcio it will be enough to force implementation but honestly i doubt it. The federation and government will talk tough while it is fresh in the memory but come summertime when the season is over and people have moved onto the next major talking points (as is the nature of modern news) will they still be so willing to plough billions into changes?

Platini is saying some of the right things but i hope he is putting huge pressure on them in private to sort it out. His stance and that of UEFA's is the opposite of how they treat England, where we have to walk a tightrope every major event because we are threatened with expulsion if there is 1 major incident. I dont mind that as long as that is across the board because the worst thing UEFA can do is create 2 systems to deal with this.

But if the suspension carries on longer, won't we be excluded from the Champions league?

la Giunta straordinaria del Coni riunitasi oggi ha deciso di prolungare la gestione commissariale della federcalcio. Lo ha annunciato il presidente del Coni, Gianni Petrucci. Il 28 febbraio è stato convocato il Consiglio nazionale che delibererà la proroga.

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Originally Posted by Pireloke

I can assure you that the Serie A will resume shortly, maybe they'll have a minute of silence and play with black armbands, and that's it. Television rights and millions, got it?

Sounds harsh? Nope it's realist, and that's coming from someone who was 16 in may 1986 and went to see a C1 Final between Liverpool and Juventus, my card was for blok Z where all the people got killed, but due to coincidence I ended up in blok X just next to it.

And nothing changed in 22 years, it can happen again, anytime, anywhere.

And society created the disease and you won't get rid of it with bans, violence, or strong words, that only makes it stronger and more angry.........

You know Pireloke.... nice point you've brought up. Are they really going to be serious about this? I have an article from the associated press here. I'll highlight a very very peculiar point of interest.

It goes on saying... blah blah blah.. yadayadayadayada..

Originally Posted by By ANDREW ROBERTS, Associated Press Writer

A Catania prosecutor told Sky TG24 that he believe the incident was orchestrated by individuals who had nothing to do with soccer.

"It's clear from the footage. There are groups of criminals separate from the fans. They go to the stadium just to attack the police," Renato Papa said.

REALLLYY??? Maybe this "Catania" prosecutor doesnt want to hurt his hometown club or in any case the whole Italian Football League?
Furthermore if what he's saying is true, are we going to blame football and punish all lovers of the italian game worldwide?
I'll be open for all around punishment for what occured in the stadium itself. Then again if these criminals responsible for the death of this police officer were not soccer fans and just your normal punks off the road looking for trouble at the stadium, that's a whole new matter!
Hmmmm??? It's one of those things that just makes us go hmmmmm??? Do I smell fish?

Maybe its time Italy does the same thing England did. Remove criminals from football lovers, and jail them up! We have the same problem in Crroatia, and the solutions as bad as italian so far. If serie a gets stoped untill CL game, it can only be good for Milan, from tactical point of wiew. We have many injured and unprepared players like Maldini, Kaladze, Ronaldo, Ambrosini, Serginho, Nesta.... Maybe it will do some good to them if we have another round of good preparations in Milanello camp. There is always a possibility of a friendly matches...

Originally Posted by Kui

REALLLYY??? Maybe this "Catania" prosecutor doesnt want to hurt his hometown club or in any case the whole Italian Football League?
Furthermore if what he's saying is true, are we going to blame football and punish all lovers of the italian game worldwide?
I'll be open for all around punishment for what occured in the stadium itself. Then again if these criminals responsible for the death of this police officer were not soccer fans and just your normal punks off the road looking for trouble at the stadium, that's a whole new matter!
Hmmmm??? It's one of those things that just makes us go hmmmmm??? Do I smell fish?

I cannot speak out of experience about the organisation of the hooligan groups nowadays, but it seems very unlikely they are structured like criminal organisations, anyway not as described in the article, of course since I got out of that world a lot has changed, the introduction of cellphones and the internet made communication easier and they are more mobile than they were 20 to 30 years ago.

But what I can talk about and try to explain is the structure of the average Side or Firm or whatever they call themselves nowadays and it's like this :

For easy explanation I will take an example of 100% people, no matter how big or small the club, only the number of ultras or hooligans change, but the % remains the same.

75% "the followers" : they sing at matches, they throw some insults, but that's about it, they will never start a fight themselves as they are often kids who identify themselves with the other 25% but haven't for one reason or the other not moved into a higher ranks if the Firm. (for example they have a job, they have parents who won't let them get the club tatto ect ect)

They wear scarves and have flags of the team with them, they offer the ultra group or firm the necessary cover to operate, the mass to hide in. Often the higher tier will not like them but they need them for the bigger fights, they will influence them a whole season if they must, but when the big rival arrives they will have them ready.

20% "the outer ring": these guys are already deeper in, their anger is bigger, they have less to lose when caught by the cops, or they care a lot less. They are the guys with the flares and who light them.

They don't wear scarves but still "casual" clothes that are recognizeable for the other firms (Londsdale, Adidas, Nike, pullovers with rolled necks that can be put in front of the face, woven hats with no reference to the team for extra camouflage ect ect) These guys are the fighters (these are the guys you see on the Catania video) Their team has become their life, you can compare them to someone who got brainwashed, and often even family and base life values come second to their mates and the club.

Now until these, that are 95% of the ultras the "damage" is reversible, I am the living proof as I was member of the higher tier of the outer ring. I started in the followers when I was 14, and I got out at age 22. I still am fanatic and I can still get angry if we lose and I still value my club as a "top priority" but I won't fight over it anymore, even if we lose 10-0, unless I get attacked first of course but then anyone would defend themselves as self-defense.

Actualy a lot of my friends from back then are married and got kids and stopped being violent, a few others ended up in jail or got killed, it all depends on how life treats you and how far you're moving towards or into the inner ring.

But that leaves us with the remaining 5%, the first 4% are "the inner ring" these guys are bad news, they are the ringleaders and their lieutenants, they won't hesitate to fight against supporters of the same club, they often did jailtime and have nothing to lose. These are the criminals the man writing the article refers to.

They organize the fights, ambushes, they go to the matches not anymore to watch football but because it has become their personal playground of warfare. They have the club logo tattood on their chest, backs arms and other places, they will fight whenever they feel like it and every pretext is good to start one. They will follow the club wherever it plays, even if they have not to eat to pay the traveling expense. Losing or winning of the team doesn't matter, all that counts is the fight against the other fans and the "news headlines" are their own championship standings.

The remaining 1% is (are) the leader(s) : Unlike the previous 4% you won't notice these guys if they sat next to you in the stands. They are often wearing anonymous clothes, look intelligent, speak politely but are in contact at all times with the inner ring to steer their troops like a kid would do in a strategy videogame. The only ones able to approach them are the inner ring, they won't have anything to do with the outer ring and followers, in fact they are mostly unknown to most of these. (they often think the guy with the most tattoos is the leader but in fact he's only the lapdog of the real leader)

That was the situation back in my time, I suppose it didn't evolve much, only the tools (cellphones, weapons, internet) changed over the years I guess.

So if you want to ban hooliganism from the stadiums that's pretty easy, follow he example of England and put cameras everywhere, that will take care of 90% of the ingame trouble. Unfortunately you can't place cameras on every street corner and the violence will only displace itself outside of the stadium before and after the matches.

To take care of the phenomenon hooliganism you need to discourage the followers to follow, so you will expose the rings.

You will have to re-educate and give a meaning to the life of the outer ring guys.

And don't be mistaken, the inner ring and leaders have to be put away, far from society as they are beyond help.

I wish to declare that I do not endorse hooliganism, but I post this merely as an explanation to the phenomenon, from someone who lived in that environement for several years and got out of it and wants to make it's functionement more clear to all. I did not grow a hatred against it either, because I know the by far largest part of them are just lads like you and me who are blinded and (ab)used by people with bad intentions, and I had great friendship with lots of those guys, a sense of friendship I strangely not felt anymore with someone since I left, but I found other better things in life than violence and hatred. Most of us do, it's just the 5% that has to be taken care of.

that opens up a new world to me. thanks for the information.

Originally Posted by Tony29.

Btw, do you guys think there's a chance Italian teams in Europe to play behind closed doors ? At least these 1/8 final matches ?
I think it won't be fair to Milan, Inter and Roma, but is htere such a possibility ?

It's not unfair at all. All English clubs were banned from Europe for five years, among other measures taken in the aftermath of Heysel, even though only Liverpool were at the center it all. Who'd have thought the day would come that we'd think of England in terms of fighting hooliganism?

Thanks for the post, Pireloke. It was very informative.

I don't aprove this what hapen in Italy.
But there is problem.
When some fan kill policeman then all world talk about that, but when police kill fan almost noone talk about that....

Originally Posted by MIRZA

I don't aprove this what hapen in Italy.
But there is problem.
When some fan kill policeman then all world talk about that, but when police kill fan almost noone talk about that....

Maybe because the world is yet to hear about a fan whose job is to protect the people from some retarded Police officers who decided to demolish the whole city, being killed while doing his job, by a policeman.