Cigarettes: Which brand do you smoke?

Originally Posted by Nadir

Why should non-smokers pay for smokers health problems? And yes, they do use the money from taxing tobacco towards smokers health problems.

They use money from tobacco proceeds for a lot of things.

Originally Posted by Nadir

nobody said society is free or problems except for smoking lol. but let's just say i buy your argument - and in that case I AM GLAD people smoke. It provides more money for all the rest of us YAY. I won't complain if it means better health care, better schools - all cus of tobaco. go team tobacco! and smokers - i tip my hat to you - you are giving up your LIVES so that all of us can have better healthcare, better tuition, better roads, better everything. We need to erect a giant cigarette in your honour smokers. Thank you thank you thank you - but again, please don't smoke in my presence.

Patronize, b!tch, and moan all we want to Nadir, but the reality is that this is a cash cow and it isnt going away anytime soon.
I will concede that there is no reason to smoke right next to you if it bothers you. Yet you fail to see the economic side of this in a mature way.

Originally Posted by Nadir

again, i don't really care if there are smokers in the world. but i am not a big fan of the fact that it affected my health and there are non-smokers dying because of smoker's habits. whatever spin you put on how great it is for the economy, i don't care. i would rather breathe.

Again people die from a lot of things. If it has affected your health than for that I am truly sorry.

Listen friends... I agree with you folks on a lot of things on this issue. Yet I am clearly trying to make a point of something you folks have overlooked. That is the economical reality of tobacco to any govt in the world. Any effort that govts are making or saying to curb health problems due to smoking realted illness is an affront to moral governance. You will have politicians who are total advocates of anti-smoking coming to realize the fiscal reality of tobacco income and become lacklustre in such crusades. Right now and years to come, there is way too much money for any state to take a pass on Tobacco revenues.
This is my point. Disagree with it, you can. I dont like such predicaments either! But this is bottom line truth.

Thank goodness the football game is entertaining at the San Siro. Not all that mist is from road flares. A many good deal of people smoke like chimneys at San Siro. So if it werent for attractive football there.... you'd definitely be annoyed.

Well Nadir my friend. Looks like we actually disagreed on something this time! It all good of course! I'll respectfull agree that we disagree. Cheers!

don't really care if we disagree or not. your logic states that it doesn't matter that people's healths are affected - as long as there is money to build roads. again, kudos to the smokers - without them, we would have no roads! lol - brilliant argument.

you aren't the first to realise that taxes from cigarettes do contribute to several things around the world. it's not you that made people here dawn upon that realisation. we all knew that - and it's not even the point. the point is that cigarettes hurt people. period. THAT is the bottom line. yes, there are many other things that hurt people as well. and even that doesn't matter. moan and b!tch as much as YOU want about how great cigarette taxes are - but it won't matter when you are dead because of lung cancer, TB or breathe through a hole in your throat now will it?

Originally Posted by Nadir

moan and b!tch as much as YOU want about how great cigarette taxes are - but it won't matter when you are dead because of lung cancer, TB or breathe through a hole in your throat now will it?

I never said it was a great thing nor did I advocate any such thing. I'm telling you the reality of things here. Dont expect your govt to do anything about it. Disagree all you want to Nadir, but the sad truth is people will die from smoking (gladly a point conceded to you) and your govt and mine will not make any serious attempt to curb smoking.

Originally Posted by Kui

I never said it was a great thing nor did I advocate any such thing. I'm telling you the reality of things here. Dont expect your govt to do anything about it. Disagree all you want to Nadir, but the sad truth is people will die from smoking (gladly a point conceded to you) and your govt and mine will not make any serious attempt to curb smoking.

Originally Posted by Kui

I never said it was a great thing nor did I advocate any such thing. I'm telling you the reality of things here. Dont expect your govt to do anything about it. Disagree all you want to Nadir, but the sad truth is people will die from smoking (gladly a point conceded to you) and your govt and mine will not make any serious attempt to curb smoking.

oh i absolutely agree with the fact that the govts won't do anything about. and you are right - govts know about gains from tobacco and therefore will do little about it.

oh well...

Originally Posted by Nadir

oh i absolutely agree with the fact that the govts won't do anything about. and you are right - govts know about gains from tobacco and therefore will do little about it.

oh well...

How can you say governments won't do anything about it ? Think about how many restrictions have been implemented over the last 10-20 years. Serioulsy, you can't smoke in any establishments now. Not restaurants, not bars and no businesses of any sort. The taxes placed on cigarettes is now more than the actual cost of the product and it has become socially unacceptable to smoke, period ! There are many ads put in place by our goverment to deter the next generation from starting.... like all things, it will take time. But I believe there is an effort there.

yah that's right. it totally forgot about the bans. kui, here in ottawa, you cannot smoke indoors at all and ontario has one of the strictest smoking laws in the world.
http://ottawa.cbc.ca/regional/servle...moking20050609

so yes, govts have been doing a lot against smoking. i wasn't thinking when i made that last post - i had just got in from work lol.

Sooner or later ....you all agree with me ...lol

Originally Posted by Staci

How can you say governments won't do anything about it ? Think about how many restrictions have been implemented over the last 10-20 years. Serioulsy, you can't smoke in any establishments now. Not restaurants, not bars and no businesses of any sort. The taxes placed on cigarettes is now more than the actual cost of the product and it has become socially unacceptable to smoke, period ! There are many ads put in place by our goverment to deter the next generation from starting.... like all things, it will take time. But I believe there is an effort there.

The effort is nothing more than to make it look like they're doing something about it. It is nice that you cant smoke in any establishments now, but you guys are joking yourselves to think it has detered people from lighting up. We all know that fact that nicotine is ten times more addictive than heroin right??? Dont expect increase of price will make a smoker blink twice. In fact there will be a treshold on how much you can charge a smoker because if it were to cost over a certain price for some, you will end up having smoke addicts commit crime to support their expensive habit like any other drug user would.
If any govt were serious about this, they would invest in rehab clinics like they do for any other narcotic user. No stupid billboard or common sense talk is going to convince any addict. SO the effort is superficial. AS I said in a earlier post it is nothing more than a shakedown, which happens now and again.

Knowing the multi-party system you friends have in Canada, a candidate purely on a pro-smokers platform could potentially win up 10-15% of votes. With so much political parties in an election, that would spoil a crap load of parties trying to gain seats in Parliament. Why this rationale??? Because again for an addict, this is an important issue to his way of life and electoral trends will show that most people will vote on single issues than across the board multi-issues. Take an issue such as maybe abortion. If you are for women's rights to choose, no matter what other pluses you have as a law-maker, you will not recieve a vote ever from someone who belives in a pro-life stance. Political parties know this so their efforts or campaigns to curb smoke habits is again lacklustre.

Originally Posted by Kui

The effort is nothing more than to make it look like they're doing something about it. It is nice that you cant smoke in any establishments now, but you guys are joking yourselves to think it has detered people from lighting up. We all know that fact that nicotine is ten times more addictive than heroin right??? Dont expect increase of price will make a smoker blink twice. In fact there will be a treshold on how much you can charge a smoker because if it were to cost over a certain price for some, you will end up having smoke addicts commit crime to support their expensive habit like any other drug user would.
If any govt were serious about this, they would invest in rehab clinics like they do for any other narcotic user. No stupid billboard or common sense talk is going to convince any addict. SO the effort is superficial. AS I said in a earlier post it is nothing more than a shakedown, which happens now and again.

actually i know people who quit because they can't afford to buy packets anymore due to the high prices. on the other end of the spectrum , i also know that people buy smuggled cigarettes and the newspapers are full of stories where cigarette smugglers sell them to the public - tax free. so, yes kui, i agree with you that people are breaking laws to feed their habit.

that being said, i am still glad that people can't smoke indoors. i would probably be dead

Originally Posted by Nadir

actually i know people who quit because they can't afford to buy packets anymore due to the high prices. on the other end of the spectrum , i also know that people buy smuggled cigarettes and the newspapers are full of stories where cigarette smugglers sell them to the public - tax free. so, yes kui, i agree with you that people are breaking laws to feed their habit.

that being said, i am still glad that people can't smoke indoors. i would probably be dead

Well that would absolutely suck if you werent around because of some raucher. That would make MM less interesting. It's a bad predicament this smoking thing is because yes it is a health problem and a cash cow. So smokers and non-smokers are stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Several of you seem to have very strong opinions about this topic and are less than impressed with the current efforts of your respective governments. So than I ask...what are YOU doing about it ? Besides sitting idly by expressing you opinions. It seems there is some passion to your arguments. So what are you doing about it ?

Originally Posted by Staci

Several of you seem to have very strong opinions about this topic and are less than impressed with the current efforts of your respective governments. So than I ask...what are YOU doing about it ? Besides sitting idly by expressing you opinions. It seems there is some passion to your arguments. So what are you doing about it ?

Smoking a cigar with a bit of fine and dandy.

Being serious now.
What I or you are doing about it isnt the point, well actually it is the point. Your govt, my govt is not going to do anything serious about it. You can elect yourselves an anti-smoking candidate who will look at the fiscalality of Tobacco revenues and discover a cold reality. The best they can do is appease. If they were serious about it they would go after this drug addiction like any other narcotic. What does an anti heroin sign do for an addict???? Well the same for goes for a smoker. Nothing really. These are addicts we are talking about. Heroin users have rehabs, I have yet to see a rehab for nicotine addicts which is up to 10 times more addictive than heroin.
If the govts crack down on tobacco like they do with any illegal narcotic, they would be cutting themselves out of a good deal of money.
Which is why decriminalizing a lot of narcotics is looking very attractive to some govts including Canada. By legalizing it they can... big word TAX it. Following the money is what they're doing. I'm advocating it. I'm just telling you how it is.