If Galliani didn't mismanage to the degree he did.. He'd have plenty of funds to buy players...
Spending 13M on Matri, when Tevez was available for even less, is one example. Not forcing Pato out when we could have gotten 40M... Not to mention signing Mesbah, Traore, Nocerino, Sokratis, Maxi Lopez,Taiwo, onyewu, legrottaglie, Mancini, salamon, acerbi, Zaccardo, and many more..
The mismanagement of Vila, not keeping Aquilani for 3 M, letting all of the Senatori leave at once .. Being cheap about players like Honda and montolivo.. Never making a move for jorginho or nainggolan.
List is on and on and on ... He's a buklshitter and a puppet of Berlusconi
w no vision.. But instead throwing good money after bad time and time again
02-14-2014, 12:27 AM
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2014, 12:48 AM by maharaja.)
We don't know much about Tevez deal.
When it comes to Pato, how do we know who stopped this transfer?? How to we know that it was not Barbara or her daddy?
Many of the players you mentioned were brought to Milan because the budget was 0 euros. Also how do we know that it was him who did not want to give some money for Honda or Montolivo? Or Ljajic?
If the Berlusconi family gave the money, anyone would spend.
The bigger problem here is that Milan's revenues and expenses are not transparent. And the money we got from huge selling was not reinvested. Basically, the public knows nothing except few broad things we read in media here and there.
For our terrible situation I blame Berlusconi first (and his entire family that is involved), and then his 'puppet' Galiani
We are in a deep crisis and the family are not going to sell, to be honest the best change we can hope for is Galliani leaving and someone better comes in, if you think Galliani gets F then someone who gets D, if you think he deserves A then someone who gets A+. Whether the blame is Berlusconi's 10%, 50% or 100% is not really important any more. Let's see if moving forward this will change but the 'past' damage is done.
(02-13-2014, 09:25 PM)maharaja Wrote: Any general manager that we might have after Galliani will not be any better, as long as there is the Berlusconi family owning our club. They are not investing, and maybe they are even taking the money from the club (we don't know that).
If they don't invest in their club, what is the point of having them as the owners??
Galliani, or whoever, will just have to work with the minimal transfer funds. At least Galliani can work some miracles as with Ibrahimovic few years ago. You are wrong ,they are not taking money because theres none to take.Milan while in better shape still lost around €6million last year.
Galliani has horribly managed the budget allocated to him ,we have Italys highest wage bill and are still up there as one of Europes highest ...now look at the squad..Its about €40-€50 million higher than it should be theres yout transfer budget ,that Galliani deprives himself of.He makes horrible moves like a Essien ,he saw freeeee but Essiens wages over the 1.5 years would of covered the fee for Jorginho a 22 year old with huge potential.
To say Berlusconi must invest is not that easy when you look at how much we spend.Better MGT & moving to our own stadium is how we'll get back to the top.Not with Berlu throwing good money after bad.
Galliani is the biggest reason why we're in thr position we're in now.Not Berlu even though hes not blameless.
Just look at how many players in Milan who can't even play regularly for the current Milan and you will know where the money gone.
Milan is the only professional football team that I know of who is paying good wages to their 4th or 5th CB, backup fullbacks, 4th or 5th choice CM or 4th striker. While the rest of the football world actually use their youth system to fill those spots. And this has been happening over the past 10 yrs. AS I really doubt Milan youth is so horrible that they could not produce a 4th or 5th CB or any backup players for the past 10 yrs. Guys like Martin Laursen, Coloccini and even Astori are all as good as Milan 4th or 5th CB, during different periods of the past 10 yrs or so. Yet did Milan use them? They would rather sign guys like Bonera(who turning into Milan best defender is a huge joke in itself), Yepes, Acerbi, Senderous, that Greek CB, Legro, that American CB, Salamon, Zaccardo and Silvestre. Beside Yepes, who did quite well, the rest pretty much played filled the space on a roster that I am sure Darmian, Alberterzzi, Ely or whomever could have done with more upside, passion and determination along with being 1/5 of the other wages.
Right now Milan have 29 players in their squad. And they also loaned out Niang, Nocerino, Troare, Matri and Vergara.
And is currently loaning 3 players, in Silvestre, Taarabt and Rami.
Since Rami is actually signed, and say Milan would not renew Silvestre and Taarabt and the other clubs won't renew the 5 players that loaned out. Milan will have a squad of 32 players.
This squad of 32 players, and say the average wage before tax of that squad is 3.59mil as the total wage bill is 115mil Euros according to http://www.tsmplug.com/football/ac-milan...ries-2014/ . That figures included Boateng and Antonini, but excluded Essien, Honda, Rami, and Birsa. Thus wage bill should be higher but for my argument I am just using the average wage for players at 3.59mil as an example.
Now of the 32 players, guys like Nocerino, Mexes, Robinho, Matri, Amelia, Muntari, Troare, Birsa, Zaccardo, Urby and Vegara. Should all be on the market and gone from Milan regardless of the offers. Even if it means Milan playing for some of their wages in order for them to play on another team, b/c lets face it paying 1mil each to them on wages are much better than paying the 3.59mil to sit on Milan bench.
That saving on wages should take care of the absent CL income, while the transfer fees if any from the sale of those players can be work into the transfer budget for summer. But even without any new players, Milan should be set with the following players.
GK: Abbiatti and Gabriel with a 3GK from youth team
FB: Abate, DES, Constant and another youth product
CB: Rami, Zapata, Bonera and Ely or other youth product
Mid: Essien, De Jong, Poli, Cristante, and Monty
ATM: Kaka, Sapanora and Honda
FW: Niang, Pazzo, Mario, SES and Petagna.
The defense might be abit weak and should be the only area that needs signings.
02-14-2014, 11:14 AM
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2014, 11:20 AM by ACMILAN1983.)
(02-13-2014, 08:50 PM)ElMago99 Wrote: Yep from EURO's in 2012.. I remember it well... Sad. I'm old fashioned in that way... I don't care how good someone is.. if they're an idiot.. I don't want him on my team. They say CR7 is the hardest worker on the team.. or perhaps any team. With all his weirdness and cockiness, I'd rather a guy like him (not to mention he's best in world).
This is the thing I respect about Ronaldo. I don't particularly like his attitude, arrogance and individuality (i.e. often teams will change to accomodate him) and I think he plays in an era which favours individuality and attackers more than ever. That said, no one, absolutely no one can take away the amount of work this guy puts in to being a top class player. Since he broke out at Sporting, I've not once heard anyone say this guy's effort in training and developing his skills has been anything but exceptional. It's no surprise that people often comment on how Messi is more about natural talent, while Ronaldo's the product of hard work and training.
(02-14-2014, 12:27 AM)maharaja Wrote: We don't know much about Tevez deal.
When it comes to Pato, how do we know who stopped this transfer?? How to we know that it was not Barbara or her daddy?
Many of the players you mentioned were brought to Milan because the budget was 0 euros. Also how do we know that it was him who did not want to give some money for Honda or Montolivo? Or Ljajic?
If the Berlusconi family gave the money, anyone would spend.
The bigger problem here is that Milan's revenues and expenses are not transparent. And the money we got from huge selling was not reinvested. Basically, the public knows nothing except few broad things we read in media here and there.
For our terrible situation I blame Berlusconi first (and his entire family that is involved), and then his 'puppet' Galiani
We never know the full details but we can make some educated guesses. The Berlusconi family (mainly Silvio) is at fault, I don't think that's ever been in question. My issue isn't that Silvio has stopped pumping money into the club, that bubble was going to burst sooner or later. My issue was that he has treated the club literally as his political tool without any foresight to help it as a business. He pumps money into it to get what he wants, but hasn't put any effort into getting it running as a business. This isn't anything new, history has often shown that often football clubs are either rich people's toys or they're socialist run groups. Now, with the advent of new ways of thinking, with imo Bayern, Real and Barca leading the charge (the latter two are still very questionable mind), clubs are being treated as business, with products to sell and the aim to be run with revenue generated.
This is why Barbara is important imo. Her "public" outlook on Milan since she came into some power has always been that Milan should be run like a business. She isn't talking about gifts from Silvio, nor is she trying to spin stories about Milan's history and us being the most successful club in the world. Her comments have almost always been about Milan as a brand, about developing players based on other successful models, about increasing revenue streams and increasing the brand globally.
Now onto Galliani. His issue isn't about the lack of money now, it's about the incorrect spending for years, stretching back to the Ancelotti era. Barbara during this period wasn't involved in Milan, she's only been around for a couple of years, only in power for about 1. Silvio, pretty much straight after he spent to build the side that Ancelotti had, stopped any significant involvement in Milan due to his political career. Even now, his involvement in Milan is minimal as he's got so much on his plate (political and legal). Proof in the pudding is we regularly hear how he cancels appointments at the club due to other matters, this after he declared he would take more active involvement in running the club (I think he is grooming Barbara for long term leadership here).
So ultimately, the question is who has been running the show while the Berlusconis haven't? In my view it's Galliani. This guy is often the face behind all of our big decisions. He's the one handing out contracts, contract extensions, agreeing deals for players etc. Berlu might have the final say on things, but Galliani has been making decisions, ones which Berlu doesn't even like, for a long time.
You only need to look at some of the recent ongoings to see how much power this guy has. Allegri was never particularly wanted by Berlu, Galliani convinced Berlu to get him. Likewise, during his tenure at Milan, Berlu never took him seriously, often publicly humiliating him, ready to fire him for a long time after a number of disagreements which became public knowledge. Allegri rarely said that he and Berlu were in agreement, but ultimately Galliani was the reason Allegri was at Milan for 3 and a half years. Likewise, there was Leonardo, another Galliani pick. Then there's Balotelli, who Berlu called a rotten apple just before Galliani signed him. To me, this is evidence that Galliani holds a lot of power at Milan.
Ultimately, the Berlusconi family (notably Silvio and Marina, who heads Finnivest) might be the ones who decide how much money is pumped into Milan, but evidence suggests not only does Galliani have input into how that money is spent, but has the power to effectively decide how the money is used.
Even if the Berlusconi family don't pump money into the club, we should have all the means to be highly competitive in Italy. It's years of bad contracts, bad signings, bad renewals and poor decisions that have lead to where we are.
(02-14-2014, 11:14 AM)ACMILAN1983 Wrote: (02-14-2014, 12:27 AM)maharaja Wrote: We don't know much about Tevez deal.
When it comes to Pato, how do we know who stopped this transfer?? How to we know that it was not Barbara or her daddy?
Many of the players you mentioned were brought to Milan because the budget was 0 euros. Also how do we know that it was him who did not want to give some money for Honda or Montolivo? Or Ljajic?
If the Berlusconi family gave the money, anyone would spend.
The bigger problem here is that Milan's revenues and expenses are not transparent. And the money we got from huge selling was not reinvested. Basically, the public knows nothing except few broad things we read in media here and there.
For our terrible situation I blame Berlusconi first (and his entire family that is involved), and then his 'puppet' Galiani
We never know the full details but we can make some educated guesses. The Berlusconi family (mainly Silvio) is at fault, I don't think that's ever been in question. My issue isn't that Silvio has stopped pumping money into the club, that bubble was going to burst sooner or later. My issue was that he has treated the club literally as his political tool without any foresight to help it as a business. He pumps money into it to get what he wants, but hasn't put any effort into getting it running as a business. This isn't anything new, history has often shown that often football clubs are either rich people's toys or they're socialist run groups. Now, with the advent of new ways of thinking, with imo Bayern, Real and Barca leading the charge (the latter two are still very questionable mind), clubs are being treated as business, with products to sell and the aim to be run with revenue generated.
This is why Barbara is important imo. Her "public" outlook on Milan since she came into some power has always been that Milan should be run like a business. She isn't talking about gifts from Silvio, nor is she trying to spin stories about Milan's history and us being the most successful club in the world. Her comments have almost always been about Milan as a brand, about developing players based on other successful models, about increasing revenue streams and increasing the brand globally.
Now onto Galliani. His issue isn't about the lack of money now, it's about the incorrect spending for years, stretching back to the Ancelotti era. Barbara during this period wasn't involved in Milan, she's only been around for a couple of years, only in power for about 1. Silvio, pretty much straight after he spent to build the side that Ancelotti had, stopped any significant involvement in Milan due to his political career. Even now, his involvement in Milan is minimal as he's got so much on his plate (political and legal). Proof in the pudding is we regularly hear how he cancels appointments at the club due to other matters, this after he declared he would take more active involvement in running the club (I think he is grooming Barbara for long term leadership here).
So ultimately, the question is who has been running the show while the Berlusconis haven't? In my view it's Galliani. This guy is often the face behind all of our big decisions. He's the one handing out contracts, contract extensions, agreeing deals for players etc. Berlu might have the final say on things, but Galliani has been making decisions, ones which Berlu doesn't even like, for a long time.
You only need to look at some of the recent ongoings to see how much power this guy has. Allegri was never particularly wanted by Berlu, Galliani convinced Berlu to get him. Likewise, during his tenure at Milan, Berlu never took him seriously, often publicly humiliating him, ready to fire him for a long time after a number of disagreements which became public knowledge. Allegri rarely said that he and Berlu were in agreement, but ultimately Galliani was the reason Allegri was at Milan for 3 and a half years. Likewise, there was Leonardo, another Galliani pick. Then there's Balotelli, who Berlu called a rotten apple just before Galliani signed him. To me, this is evidence that Galliani holds a lot of power at Milan.
Ultimately, the Berlusconi family (notably Silvio and Marina, who heads Finnivest) might be the ones who decide how much money is pumped into Milan, but evidence suggests not only does Galliani have input into how that money is spent, but has the power to effectively decide how the money is used.
Even if the Berlusconi family don't pump money into the club, we should have all the means to be highly competitive in Italy. It's years of bad contracts, bad signings, bad renewals and poor decisions that have lead to where we are.
Thanks for this post.
I would like to have more information about our club(as I guess that is what we all want). I know that it is a private, and owned by one family, but even there some accountability should exist. In football, they earn significant amount from their 'customers' - fans.
The sad thing is that in modern football a club can't compete at the top level without huge investment from the boss. Just look at the English clubs. Even lower-ranked teams invest more money. Not to mention how much money the Glazer family invested, and how much money they plan to spend this summer (Today I heard around 100m GBP). If you are a wealthy businessman you don't own a football club to make a profit, basically it is impossible.
Another problem is Italy's tax system. They should use their political power to decrease taxes for wages (This is probably naive of me to think that it is possible in Italian politics).
Regarding Galliani, well he does have a lot of power (I think that he is formally a CEO), but when I look for someone to blame, I blame the top of the hierarchy first. If he is to go, I would also like the whole Berlusconni family to go.
(02-14-2014, 04:02 PM)Arildonardo Wrote: "Milan offer Alex two-year deal"
http://www.football-italia.net/45216/mil...-year-deal
And he wants to wait to see of PSG offer him a deal.Thats what weve come to...waiting on a 32 yr old Alex
02-14-2014, 08:56 PM
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2014, 09:05 PM by ElMago99.)
(02-14-2014, 12:27 AM)maharaja Wrote: We don't know much about Tevez deal.
When it comes to Pato, how do we know who stopped this transfer?? How to we know that it was not Barbara or her daddy?
Many of the players you mentioned were brought to Milan because the budget was 0 euros. Also how do we know that it was him who did not want to give some money for Honda or Montolivo? Or Ljajic?
If the Berlusconi family gave the money, anyone would spend.
The bigger problem here is that Milan's revenues and expenses are not transparent. And the money we got from huge selling was not reinvested. Basically, the public knows nothing except few broad things we read in media here and there.
For our terrible situation I blame Berlusconi first (and his entire family that is involved), and then his 'puppet' Galiani
Understandable. We don't know a lot. Therefore, Berlusconi (the owner) is first to blame. Galliani (if he has any power at all) fucked up a lot. He basically wasted a lot of money on contracts when he could have used them to acquire higher quality players.. and lowering the overall squad number by at least 5 players.. and we'd still have more than enough.
(02-14-2014, 02:17 PM)maharaja Wrote: Another problem is Italy's tax system. They should use their political power to decrease taxes for wages (This is probably naive of me to think that it is possible in Italian politics).
Without getting too political... it's known that if you want to kill something, don't make it illegal, instead Tax it. Making Drugs illegal only creates underground black markets. If you tax it.. you'll kill it.
In economics this is known.
Therefore when you tax something you kill it. You tax business, you kill it. You tax football players wages, and you'll kill the football in that country too. It's really that simple.
We had to pay Ibra a lot more because of taxes... and the club got hurt.
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