Milan v Chievo October 25th ...

Originally Posted by Jim_UK

Yes it does matter! What's easier for a young player? To play in midfield, put in good performances and be carried by 4 other midfielders when things don't go so well? Or be your team's main striker, to lead the line and carry the majority of responsibility for your team winning? For an 18 year old bursting onto the scene IN A DEMANDING LEAGUE (for those who didn't read that the first time i mentioned it!) it's easier and more common to find young first choice midfielders than young first choice strikers. So your whole argument that Gilardino didn't do so well in his early seasons at Verona and Parma is for my money null & void as he was clearly still learning the art of a striker.

Look...you again didnt get the idea. What I was saying is that there are young players (strikers, midfilders, goalkeepers, defenders) with consistently good performance. It doesnt really matter how old are you, if you have talent - you ll play good...if not...then it doesnt matter wheather you are 18 or 29. So my examples of attacking midfilders are relevant.

Originally Posted by Jim_UK

lets see ... Raul has been poor for over 12 months and is finally coming back to some decent form, this is the leading goal scorer in CL history don't forget so i'd say he has some pedigree. Crespo was rubbish for a while before he came to us and then again while he was with us. Morientes was awful at Liverpool for 18 months, yet has recaptured his form at Valencia. RVN suffered a dip in form for a few months. These things have happened to more established players than Gilardino, they came back, so can our man!

Being poor is different from having "0 - goal period" for so long, considering that Gila was always in the starting line up..only now the situation is changing for him.

Originally Posted by Jim_UK

What does Phillips and Beattie have to do with Egoistka declaring that all of Gilardino's goals for Parma in his last 2 seasons for them were down to luck? I'm not denying the fact that some strikers have good seasons and then for the rest of the time they aren't as prolific. But saying all of his 50 odd goals are down to luck? Get real!

I didnt say 50 odd goals...I said why he scored them. I think Gilardino is one lucky goal time wonderer. Its like some singers who ve done only one song, but so great that people still listen it in 20 years time and like it.

Originally Posted by Vadim

Keep the discussion civil and keep personal matters out of it. Its getting annoying, the forums are lately only about Gila, Gila, Gila.

BTW Welcome Icculus

The reason why everybody talks about Gila now is because he is a real big problem...Milan needs goals

Originally Posted by Egoistka

The reason why everybody talks about Gila now is because he is a real big problem...Milan needs goals

Inzaghi and Oliveira are there too...

Originally Posted by egoistka

he scored 5 goals in the first season and another 50 in the second and third. After that he moved to Milan....I dont really see brilliant statistics...Two lucky seasons. Yes, it is called luck, and nothing else.

Yes, you said why Gilardino scored those goals ......... through luck! That is exactly what you said.

Poor form or 0 goals, i would imagine they are pretty similar. I doubt any of the players i mentioned were scoring alot considering the form they were in.

Jim... you talk about Serie A bein' a demandin' league... yeah you are right... but at the same time... Milan has demandin' fans (me bein' one of them)... and we demand a top quality striker that can score... so are we wrong in that sense? if Gilardino is not that solution... surely it is not wrong of us to bench him...

the whole SerieA being a demanding league thing for me is abject nonesense. I was really a follower of the doctrine up until I saw Tevez, Sheva and Crespo struggling. I am also convinced the especially Gila wouldn't make it in England. To me Spain is the only place where it is relatively easy to score and its also for this reason I am cautious about looking to ronaldinho/ Torres as our saviour.

Anyway Milan always at least had a great striker up fornt whether it was Sheva, Bierhoff Weah or MVB. No one but no one can tell me that Gila is in the class of any of these. For this reason he isn't Milan Material. There are many much better players his age and younger who have been held to much higher standards at smaller clubs. e.g. Nilmar was sent back to Brazil DESPITE his scoring for (PSG?) Fred gets the bench ever so often at Lyon Rooney is harshly criticized despite him already scoring three goals this season. All these guys are younger and come form smaller clubs. So why do we have to put up with Gila?

Bierhoff was brilliant at heading, but couldnt dripple the ball very well, and could only really use 1 of his legs. Gila on the other hand beats him on the ground, in the air Bierhoff is better... But again they are different types of players...

Of course it's not wrong to be demanding Dan, i am demanding just like most other fans. But i don't buy this ridiculous notion though that a prolonged period of stuttering in front of goal from Gilardino means we should sell him immediately! Bench him? Sure. Make him fight for us place? Of course. But keep in mind we only have limited options up front, so wether the anti-gila people like it or not, he will get more opportunities than some think he deserves. But sell him? No way.

Drucurl you're not getting the point about demanding leagues. Scoring alot of goals in a demanding league such as Serie A, Premiership or La Liga is more difficult than in leagues from Brazil, France or Holland. Now do you see the point?

Where on earth do you get the idea that people supporting Gilardino are saying he's as good as Shevchenko, Van Basten, Weah or even Bierhoff?

Jim_UK
Registered User

Of course it's not wrong to be demanding Dan, i am demanding just like most other fans. But i don't buy this ridiculous notion though that a prolonged period of stuttering in front of goal from Gilardino means we should sell him immediately! Bench him? Sure. Make him fight for us place? Of course. But keep in mind we only have limited options up front, so wether the anti-gila people like it or not, he will get more opportunities than some think he deserves. But sell him? No way.

Drucurl you're not getting the point about demanding leagues. Scoring alot of goals in a demanding league such as Serie A, Premiership or La Liga is more difficult than in leagues from Brazil, France or Holland. Now do you see the point?

Where on earth do you get the idea that people supporting Gilardino are saying he's as good as Shevchenko, Van Basten, Weah or even Bierhoff?

Well the fact that we have all acknowledged that he isn't means that he shouldn't be our starting foward. Our starting fowards have always been among the world's best or at least near to them (except Jose Maria).

This admission in itself is the point of much of the "anti-gila" camp.

I don't see how Holland is seen as a lower league either. MVB and a boatload of Serie, Permiership and LA Liga stars came form there, so I don't get your point. In any case, you were implying that Italy is more demanading than England. If you viewed England as a demanding league then you wouldn't have dismissed my examples of Phillips Beattie etc or the point that Rooney and Robinho Ronaldo have all performed in "demanding leagues" as well so please re-formulate your ideas and try again!

i'm never in favour of sellin' Gilardino despite sometimes mentionin' it... i may not be nice with my posts about him here... but for sure... i am defendin' him whenever in the presence of my other friends who keeps remindin' me about his lack of goals...

my motto in life is simple... never settle for second best... because once you do... you will never be able to fulfill your own potential... and it will limit yourself to mediocrity...

and at the moment... Gilardino is second best & his performances is barely adequate...

Originally Posted by drucurl

Well the fact that we have all acknowledged that he isn't means that he shouldn't be our starting foward. Our starting fowards have always been among the world's best or at least near to them (except Jose Maria).

So Oliveira, Boriello and Inzaghi are among or near to the world's best? No, i didn't think so either.

Originally Posted by drucurl

I don't see how Holland is seen as a lower league either. MVB and a boatload of Serie, Permiership and LA Liga stars came form there, so I don't get your point.

You're saying that it's just as hard to score in Holland as it is to score in England, La Liga & Serie A? Sorry, i can't agree with you at all there.

Originally Posted by drucurl

In any case, you were implying that Italy is more demanading than England. If you viewed England as a demanding league then you wouldn't have dismissed my examples of Phillips Beattie etc or the point that Rooney and Robinho Ronaldo have all performed in "demanding leagues" as well so please re-formulate your ideas and try again!

I did nothing of the sort, how i phrased my post and how you interpreted it seem to be two different things. It's not my fault if you grasped it wrong, i think it's you who need to try again

poor gila...
the fact that he makes more $$ in one year than i will make in a life time makes it hard for me to have too much sympathy for him, however...

i just started following soccer (football) about 3 yrs ago & was extremely excited gila. with all the hype, my son and i thought he was the second coming of (insert great player here).

i think the big question is "how long does he get to start performing on the level expected?" - couple games, 1/2 a season, a full year...2 yrs?

the smaller question is "if he doesnt turn it around, & i think everyone agrees he must, what sort of market will there be for him?" -

whatever the case, i think we all really, really, really want him to play up to his expected level.

Hey how about Dida...a lot of people were running him out of town b4 the beginning of the season...and he has looked stellar.

Firstly, before I reply, don't swear, it's against forum rules. (goes for all posters)

Originally Posted by Egoistka

Why do you compare Gila to Boriello. This comparison doesnt have any ground, same as comparison between Gila and Oliveira. Boriello and RO didnt immidiately get the place in the starting line up, unlike Gilardino. They had only several games to prove themselves, considering that they almost never play the full game or from the start of it. Yes Boriello misssed many opportunities...nobody here says that he ve done really well, but Boriello havent got any chances to play, what do you expect from him. He is a bench man.

I was talking about the Chievo match, where Borriello had just as good chances as Gila and missed, yet there were no real complaints (just a few laughs) over that. My point is every player in the squad has a role to perform and they are expected to do the job when called on. Currently, NONE of our forwards are doing their job, but only Gila is getting complaints. Blaming the individual when clearly there are deeper issues is just pointless.

Oh yeah? He contributes by loosing the ball, wasting 100 percent goal opportunities and not scoring goals at all? Do you mean this contribution? Stop mentioning THE PRESSURE...Its ****! (I m not going to sware, but everyone understands what I mean). About his assist statistics for the last season....he had 2 assists for the whole previous year. Is it considered the greatest number of assists?

This argument is just plain stupid. Firstly, he statiscally counted up for having 10 assists all of last season (like I've mentioned, this probably includes penalties won). Of course, in the situations where he did win freekicks or penalties, you'll probably argue back he shouldn't have been getting fouled and should've scored anyway . He's very good at holding up the ball and waiting for midfield support. He makes fairly intelligent runs and drops deep very well when required.

Also, the pressure he is under is very real, because his form has been blown out of proportion and everyone seems to act like he's the sole reason for our stagnant attack.

Gila played for Hellas Verona for 2 seasons and scored only 5 goals, then he moved to Parma where he scored 5 goals in the first season and another 50 in the second and third. After that he moved to Milan....I dont really see brilliant statistics...Two lucky seasons. Yes, it is called luck, and nothing else. The second season was lucky and third he scored many goals only because of being UP...being not moody. Maybe he should have stayed in Parma...he is not MIlan quality player.

lol, yes, I believe you when you see that good scoring records in 3 successive seasons is based purely on luck. When he was at Verona he was VERY young and just barely breaking through and his first season at Parma wasn't a key player.

In CL Gila cannot score, in Seria A Gila is not scoring for a long long long period...So yes, of course, he is a brilliant striker! Just THE ONE we need. Gila is just a dream of every team...

Oh yes, clearly Gilardino is a waste of our time because everyone knows that decent strikers won't have times when they're struggling. If we followed your logic, Inzaghi and Sheva would have been sold off long ago.

About the target man...yes Sheva left, but even playing with Sheva Gila didnt score in the second half of the season. Now there is Kaka...so there is help for Gila. Dont try to say that noone helps him, noone passes on him...Its not everybody's fault that Gila is not scoring - it is Gila's fault.
STOP constantly mentioning PRESSURE, POOR SERVICE etc....This is not the problem. What is Kaka supposed to do (or Pirlo, Oliveira, Inzaghi, Seedorf, Kaladze....)? Push Gilardino with the ball to the net, so he d finally score?

Notice that Gila's form dropped as Inzaghi was returning and Sheva's form had dropped. He isn't a player who is capable of doing huge things on his own (like Sheva and Kaka), he's a goalscorer who needs to be supplied opportunities and needs others to help him open up defences (like Pippo and Crespo).

Quite frankly your arguments suggests of you having a greater personal issue with Gila than him really performing as badly as you say. Half of the arguments you present are a completely joke (lucky to score 20+ goals in 2 successive seasons ) and those where you possibly have a valid point are so heavily dramatised and subjectively masked with a clear disliking of the player that you ruin your own argument.

I'm not happy about Gila's performances this year, but the way he's treated is a complete joke. If I was him, I'd probably consider leaving Milan because the attitude of some fans is just disgusting.

^ the way he's treated? Easy there sparky Gila won't ever read this forum so I doubt you can hurt his feelings.

Jim UK I was not saying that it is as easy to score in Holland as in England just merely that the gap isn't as huge as you might suppose. Gosh you English are conceited about your league aren't you?

I am beginning to doubt your literacy as well since I said "our starting fowards" which would rule out the list you so generously posted

Originally Posted by drucurl

^ the way he's treated? Easy there sparky Gila won't ever read this forum so I doubt you can hurt his feelings.

Firstly, you are in no position to say whether he knows or reads this forum, or do you know him personally?

Besides, I'm talking about respect, not just his feelings. The lack of respect he gets from posters here is vomit inducing, and I'm ashamed that Milan fans treat their players that way.