Summer Mercato

Modric not world class? maybe before 3 years... i watched him regularly since 2004,2005... he has it all... consistency, stamina, pace, dribbling, creativity, technique, MAGNIFICENT passing, even free kicks, performs in every big match... he only lacks strong shot. world class midfielder..

he is way better than Seedorf or Deco. trust me in that... and yes, as drucurl says, we've became too arrogant.

Originally Posted by drucurl

Pirlo
Fabregas, Gerrard, Anderson

Agree on most of what u`ve said...but this is plain wrong....Cesc and Anderson haven`t done anything yet to be compared to Pirlo..Gerrard is there,but its anyones guess....

Pirlo is twice CL winner, and a World CUp winner(arguably the best player of the tournament) and a player with unique talent.We have struggled to replace him since the day Carlo put him in that position against Juve.

Dru:

In response to my list, you present a new list. Instead of defending your original argument, you start another?

The point is bro, we were debating world class transfers already completed this season to date. Few, if any of those you mentioned, I would consider worthy of Milan.

That you find so many players better than the ones that we have is neither here nor there...we all knowthat there are many players in Milan who arent generally considered world class...but for eg...Rino, he isnt world class?

Which by the way, is my definition of being "worthy" of a Milan shirt....or, if not, having that potential, which is subjective, and nebulous in and of itself.

So, the same way you consider a world cup winner not to be world/Milan class, is the same way I consider him to be world/Milan class...its all subjective bro...my criteria can and does include being a World Cup winner, and still not past your sell-by date...eg Rino.

Only time will tell if the three players you consider world class on our team will be supplemented by others...only time will tell who we buy this mercato.

So why panic now? Why despair yet? Why not save the stress for something really important? Like thinking about what Ronaldo did b4 he discovered the "females" were really "shemales" after all...

Until R10, Adebayor, Drogba, Etoo, Deco, Marquez, Zapata, Zambrotta, Vargas, et al are all sold, [and not to Milan] and I see the press conference with them holding up their new club´s shirt, I will remain calm cool and collected.

And dont hate, just because what I can get in JA tops what you can get in T&T...appreciate!

Originally Posted by AlessandroNesta

Modric not world class? maybe before 3 years... i watched him regularly since 2004,2005... he has it all... consistency, stamina, pace, dribbling, creativity, technique, MAGNIFICENT passing, even free kicks, performs in every big match... he only lacks strong shot. world class midfielder..

he is way better than Seedorf or Deco. trust me in that... and yes, as drucurl says, we've became too arrogant.

If there people who still question weather C.Ronaldo, Ibra are a world class player its normal that somebody would question Modric,

only we that follow Croatian league and Croation national team can talk about Modric, however his yet to prove himself on the big stage....and I`m quit sure Warro will know what Modric is capable of after EURO

to those who said relax and don't panic, the clock hasn't even started yet... that's true.. but when we wake up and rush, all the needed players are settled down with either our rivals or some clubs in germany. the point is to act fast, kill fast ppl. you guys really think flamini would have signed with us knowing that we won't play in CL next season? he signed after we won inter. and yeah.. we can relax until after euro and then buy players with double price (if we still act and lucky), or end up with old and left food from other club.

to those who do examine the rumoured players saying they are not worth or world class to play for us. sorry but i have to say we are way too aggorant and yet havent done any real investment in wc players recent years, except for nesta and kaka. its kind a dilemma, ppl want wc players, but they are expensive and we wont buy, and the rest are yet-to-be wc, but a little (still) expensive and our scout are too innocent to see that and we won't buy either. and in the end we end up with players like emerson, brocchi, or, in another familiar script "we are world champions and we don't need to buy anyone b/c they are not".

Originally Posted by kastriot

Agree on most of what u`ve said...but this is plain wrong....Cesc and Anderson haven`t done anything yet to be compared to Pirlo..Gerrard is there,but its anyones guess....

Pirlo is twice CL winner, and a World CUp winner(arguably the best player of the tournament) and a player with unique talent.We have struggled to replace him since the day Carlo put him in that position against Juve.

I wouldn't put Anderson there as yet but I'd DEFINITELY put Cesc there. Cesc does all what Pirlo does for us (ball distribution and breaking up counter attacks at times) PLUS he adds direct assists AND goal scoring. What's not to prefer about that ? The only thing I'm not sure about is whether Cesc takes free kicks or not.

P.S. Yes I saw Pirlo at the world cup but for some reason or other he cannot replicate that sort of form with Milan.

There is talk about Milan going for Evra which IMO is an excellent move, I heard he's asking for a lot of money from United and there maybe trouble brewing.

Also with the talk about Modric you must understand Tottenham is on the same level as Chelsea when it comes to buying players, they have a sugar daddy in the form of Levy. Paying over 16 million on raw talent is a very very big gamble, a gamble which I hope pays off for Modrics sake - however I'm not sure he can excel in an environment like that of Tottenhams. I'm still recovering from the amount of money they paid for Bent rofl.

Originally Posted by Mystik

P.S. Yes I saw Pirlo at the world cup but for some reason or other he cannot replicate that sort of form with Milan.

Simple:

The reasons are : LIPPI,ZAMBROTA & GROSSO

Originally Posted by Siregar

I think you mistunderstood me Jeff. What I meant that why we haven't signed any player who is not WC player or super star?

I do think, that we also need some unknown players (not-yet WC players/superstars) for our backups as ourbackups are not so good. But in this case, Milan haven't signed anyone except Flamini (of couse he is already very well known) whom Milan had to sign him very soon otherwise other club would sign him.

I understand, it needs time to accomplish the signing of big names. And we still have much time to buy all players we want but IMO at least we should buy those players I mention above in this stage so we don't have to rush in July or August to complete all our transfers.

All valid points, which raise 3 interesting questions:

1) Are we good at training the not-yet WC players/superstars? Gourcuff, Gilardino... Milan doesn't seem to be the best place for that. There are Ajax, Arsenal etc. who do a much much better job.

2) Do these players fit well with our system? We do have a 4-3-2-1 system, sometimes 4-3-1-2, with two wingers who can't cross, if you will . Gila is supposed to do well, but he flops completely partially because of our system (or simply he is a flop).

3) Are these players willing to come to Milan only knowing that they are going to spend most of the time on the bench? We have Gourcuff as an example. And think about it: IF Gourcuff can't make it and impress the coach during training, and he is supposed to be one of the top talents, then why will Milan be able to train up these non superstars?

In the future if we want to challenge for the Scudetto and the CL, we need, like Kaka` says, 20 champions. Not just the starting eleven.

That's how Man U succeeded this year, right? It will take us a lot of time to succeed on both fronts, and the club has decided mostly to concentrate on the CL. Man U did it this year but hey, they haven't won the CL until like 10 years later. So, in my opinion it's a trade off.

Can Man U do it again next year? I don't know; it'll probably depend on luck as well, but the point is clear: you need great players on and off the bench (not like Brocchi) who can do great when they come on the field. Not easy, but that's how you want to win trophIES in one season.

J

Originally Posted by drucurl

DIDA
Buffon, Cassilas, Cech

None available for transfer this season, LLoris, Boruc and Gomes could be...not against any one of those coming, and they still can!

Originally Posted by drucurl

KALA
Alex, Ferdinand, Vidic

Again, only Alex maybe available, and he would be very expensive...easily 20M pounds....worth the risk? Hmmmmmm And Zapata is a target, and not yet sold..so again, why worry?

Originally Posted by drucurl

JANKU
Evra, Cole, Marcello

None available for transfer this summer....but arent we targetting Zambrotta/Vargas?

Originally Posted by drucurl

ODDO
Alves, Ramos, Maicon

Only Alves is available, but we all know he would cost as much as R10 and Zambrotta combined...prefer that option personally.

Originally Posted by drucurl

Gattuso
Essien, Vieria, Cambiasso

Agreed...but again, only Essien would probably be available, and again, would cost huge sums..easily 20M pounds, and we already have Flamini...and Viera, is done. Rino has one or two years left in him...more if he comes on as Flamini´s sub after the 2 years.

Originally Posted by drucurl

Pirlo
Fabregas, Gerrard, Anderson

You got to b kidding me. None of these is as good as Pirlo, and none are available. NONE.

Originally Posted by drucurl

Seedorf (in a wide position)
Ribery, Quaresma, Figo

Figo? When, 3 years ago? Certainly not now, and certainly not when Seedorf is fit. Quaresma has to prove that outside of Portugal, and Ribery, well, he is class, and would be one of the few I would supplant Seedorf with, the other, R10, or Messi...and lets not forget, Carlo wanted him, but was denied, because we had Gourcuff...which admittedly didnt work out that well.

Originally Posted by drucurl

Seedorf (CAM)
Totti, Diego, Ronaldinho

R10 is on his way..or havent you heard? Diego isnt sold yet, and so is potentially available, and Totti is way too old, and wasbetter than Clarence before this season, but not now. No way, he is too injury prone.

Originally Posted by drucurl

Inzaghi
Drogba, Eto'o, Torres

And yet one of these 3 might find themselves in a Milan shirt this season..so what are we fussing about, in the last week of May...like its Sept 1 or something?

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

In response to my list, you present a new list. Instead of defending your original argument, you start another?

The POINT is that just like you can find better players than I listed, I too can find better players to what exists in our present squad

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

The point is bro, we were debating world class transfers already completed this season to date. Few, if any of those you mentioned, I would consider worthy of Milan

I wasn't debating about world class I was merely talking about good players that would have fit in well. Quaresma and Alves ARE world class imo but Gomez is as yet only a good but largely unproven player

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

That you find so many players better than the ones that we have is neither here nor there...we all knowthat there are many players in Milan who arent generally considered world class...but for eg...Rino, he isnt world class?

No he isn't...certainly not of the Bekenbauer, Roy Keane, Rijkaard or even Vieria or Cambiasso ilk. Gattuso is passionate and a motivator for sure but in terms of his FOOTBALLING accomplishments he offers precious little. Many of his tackles result in fouls/free kicks. Thankfully he's reasonably efficient (so on a good day he can contain most attacks) and fair (so that he doesn't get carded all day)

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

Which by the way, is my definition of being "worthy" of a Milan shirt....or, if not, having that potential, which is subjective, and nebulous in and of itself.

Then how about not using it say till we're back on top of the world/CL again

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

So, the same way you consider a world cup winner not to be world/Milan class, is the same way I consider him to be world/Milan class...its all subjective bro...my criteria can and does include being a World Cup winner, and still not past your sell-by date...eg Rino.

Reasonable definition I must say but of course this would necessarily exclude the likes of Nedved, Figo, Torres, the whole Argentina team.....while INCLUDING the likes of Emerson, Edmilson and Roque Junior when these were at their peaks. Wanna revise that statement

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

Only time will tell if the three players you consider world class on our team will be supplemented by others...only time will tell who we buy this mercato.

agreed

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

So why panic now? Why despair yet? Why not save the stress for something really important? Like thinking about what Ronaldo did b4 he discovered the "females" were really "shemales" after all..

Ahem moving right along.....

Originally Posted by Warro Bantan

Until R10, Adebayor, Drogba, Etoo, Deco, Marquez, Zapata, Zambrotta, Vargas, et al are all sold, [and not to Milan] and I see the press conference with them holding up their new club´s shirt, I will remain calm cool and collected.

And dont hate, just because what I can get in JA tops what you can get in T&T...appreciate!

I must humbly admit that the grade of herb in Jamaica is higher...but then again I guess that's how you deal with our grade of women being second to none

P.S Warro when was the last time JA won a Miss Universe....I think I might have to modify Ambro's sign for you

Originally Posted by catennacio

to those who said relax and don't panic, the clock hasn't even started yet... that's true.. but when we wake up and rush, all the needed players are settled down with either our rivals or some clubs in germany. the point is to act fast, kill fast ppl. you guys really think flamini would have signed with us knowing that we won't play in CL next season? he signed after we won inter. and yeah.. we can relax until after euro and then buy players with double price (if we still act and lucky), or end up with old and left food from other club.

And you say this because you know Galliani and Braida are as we read this, in Tahiti (or Jamaica) on a beach sipping a Piña Colada and watching girls in bikinis?

You dont know what they are doing, so how can you make these statements with such confidence. Every day almost, I read about Galliani flying here and there to negotiate...we are working...if you chose to think we are twiddling our thumbs, and not going to buy, that we are going to field a team of 30+ year olds, and win nothing, again I am forced to ask...why do you support this club if you feel the management (and owner) dont care? Wouldnt it be better for you to quit? I dunno..just asking, not trying to spark a fight.

(Nor am I saying you are not a good fan, or that I am a better fan than you...just want to understand how someone could think so negatively, and yet consider himself a "supporter" of a club. Kinda undermines the whole meaning of the word "support" doesnt it? U kno, like thru thick and thin, for richer or poorer, till death do us part? If you think your wife is cheating on you, or that you cant take her morning face anymore, wouldnt you leave/divorce her? If you think this owner/management are stupid, cheapskates, and thieves, why support the club? Arent there other better run clubs out there?)

Originally Posted by catennacio

to those who do examine the rumoured players saying they are not worth or world class to play for us. sorry but i have to say we are way too aggorant and yet havent done any real investment in wc players recent years, except for nesta and kaka. its kind a dilemma, ppl want wc players, but they are expensive and we wont buy, and the rest are yet-to-be wc, but a little (still) expensive and our scout are too innocent to see that and we won't buy either. and in the end we end up with players like emerson, brocchi, or, in another familiar script "we are world champions and we don't need to buy anyone b/c they are not".

If its a dilemma, it means its not usually going to be easy to fix..or else it wouldnt be a dilemma!!

There is no way to determine if a player will be an absoloute success...or failure. But I chose to think optimistically about this...if you chose the negative/pragmative view, you are so entitled. Have fun with it! Milan are arrogant, yes, I agree....and we deserve to be. We want players who will sacrifice, work hard, sit on the bench if told to, and perform when asked to.

Its called being a "gentleman, and a professional". Those are really hard to find nowadays.

Have you scouted before? Are you as scout? Are you aware of who our scouts are? Do you know if the same scouts that chose Kaka, are the same ones we have now? Do you have a crystal ball? Can you predict the future? If so, who will we/wont we buy? Please dont keep us in suspense! This whole thread could be closed! Think of the time we would save!!

So many questions, so little time.

Originally Posted by drucurl

[b]
Wanna talk Milan Material? Let's examine OUR present SQUAD. There are only THREE (3) players that ARE Milan MATERIAL :Kaka, Pirlo, Nesta

So again I ask you "What IS Milan Material"? To me the phrase has now become vacuous since the departure of Crespo, Sheva, Cafu, Stam, Maldini, Rivaldo, JDT, Rui

You do have a good point but with milan material I think we all mean players that are among the best in the world.
What you post means that the request for beter players is justified.
We can't have 22 of the world's best players I think we all agree on that but we used to have a lot of them, in recent years the best left en were replaced by youngsters that failed and with has beens. I think it's management job to have a balanced milan with
a) in every line real star players aka Milan material. Players that every other team envy us for.
our goalies are all over 35 (Kalac, Dida, Fiori)? what means they aren't on top anymore you can give names of players keepers that were much older and were fine but they were exceptions and had a diffrent way of playing than dida.
Our defenders? we have no proven backs, I hope Oddo and Janku can prove me wrong next year but let's face it no other top team would want them if they had the chance...
We have no wingers (not necessary if we don't want to use them in our formation)
We don't have a classy striker that is so good he's the first our coach puts on the gamesheet a player that defenders fear. Yeah we have pato but he is still to young it would be a crime to make him our lead striker right now, inzaghi has still his moment but is to old (With all due respect of course) if he can play the way he did like last couple of games then I'dd shut up but he was more injured than fit last seasons. (We all had our hopes up for Gila and allthough I still believe in him I'm affraid he will get sold).
Our midfield is still world class IMHO, but we do lack depth. Although with the arrival of Flamini this could be partly resolved.

b) potential future stars that have space to grow
for now I only see Pato and maybe Paloschi but the fact that they both are strikers isn't that good. young Goalies? none
young defenders? Digao is here becoz of his brother and that's smart form milan with him here kaka has a connection with milan, Bonera isn't that young anymore now is he allthough I do like him, he can't be compared with what we had in the past, yet...
Young midfielders? Gourcuff he didn't got to shine but I'dd give him some more credit again the arrival of Flamini brings the age back down a bit.

c) players that are a back up, that should be used when we have a gap to fill in. I'm not going to give all the names coz there are to many of them

As for your list I don't agree with all of them for instance I do reckon Gatusso to be the worlds best for his position and Vieira isn't that good anymore, I saw some games of inter and I didn't understand why he didn't got substituted.

final conclusion. We need a goalie , a back and a striker that can deliver immediatly that is milan material aka players that are among the best in the world in short term, players were other clubs envy us for. like Gatusso, kaka pirlo and nesta they are our backbone our foundation. But recent years our solid backbone crumbled to these four players so now instead of creating a natural growing proces it's time for major transplantations. (Something I'm not to fond of but I don't see another option. The longer we wait the harder its going to be.
Next to that we could use a younger very good central defender to link up with Nesta and we could use a younger central midfielder to finally have a decent back up for Pirlo)
if for example milan decides to buy an old proven keeper such as Coupet I won't be to happy, if they decide to go for Lloris (who is not a starplayer yet) and put him between the sticks, I'll be more happy coz I trust the management in their good judgement and hope he is what we need but if he turns out a failure it would be their mistake and if he does he proved himself not to be milan quality. Is ronaldo good enough? he spent more ours playing soccer on his playstation than actual soccer, Emerson? Brocchi? Simic? They all have a good hart and are good back ups but they should start any games for milan coz they simply aren't good enough.
It's not that our players have turned old over night this was a problem that is talked about for years and what happend? Every year we signed old players. So management messed up time to put things straight.

DRUCURL vs WARRO BANTAN

its like the

SOCA WARRIORS vs THE REGGAE BOYZ

im watching the france ecaduar match

Flamini is playing, Ben Arfa had some good runs, nasri is playing well also, however i havent seen benzema or Gourcuff or Menez