Banter 2009/2010

Originally Posted by Christian

Apparently we're tracking Jucilei. Maybe Galliani is tracking this forum

Like the Brazilian Jucilei, confirms the former president of Corinthians

Jucilei (22), Brazilian midfielder for Corinthians, is a target market for AC Milan. The player who is reported as one of the best young men in his role as the Brazilian championship, has a contract expiring in May 2012. Other European clubs including Hamburg and Paris Saint Germain have been matched with Brazil. Milan in pole but it would seem, in fact during an interview with "Radio Globo", Joel Malucelli, former president of Corinthians, has revealed that Milan had reviewed the play. "The leaders of Milan have come to observe Jucilei recently and we know that players like - Malucelli said - but now we are out of operation, any decision lies with the Corinthians."

http://www.milannews.it/?action=read&idnotizia=23132

Interesting news... But I want to corrects some informations to make things more clear.

This guy that was interviewed(Joel Malucelli), isn't a former president of Corinthians, he was(is) the owner of a team of the State of Paraná(south of Brazil)called J. Malucelli(yep, his own name ) that changed the name to Corinthian of Parana. They are now a filial of Corinthians, and thats the reason he said the decision now, lies with the Corinthians.

Jucilei was a revelation of that team and sold to Corinthians last season for half a million if I'm not wrong. The real president of Corinthians(Andre Sanches) already said on TV that it will be hard to keep Elias(Sevilla lean), Dentinho, Raph and Jucilei. No one tell me it, I saw him on TV(live) saying this, while confirmed that Jucilei was the most sought nowadays.

Milan still is the international team with more supporters in Brazil, and with the way our mgt(and mostly, Silvio) always treated Brazilian players(first class), I can guarantee that if we really go for someone, it will be hard to beat us(until now).

Le's hope it's true, because Jucilei still isn't a media darling, and will have a reasonable price. Also helps that Corinthian needs money for yesterday!

Originally Posted by Revolver

Jucilei is DM right? According some sources, we are tracking Athletic Bilbao's Javi Martinez who's also a DM, and from what I've heard about him, strong, not slow, technical, complete midfielder, great prospect.

Yep, he's DM, Revolver... but he's a second-volante as we call here. Let me clarify a little this role...

Here, we called Volante every DM... But the holder(#5) we called primeiro-volante(first-volante), that role Makele did in Chelsea, and now is in the hands of Mikel. Jucilei plays better(an mostly) as a segundo-volante, where he has defensive duties, but is free to go forward.

Look, I'm not trying to appear "the smart one"... probably most of you guys already know this, but is that some people don't know that in a Brazilian 4-2-2-2, sometimes coaches uses 2 holders(Dunga and Mauro Silva WC 94) and sometimes a holder and a second-volante.

That said, if a guy is a amazing second-volante in Brazil, generally would be a amazing peace for a box-to-box role in Europe.

Originally Posted by Revolver

I don't have anything against Inter winning the title, though I like Roma a lot, but the worst thing is this will be their 5th title in a row, and they'll set a record. Torino won 4 titles in a row back in 60s, that famous Mazzola's generation who was cut short in a plane crash, Milan won 3 back in 90s... And their record is all about circumstanced as they would never made it without Calciopolli. They don't come even close to ours Gli Invincibili.

But, the light at the end of tunnel for Milan fans is that Inter will probably lose 2005-06 and 2006-07 titles after Calciopolli saga finally comes to an end. 2005-06 will probably not be assigned, just as 2004-05 wasn't assigned, and for 2006-07, they'll probably be cut for enough points (16+) so that title will be awarded to Roma, if they're clear of course.

I believe that Juventus won 5 in a row back in 1930s.

Originally Posted by Revolver

I agree with you. Many of Milan fans think that all great players want to play for Milan, but it's not the case. We can attract great players just with money. The only player we got cheap from 2004 till now was Flamini because we gave him 4 M a year and he left Arsenal because he wanted more than 2 M a year. No matter how much Pato is talented, it was ridiculous to spend 21 M for 17-years old. Then, 20 M on Ronaldinho, when Barcelona would let him for free, I could bet my life with it back then.

Actually, we don't have good relationship with any of the clubs. Nobody wants to sell their players to Milan. Lazio "sold" Pandev to Inter and not to us, and Galliani invented a stupid excuse like we don't want to mess with Lazio.

Then, Pastore thing, it's really sad we are spending so much money for trips to South America and Palermo spots the jewel that Pastore is and takes him for 8 M, and then Galliani ridiculously says Pastore is fantastic player. After someone bought him! Where were our numerous scouts in South America?! Same for Hernanes, they've spent so much time in Brazil and then when whole world knew Hernanes is great, we made a bid. Why do we need "scouts" when we are making bids too late, when all world knows that (for example) Hernanes is a great player and his price is not low anymore?!

From 2003 - 2007 we were most successful club in the world and two years latter we're suddenly in 60 M debt and it would be 120 M if we haven't sold Sheva. Where the money went?! Calciopolli cost us a lot, but not so much that from all the money we earned in 4-5 years time we're suddenly 120 M down. For example, Inter made a numerous investments from 1990 until 2005 and won nothing in that 15 years.

All this proves that lack of investment is not the problem. This club is maintained badly for years, and that's much deeper than "Berlusconi doesn't want to spend". Everybody (Galliani, Braida, MilanLab and so on) are guilty for this situation before Sivlio.

The Pastore thing was ridiculous cause I knew about him from last january. He was TEARING up argentina. He was no shock. Man Utd tried for him. Milan were linked, but apparently didn't wanna pay 8 mil.


Jovetic is another awful one. Savicevic begged Galliani to sign him. Jovetic WANTED milan (because savicevic is a national hero and 1 of his idols). What did milan do? Use nonEU spot on Digao.


Nepotism at milan is utterly disgusting. I could keep going but FFS, whats worst of all. Those years we wasted money on likes of Huntelaar or even worse.... 30+ year ols like emerson, zambrotta, oddo ? REALLY??? How is 8 mil for a 31 year old good business when we could spend it on an 18 year old who will likely not lose value

Originally Posted by Milano84

The Pastore thing was ridiculous cause I knew about him from last january. He was TEARING up argentina. He was no shock. Man Utd tried for him. Milan were linked, but apparently didn't wanna pay 8 mil.


Jovetic is another awful one. Savicevic begged Galliani to sign him. Jovetic WANTED milan (because savicevic is a national hero and 1 of his idols). What did milan do? Use nonEU spot on Digao.


Nepotism at milan is utterly disgusting. I could keep going but FFS, whats worst of all. Those years we wasted money on likes of Huntelaar or even worse.... 30+ year ols like emerson, zambrotta, oddo ? REALLY??? How is 8 mil for a 31 year old good business when we could spend it on an 18 year old who will likely not lose value

I REALLY don't get this whole Pastore hype. To be honost I'm not writing him off, cause he's very young, but I just don't see what makes everyone go nuts for him.

There are way better players in Palermo now, so it's not like he's leading them to a CL spot, or leading his team in the CL like Jovetic did. Miccoli and Liverani are much more important for Palermo, but they honostly just generally play very good football.

Honostly he's a talent and I would like him in Milan, but let's be real, he wouldn't and shouldn't start over Seedorf, Ronaldinho or Pato. Imo there are much more exciting talents out there in the same price range.

Originally Posted by Christian

I REALLY don't get this whole Pastore hype. To be honost I'm not writing him off, cause he's very young, but I just don't see what makes everyone go nuts for him.

There are way better players in Palermo now, so it's not like he's leading them to a CL spot, or leading his team in the CL like Jovetic did. Miccoli and Liverani are much more important for Palermo, but they honostly just generally play very good football.

Honostly he's a talent and I would like him in Milan, but let's be real, he wouldn't and shouldn't start over Seedorf, Ronaldinho or Pato. Imo there are much more exciting talents out there in the same price range.

i kind of disagree. Not that he is better than ron or seedorf. But i think it's painfully obvious we can't play seedorf, pirlo and ron together... waayyy too slow. particularly seedorf and pirlo together. Putting 1 of them w/ quicker more active AM would help..

In general the team is just sooo static. Also Pastore is only 20 and just starting to figure out Serie A. I'm unsure if he'll be the next big thing, but his athleticism could surely help this team... the most unathletic team in europe.


anyway it's more metaphoric IMO. Like you said there are plenty of good buys to be made in that price range.

Hamsik, Lavezzi and Sanchez from Udinese, to place Seedorf(bench) Pippo, Mancini

Originally Posted by Bosniaco

Hamsik, Lavezzi and Sanchez from Udinese, to place Seedorf(bench) Pippo, Mancini

i like dreamland too

With the lack of form we're showing and the players we have to use in defence (yes, I'm thinking of Oddo, Favalli, Antonini, Abate, Dida) I think this is not an unrealistic ending to the season:

Milan - Fiorentina (Fiorentina wins)
Genoa - Milan (Genoa wins)
Milan - Juventus (Juventus wins)

Sampdoria - Livorno (Sampdoria wins)
Palermo - Sampdoria (draw)
Sampdoria - Napoli (Sampdoria wins)

Siena - Palermo (Palermo wins)
Palermo - Sampdoria (draw)
Atalanta - Palermo (Palermo wins)

3rd: Sampdoria 67 points
4th: Palermo 65 points
5th: Milan 64 points

We're struggling to sign players now, but who would sign for us if this happens? Instead of the "new Kaká", probably the "new Digao" or something...

In a way, I am very glad to see teams like Sampdoria, Palermo and Viola doing well and playing in Europe, as those teams actually own by someone who wants to see their team to have success in Europe. And these owners actually spend money on players and want to build their teams to be Championship teams instead of keep claiming their teams full of past champions.

Originally Posted by Gabriel489

In a way, I am very glad to see teams like Sampdoria, Palermo and Viola doing well and playing in Europe, as those teams actually own by someone who wants to see their team to have success in Europe. And these owners actually spend money on players and want to build their teams to be Championship teams instead of keep claiming their teams full of past champions.

Amen to that. If you don't want something, then step aside and let somebody else have it. Since we don't want to be a competitive team, we just need to step aside quietly and be happy for other teams taking initiative to be great.

Originally Posted by Gabriel489

In a way, I am very glad to see teams like Sampdoria, Palermo and Viola doing well and playing in Europe, as those teams actually own by someone who wants to see their team to have success in Europe. And these owners actually spend money on players and want to build their teams to be Championship teams instead of keep claiming their teams full of past champions.

I think the 3 teams you mentioned are managed (at least in terms of transfers) in a way that's important for the future. Fiorentina for example have spent in the region of 90million since 2006, which averages around 20million a year. Palermo and Samp have probably spent less yet all of them are highly competitive teams. They're weakness more than anything is they're also prepared to sell if offers come in.

Milan I think is probably attempting to do something similar in our transfer policies, but there are questions whether we'll be successful, and we'll need a lot of patience before results show.

Originally Posted by Revolver

Actually, we don't have good relationship with any of the clubs. Nobody wants to sell their players to Milan. Lazio "sold" Pandev to Inter and not to us, and Galliani invented a stupid excuse like we don't want to mess with Lazio.

Then, Pastore thing, it's really sad we are spending so much money for trips to South America and Palermo spots the jewel that Pastore is and takes him for 8 M, and then Galliani ridiculously says Pastore is fantastic player. After someone bought him! Where were our numerous scouts in South America?! Same for Hernanes, they've spent so much time in Brazil and then when whole world knew Hernanes is great, we made a bid. Why do we need "scouts" when we are making bids too late, when all world knows that (for example) Hernanes is a great player and his price is not low anymore?!

It's the contrary: all clubs are happy (we should say: were happy) when they see Milan is interested by one of their players because we tended to pay more than the value of the players in a more or less recent past ...

About Pandev, the guy had no more contract, so Lazio couldn't do anything, Pandev left for free in the club of his choice.
And while I thought it was a stupid choice from him to go to Inter (because of concurrence, after a first look, it seemed easier to be a starter in Milan than in Inter for him), it turned to be a success-story for him as it looks like he was the missing part of that team and so he plays a major role in a team involved in all competitions.

About Pastore, he admitted that scouts from Milan saw him regularly. But the first team to have done a serious offer was Palermo, and like they have a serious project (serious offer + serious project = bingo) ...

Originally Posted by Christian

I REALLY don't get this whole Pastore hype. To be honost I'm not writing him off, cause he's very young, but I just don't see what makes everyone go nuts for him.

There are way better players in Palermo now, so it's not like he's leading them to a CL spot, or leading his team in the CL like Jovetic did. Miccoli and Liverani are much more important for Palermo, but they honostly just generally play very good football.

Honostly he's a talent and I would like him in Milan, but let's be real, he wouldn't and shouldn't start over Seedorf, Ronaldinho or Pato. Imo there are much more exciting talents out there in the same price range.

The guy is physically good: powerful and fast, he moves all the time everywhere on the pitch (generally at the start of the counters for Palermo), he's not tired after 65 minutes.
The guy is technically very good: just watch several of his games and see the way he dribbles his opponents ...
The guy seems smart: he understands the way his partners move and so that results in good passes with few losses of ball.

Don't forget it's his first year in Palermo. Kaka' wasn't that better in his first year in Milan.
And if Palermo isn't in the middle of the table, it's thanks to their investments, but if you have to take two players, it's mainly thanks to the duo Pastore-Miccoli.

Nowadays, if we had Pastore in our team, we would have to do a choice about our formation as Pastore wouldn't really fit in our current system, and if we do a system fitting Pastore, it's Ronaldinho who wouldn't fit anymore this new formation. My choice would be all done: 4-3-1-2 with Pastore as AM and Pato again as a striker.

Criscito, in co-ownership between Genoa and Juventus, stopped all rumours about him: no Milan, no Inter, nothing, just Genoa or Juventus next year.

Next !!

Originally Posted by ACMILAN1983

I think the 3 teams you mentioned are managed (at least in terms of transfers) in a way that's important for the future. Fiorentina for example have spent in the region of 90million since 2006, which averages around 20million a year. Palermo and Samp have probably spent less yet all of them are highly competitive teams. They're weakness more than anything is they're also prepared to sell if offers come in.

Milan I think is probably attempting to do something similar in our transfer policies, but there are questions whether we'll be successful, and we'll need a lot of patience before results show.

I never said those three teams are World Beaters, but you can see that their owners are willing to invest to better their teams chances of winning. Yeah, they might sell their best players if a great offers come in but I am sure they will re-invest those money instead of balancing their books. Or when they signed a player, they would not then come up with a dental problem to back out of the deal.

Originally Posted by GeoTav

Criscito, in co-ownership between Genoa and Juventus, stopped all rumours about him: no Milan, no Inter, nothing, just Genoa or Juventus next year.

Next !!

With the current defense of Juve, I think he is heading there next year.