Banter 2009/2010

Yeah I truely honestly cannot bring myself to shout for Inter no way no way I just can't.

Originally Posted by ACMILAN1983

Could you provide a source please?

You expect that euro club is Milan?

Originally Posted by Siregar

You expect that euro club is Milan?

One month ago, Paris seemed to lead the race for bringing the player in Europe, but many medias in France reported that Milan joined this race and took the lead.

Who knows ?

And I just think about a terrible scenario: Leonardo goes to Paris (he said once he was sure to come back to Paris someday), in the management team and, for his first hours in Paris, he brings Jucilei there ...

Fortunately, there is no way it happens !!

Originally Posted by Gabriel489

Oh Revolver. I know you dislike Leo, but to say that he was asking for too much from the MGT is just non-sense.

No my friend I like Leo, as a person and as a scout, but I don't want him to be our coach, because he's bad tactically and he's acting towards his players like they're his friends and he's their friend.

@ ACMILANO1983

I didn't want to be rude or to offend anyone, I just hate to see some members here just moaning and moaning and moaning, every their post is repetitive, just moaning and asking to spend. Some of members are acting like B & G hate this club. Galliani is treated like a serial killer, why, because he made some bad decisions for a football club?! I'm a fan too, I was a fan when we were 12th in the table, I would be a fan if we'd end up in Serie B in couple of years. All I want for fans is to be patient. When you love the club there are good times and bad times. You must accept it.

If Leo is done well with given resources, what about Van Gaal then?! What about his resources?! Are you telling me that Olic is better than properly used Huntelaar, for example?!

I've never said "no spending" you misunderstood me. I said spend "something" every year, build a team piece by piece. You say Cissokho, Hernanes and Dzeko, it's ridiculous, last summer three of them would cost us 55 M at least, and that wouldn't solve anything, because Cissokho is proved to be nowhere near Cissokho from Porto, Hernanes alone isn't enough to improve our energy and pace lacking midfield, etc. You can't compare us to Real or Barca because they are willing to spend enormous money (which they don't have, actually) to buy all best players, i.e. to build super-stars squad, and our goal always was to build balanced squad with some great individuals.

Regarding Inter and Mourinho, all Mourinho asked for when he came was Quaresma (Mancini came for free, he would came anyway). Then, when he saw the situation, he had clear thoughts what he wants (you're wrong when you say Leo has clear vision of what he wants). He wanted tall and strong defender, he wanted to play with wingers, and he wanted a capable playmaker. He deliberately sold his best player because Ibrahimovic was out of his plans. With half the money he got for Ibrahimovic, he bought 4 players, and all cheap. A playmaker (12 M), a defender (free), a replacement for Ibra (18 M), an another option in midfield (free, exchange), and a winger was included in Ibra deal. And still it wasn't enough, because he needed another winger, but he couldn't ask Moratti for more. And after half a year he got a last piece in a puzzle, a second winger, for free of course. So, he bought just two players (30 M), he got FOUR players (starters) for free and he sold his best player for 46 M. So, actually he earned 15 M for his club during the transfer window and he hasn't had the nerv to ask Moratti for another player! And that's the difference between him and Leo. All Leo wants is to spend, every player he asks for costs some money, and even if he would got ALL players he wants, it would still mean nothing because he's lacking a clear vision. The prove for this is even if B & G gave him 55 M last summer for three players, we wouldn't be much better. With all three of them, we would still exit CL that early.

Originally Posted by GeoTav

One month ago, Paris seemed to lead the race for bringing the player in Europe, but many medias in France reported that Milan joined this race and took the lead.

Who knows ?

And I just think about a terrible scenario: Leonardo goes to Paris (he said once he was sure to come back to Paris someday), in the management team and, for his first hours in Paris, he brings Jucilei there ...

Fortunately, there is no way it happens !!

We still probably have something left regarding transfer target in Brasil. Other than this, we have nothing to be used to get that target. Yes, yes I know, except they are FREE.

@Brasileiro

It is understandable that the fans are impatient since what you expect from management are nothing done by Galliani co. Many fans still support the team even they play in Serie B. The problem is not the performance of the Milan but the management. Many fans hate the management, not Milan. The management seems having no plan except buying free and unwanted players plus keeping the huge-wage-paid players. What the management have done that can be used for many milan fans that they should be patient? U18 players that still have HUGE chance to turn to be a mediocre players? But this is actually the good thing for me, I enjoy following the youth team than the first team that really have so many problems including Leonardo's case.

Originally Posted by Revolver

Regarding Inter and Mourinho, all Mourinho asked for when he came was Quaresma (Mancini came for free, he would came anyway). Then, when he saw the situation, he had clear thoughts what he wants (you're wrong when you say Leo has clear vision of what he wants). He wanted tall and strong defender, he wanted to play with wingers, and he wanted a capable playmaker. He deliberately sold his best player because Ibrahimovic was out of his plans. With half the money he got for Ibrahimovic, he bought 4 players, and all cheap. A playmaker (12 M), a defender (free), a replacement for Ibra (18 M), an another option in midfield (free, exchange), and a winger was included in Ibra deal. And still it wasn't enough, because he needed another winger, but he couldn't ask Moratti for more. And after half a year he got a last piece in a puzzle, a second winger, for free of course. So, he bought just two players (30 M), he got FOUR players (starters) for free and he sold his best player for 46 M. So, actually he earned 15 M for his club during the transfer window and he hasn't had the nerv to ask Moratti for another player! And that's the difference between him and Leo. All Leo wants is to spend, every player he asks for costs some money, and even if he would got ALL players he wants, it would still mean nothing because he's lacking a clear vision. The prove for this is even if B & G gave him 55 M last summer for three players, we wouldn't be much better. With all three of them, we would still exit CL that early.

Mourinho is in his second year in Inter: the first year, he just played like Mancini did, he tried to use his "old" tactics, the one with wingers he used in Chelsea, but it didn't work. It's only this season that he asked for this and this player. So Mourinho did need a complete season to have "clear thoughts", why should Leo have "clear thoughts" after his first days as a coach ? How can you be sure he doesn't have a plan for this team for this summer ?

When you looked at the roster of Inter, they did need less changes than us nowadays, it's also why it's going to cost us more actually.

Then, you, I, and everybody here have no idea if Cissokho was the choice of Leo, if he would have bought Hernanes and if we would have gone for Dzeko ... especially when you know that Leonardo wanted Luis Fabiano, from what he said in medias, a player who is a lot cheaper than Dzeko (Dzeko = 40M, Luis Fabiano = 20M).

Leonardo said he wanted attacking fullbacks, and he got Oddo back from Bayern ... He never said "I want Cissokho", but just attacking fullbacks.

The guy (has) had an idea, he wanted to complete our squad, but he got nothing (Huntelaar isn't the kind of striker he asked for if you compare him to Luis Fabiano).

Our main problems are our older and older defence (with Abate, Antonini and Thiago Silva, we at least got some fresh legs, but all the other players are injury-prone or old) and midfield (Pirlo-Ambrosini-Flamini are the only players who can still run several games in a row, Seedorf made some effort but we saw his limits, Gattuso seems lost, Ronaldinho actually ran for 2 months and he decided then to sit down on his left side), and Milan only bought Huntelaar, a striker. What a great solution !!

It's not my week, I again lost my reasonment, so I go directly to the conclusion: you can't compare Leo and Mourinho like you do, and if you do, do it properly, Mourinho needed one complete season to know what he wanted for his team, and he got a better team when he arrived in Italy (+ like all coaches arriving at the start of a season in a club, he got 2-3 players when arriving in this club, players he asked, which is something that didn't happen for Leo).

PS: I'm not a "B&G hater", far from that, they've done an amazing job, with some mistakes of course.
PS1: I support Leo but I'm not a "Leo lover", he's done a very good job, with some mistakes of course.
PS2: I'm very impatient and curious to know what will happen this summer, but before, we have to remember there are still few games and that worries me because everybody, from the fans to the management, speaks about Leo, money, etc and I didn't see any comment about our next few games recently.

Speculations from italian forums are about Galli saying "bench or ciao" to 7,8 "senatori" and Milan will insert up to 8 primavera players... (???)

While Merda after possible scudetto and CL will buy Vargas and a class CF.

Galliani says that he will support Inter because without Inter winning Italy will lose a CL place , could this be because they do not think they can finish 3rd and they know no new players are going to come in to improve our squad.
He said anyone who doesn't support Inter isn't using any sensible thinking...F U Galliani.

He then went on to say that the fans should appreciate what Berlusconi has done for the club , and while Inter are in there 1st CL final under morratti we have been in 8 under Berlu.

Well thats all fine but Inter are on top now and we are nowhere , so let me get this right because we have been succesfull in the past we shouldn't want to be anymore????.
Milan was one of the few clubs that rolled off the Tongue but now it is no longer on top , fair enough clubs go through transition but we are not in a transition because in a transitional period things change but at Milan honestly nothing is changing.

As for bench or bye bye im for it some guy's (Kala Janku Favalli Dida Oddo Rino Pippo) should be gone.Actually favalli does seem to try hard and is on a low wage for our average wage paid but he still has to go. As for just bringing in 7 or 8 primavera players I hope im wrong but that will not do anything , we do not have the youth sector of Arsenal Barca Ajax mid 90's or Man Utd mid 90's so I can't see all 7 or however many coming in and being as agood as say , Criscito , Jucilei / Hernanes Krasic Dzeko or whoever else we are linked with.

Galliani statements on Football-Italia.net.

Originally Posted by Jay Crisp

Galliani says that he will support Inter because without Inter winning Italy will lose a CL place , could this be because they do not think they can finish 3rd and they know no new players are going to come in to improve our squad.
He said anyone who doesn't support Inter isn't using any sensible thinking...F U Galliani.

He then went on to say that the fans should appreciate what Berlusconi has done for the club , and while Inter are in there 1st CL final under morratti we have been in 8 under Berlu.

Well thats all fine but Inter are on top now and we are nowhere , so let me get this right because we have been succesfull in the past we shouldn't want to be anymore????.
Milan was one of the few clubs that rolled off the Tongue but now it is no longer on top , fair enough clubs go through transition but we are not in a transition because in a transitional period things change but at Milan honestly nothing is changing.

As for bench or bye bye im for it some guy's (Kala Janku Favalli Dida Oddo Rino Pippo) should be gone.Actually favalli does seem to try hard and is on a low wage for our average wage paid but he still has to go. As for just bringing in 7 or 8 primavera players I hope im wrong but that will not do anything , we do not have the youth sector of Arsenal Barca Ajax mid 90's or Man Utd mid 90's so I can't see all 7 or however many coming in and being as agood as say , Criscito , Jucilei / Hernanes Krasic Dzeko or whoever else we are linked with.

Galliani statements on Football-Italia.net.

No, that just means that Milan fans should learn to be patient ...

B&G maybe offered too much in few time to the fans, and as a consequence, these fans behave like children who didn't get the toy they wanted ...

Originally Posted by GeoTav

No, that just means that Milan fans should learn to be patient ...

B&G maybe offered too much in few time to the fans, and as a consequence, these fans behave like children who didn't get the toy they wanted ...

Some maybe but I just think that there statements are ridiculous sometimes but thats nothing new , I'll be patient these young guy's may be very good when they get a run who knows , but something has to be done even slowly we will see.
We'll definately know by December even if no new players arrive these youngsters may step up I know I'd prefer a team of mostly homegrown talent than spending millions and millions on players that may not work out.
Im not expecting a team of Maldinis either.

Originally Posted by Revolver

No my friend I like Leo, as a person and as a scout, but I don't want him to be our coach, because he's bad tactically and he's acting towards his players like they're his friends and he's their friend.

@ ACMILANO1983

I didn't want to be rude or to offend anyone, I just hate to see some members here just moaning and moaning and moaning, every their post is repetitive, just moaning and asking to spend. Some of members are acting like B & G hate this club. Galliani is treated like a serial killer, why, because he made some bad decisions for a football club?! I'm a fan too, I was a fan when we were 12th in the table, I would be a fan if we'd end up in Serie B in couple of years. All I want for fans is to be patient. When you love the club there are good times and bad times. You must accept it.

If Leo is done well with given resources, what about Van Gaal then?! What about his resources?! Are you telling me that Olic is better than properly used Huntelaar, for example?!

I've never said "no spending" you misunderstood me. I said spend "something" every year, build a team piece by piece. You say Cissokho, Hernanes and Dzeko, it's ridiculous, last summer three of them would cost us 55 M at least, and that wouldn't solve anything, because Cissokho is proved to be nowhere near Cissokho from Porto, Hernanes alone isn't enough to improve our energy and pace lacking midfield, etc. You can't compare us to Real or Barca because they are willing to spend enormous money (which they don't have, actually) to buy all best players, i.e. to build super-stars squad, and our goal always was to build balanced squad with some great individuals.

Regarding Inter and Mourinho, all Mourinho asked for when he came was Quaresma (Mancini came for free, he would came anyway). Then, when he saw the situation, he had clear thoughts what he wants (you're wrong when you say Leo has clear vision of what he wants). He wanted tall and strong defender, he wanted to play with wingers, and he wanted a capable playmaker. He deliberately sold his best player because Ibrahimovic was out of his plans. With half the money he got for Ibrahimovic, he bought 4 players, and all cheap. A playmaker (12 M), a defender (free), a replacement for Ibra (18 M), an another option in midfield (free, exchange), and a winger was included in Ibra deal. And still it wasn't enough, because he needed another winger, but he couldn't ask Moratti for more. And after half a year he got a last piece in a puzzle, a second winger, for free of course. So, he bought just two players (30 M), he got FOUR players (starters) for free and he sold his best player for 46 M. So, actually he earned 15 M for his club during the transfer window and he hasn't had the nerv to ask Moratti for another player! And that's the difference between him and Leo. All Leo wants is to spend, every player he asks for costs some money, and even if he would got ALL players he wants, it would still mean nothing because he's lacking a clear vision. The prove for this is even if B & G gave him 55 M last summer for three players, we wouldn't be much better. With all three of them, we would still exit CL that early.

Geo answered your post with many of the points I intended to make, but a few points...

If you don't like someone's posts, then it's best to block them or ignore them. It's what I have done in the past when I grew tired like you have now.

If I'm honest, Bayern probably do have a superior squad to us right now. You've heavily underestimated Olic whose a very good player with a incredible workrate. They have Muller, Gomez, Ribery and Robben (the last two are superb for them) to just name a few. Most importantly, they have players who work really hard for the team, players who can and are prepared to run. The same can't be said of us.

I think we could have gotten Cissokho, Hernanes and Dzeko last season for around 45-50 million had we negotiated well. We don't have that kind of money, but compared to the money other clubs spend it's very reasonable for Leo to expect some quality reinforcement at Milan. Even then, had we not gotten these players (as Geo said, Cissokho may not have been Leo's pick), then we should have gone for similar alternatives to at least try and meet some of Leo's needs, we simply didn't.

Mourinho doesn't manage Inter's finances, so how they've gotten the squad they have isn't a credit to him. Selling Ibra wasn't some masterstroke from him, it would have been a decision made by the upper management and the player. Mourinho as a coach will make requests (demands) to Moratti and Branca as to what he needs, just as Leo does. In Mourinho's case, his requests have been met by either getting the players he wants or getting similar players (proof is the fact he has 4 new starters this season). In Leo's case, not one of his requests were met. We didn't get wide players, we didn't get a playmaker, nor did we get a player up front who is good at holding the ball up.

On top of this, Inter and Milan's situations are totally different. Mourinho inherited a squad a top quality players, which is pretty much at it's peak. The club didn't need to make investments to compete, but simply additions to improve an already very strong squad (like us back in 2003-2006). Milan need to rebuild, as we have an ageing squad which lacks quality younger players coming through. Without investing this is impossible to do.

Finally, this whole concept that Mourinho has a plan and Leo doesn't make sense. Mourinho had ideas of wanting to do what he did in Chelsea at Inter, but initially failed and reverted back to Mancini's old system. This season he's again changed how the side play to try and build on what he had last season. Quite frankly, Mourinho's chopped and changed his plans to try and get the best with what he has. Leo, as soon as he took charge at Milan made it pretty clear he had ideas as to how he wants Milan to play, which was heavily influenced by his old coach Tele Santana, who also coached Brazil 1982. It's evident that with these ideas, and the players he said he wanted he had plans in his head to achieve his goal. He didn't have the tools to achieve this though and so initially he struggled, as the players simply couldn't cope with his system. He couldn't revert back to Ancelotti's Milan either, as we lacked a vital player in Kaka. Eventually, Leo has had to change to the current 4-3-3, which is a variation of his original idea, and has brought us some good results. Mourinho was given the time and resources to find the right balance in his side (and even then, it's very debatable how good Inter actually are). Leo (who has had a big learning experience this season) has been given neither the time nor resources to realise his plans. I'm also pretty sure Leo knew exactly what the strengths and weaknesses were of this squad when he took the job, as he's been in Milan for around 13 years, knowing the ins and outs of the club all that time.

May be I haven't followed all the posts here carefully but the idea that the reason some fans are sad (or whatever else) is because we are spoiled is something I strongly disagree with. The way the team is being run in recent years is poor and there is no denying it. I have no interest in evaluating it with respect to 10 or 20 years ago, now is the problem and it is damaging the team in every way you can imagine.

Galliani still lives with the past.i would expect him to say something like this...''inter deserved it,i hope we will be in the final for next year''''hope we will play the next final together''

instead we played 8 finals...come on.its the past.past.look ahead,future...

we should thank Berlusconi for this crap roster.yeah just 1 first team player under 25 years old...Abate and Antonini as reserves are good,nothing more than that...

We should thank Berlusconi for cancelling deals,Cissokho,Hernanes and Dzeko.w e didnt want him last year,why do we want him this season too and asked Wolsburg to drop their 40m euros asking price?

its weird.we didnt want the same player when he costs 30m euros.
but we want him again when his price goes up to 40m euros.its really weird...

Regarding CL,inter really deserved it,They spent much money and always aimed for better squad.inter will sign more than Vargas and CF...

They will sign a Midfielder and defenders as well.if i were them,i'd sign a solid CB...Cordoba and Materazzi passed it...Motta is the weakest link.inconsistent and injury prone...Silva for them would be awesome upgrade...They want Hernanes as well...Hernanes-Cambiasso looks good.

Originally Posted by Reza

May be I haven't followed all the posts here carefully but the idea that the reason some fans are sad (or whatever else) is because we are spoiled is something I strongly disagree with. The way the team is being run in recent years is poor and there is no denying it. I have no interest in evaluating it with respect to 10 or 20 years ago, now is the problem and it is damaging the team in every way you can imagine.

1986: Berlusconi becomes the owner of Milan

86-87: 5th
87-88: 1st
88-89: 3rd + winner in CL
89-90: 2nd + winner in CL
90-91: 2nd
91-92: 1st
92-93: 1st + runner up in CL
93-94: 1st + winner in CL
94-95: 4th + runner up in CL
95-96: 1st
96-97: 11th
97-98: 10th
98-99: 1st
99-00: 3rd
00-01: 6th
01-02: 4th
02-03: 3rd + winner in CL
03-04: 1st
04-05: 2nd + runner up in CL
05-06: 2nd (then finally 3rd because of Calciopoli)
06-07: 4th + winner in CL
07-08: 5th
08-09: 3rd
09-10: ...

Just for some memory ... I don't think there were forums in 1996 ? I would have loved to see the reactions of people at that time.