Banter 2009/2010

Originally Posted by ACMILAN1983

We're apparently pushing for Jucilei

http://translate.google.com/translat...47&sl=it&tl=en

I hope that true. But we must be careful since we can only sign two non-EU players (I assume Jucilei has no EU-pass).

Originally Posted by GeoTav

Damn, just saw the pre-list of Italy ... how is it possible to still take the same players even when they don't perform well (Gattuso for example, or some of the guys of Juventus like Grosso) ?!

The thing with gattuso is that he will just be great to have around. when someone needs a pick up he will be there, if someone needs a kick up the ass, he will be there, if someone is getting attacked by a dog with rabies......

He is thinking about letting Robinho take his place or Elano. The thing is that even if Dinho is on the team, he can only play in the left side unlike Kaka who runs all around the field.

I think lowered expectation will help one or two teams with questionable selections. I read somewhere that Capello should be happy because the other teams are weak...I wouldn't be that confident if I were an England fan.

Originally Posted by Gabriel489

JUst saw the Brazil 23 men squad.
Not surprise Dinho was not there as they already have Kaka, Elano, and Robinho.
But no Pato and Neymar were stupid, and to me, i would add Adraino as he will give Brazil more option upfront with his size.

Adriano size is one of his big problems now, Gabriel. The guy is still overweight and never performed in the several cances he had with Dunga. The patience Dunga had with Adriano, was opposing to the one shown with Pato.

Then there is no David Luiz for defense, although I understand that the other 4 CBs are great also, but David Luiz can play as both RB and LB too.As for midfield, I don't know why Josue or Kleberson made it but Hernanez did not.

The CB position in Brazil is stacked. Alex was the 3rd choice by Dunga until the last Confederation Cup(when he asked to be dropped to a hernia surgery). T. Silva and Luisão get their chance, performed and Alex is now on the waiting list(with Ronaldinho, Marcelo, Carlos Eduardo, Sandro, D. Tardelli and Ganso). That said, my 4 defenders for W. Cup would be Lucio, Alex, David Luiz and T. Silva.

Kleberson and Gilberto are by far the biggest reachs Dunga did Josue(I don´t like) at least performed in some games with Dunga. But to see both(josue and kleberson) in Brazil NT and no Arouca and Hernanes is a shame.

Originally Posted by kastriot

Actually non of the attackers have been in a good form this season...Robinho has had his moments, but nothing worth mentioning IMO.

I Would like to ask Dunga, what if Kaka gets injured..who si gonna replace him, Baptista, Ramirez??!!!

Thats the one billion question, my friend.

In Dunga´s mind right now, Baptista is Kaká replacement(Ramires and Elano fight for he RMD position).

Just don´t agree with the attackers... while Kaká is in a bad form(mostly by injuries and role), I have no doubt he will be ready for WC. Brazil is years ahead in physical preparation and mostly, in the physiotherapy. There are several examles of it in the(near and far) past...

Robinho is playing better and better and Luis Fabiano if i´m not wrong, scored 4 goals in the last 5 matches, after coming back from a injure. We need to pray for Luis Fabiano and Kaka stay fit, because we have no replacmente for them...

Originally Posted by Siregar

I hope that true. But we must be careful since we can only sign two non-EU players (I assume Jucilei has no EU-pass).

Yep, he´s a non-EU player... needless to say I would give him one of these two spots without think twice.

Of the few games I saw Adraino, he was more active and yes he is bigger but he is not fat like R99.
I still would have pick both Adraino and Pato over Graffite and Kleberson

Well, the Brazilians are almost sure to win their home WC in 4 years (anyway it's my thought, they will be the 500% favourite) ... so Dunga, who is a very fair play person, probably decided to take a weaker team to this WC to give a chance to the other NT ?

Dunga won the South American Cup, he won the Confederations Cup, so he probably thinks he'll win the World Cup if he chooses a too strong team ...

The problem is that some coaches like Lippi or Domenech did the same thing whereas they don't have the players to do it !!

Despite all that, I bet we'll see Brazil and Spain in semi-finals at 100%.
Then, it will be 50-50 for teams like Argentina (I never trusted this team, especially since they have a dirty diva as a coach), Germany (they always have poor players but manage to be there in all big competitions), England and let's say France and Italy as they are the winner and finalist of the last edition.

PS: I know, no need to be Nostradamus to write what I just said ...

Originally Posted by GeoTav

PS: I know, no need to be Nostradamus to write what I just said ...

Ivory Coast - Chile semi

After he saw what Dunga, Domenech and Lippi did, Diego Maradona decided to be no.1 again and says: "I can do even worse!"

Then he decided not to call up Lisandro Lopez, CAMBIASSO, J.ZANETTI... Grande Diego!! My god... He just made Argentina 30% weaker with exclusions of J.Zanetti and Cambiasso who are by all standards top players and are able to control whole team with their power, inteligence and experience.

Brasiliero, my fears for Brasil is not that the first 11-13 players cannot win the WC, its that some injuries can simply ruin Brasil for good in the WC. As you say Kaka', Robinho, L.Fabiano cannot be replaced. In my oppinion, Kaka' above all in this team.

BUT some of the players simply play 20% better when they start the game in Brasil shirts. Its really impressive what do you see whan you watch Elano play for Brasil, he sometimes looks like a world class player that came to play for real and then off to England to have fun. Same with some other players who are not superstars. I think it could be about rithm of their football etc.

I'd include D.Luiz and Pato, noone more. PAto is a player for big and important games, aldough people think he isnt coz he is young. But think about goals Pato scored vs Inter, Juve, Roma, Viola twice, Real etc. D. Luiz is a good solution for a LB. Enigma is why MAXWELL isnt called up constantly, as he is by far better FB then Marcelo. At least more serious.

Brasil has enough to win WC, their first 11 can do it. Its a question can their 18 do it, in my oppinion. I would be really surprised if Kaka' and Robinho have a bad WC. In that case Brasil cannot do anything.

Originally Posted by Gabriel489

Like a lot of you, I have no idea how Lippi can pick Zambro and Grosso over Antonini, as Antonini pretty much outplayed both of them this past season. as for Gattuso, there most be 5 other DMs that should be in the list instead of him starting with Ambrosini.
Anyhow, if past history has any weight at all-European Teams only won WC in Europe. I doubt Italy or France can win even with the proper selections.

To me, i think Brazil weakness is LB and maybe in the midfield. But their defense beside LB is as solid as they come with Maicon-Lucio-Juan/T. Silva. I think Dunga might just play Dani Alves as LB. If Dunga is brave enough, he will push T. Silva or Lucio as DM.
With Kaka-Fabiano-Robino up front, and top three GK in the world in Caesar, they are the favourite along with Spain.

He doesn't need to experiment, he has it all worked out for a long time. Melo and G. Silva/Josue are DMs since Dunga took over. The only change happened during last year is Elano lost his place to Ramires and LB position is problematic all the time. Dani Alves surely won't be LB because Dunga hardly tried him there (as a sub only). Fenerbahce guy (I'm so tired I can't remember his name) was a sure starter but he lost his place because of late-night partying, so one of Gilberto and Bastos will be LB. That's potential weak point, because neither of the two is a natural LB.

For Lippi, I think only Cassano should be in and perhaps Miccoli. He probably decided along with Totti not to call him. Miccoli is the same sh.t as Di Natale, i.e. he's gone when it matters, but unfortunately for Italian NT fans, we don't have any better, except Cassano. Zambrotta is probably the best side back Lippi has at the moment. He experience can't be overhauled. Grosso had a terrible season, but did he ever played good for a club?! And Gattuso, he's inclusion is not just to play football, but also because other, well known, reasons. Anyway, I believe in Lippi, but again he didn't had a great selection to choose from.

As for Maradona, I really don't have words, I really respect all coaches' decisions, after all it's their job and not mine, but not to call Cambiasso and Zanetti is really outrageous.

For England, I think Capello's name is marked with success, whatever he's doing, it's success, right now his only problem is he's players are tired because of many games played. If same players played this season in La Liga, for example, I would bet my life on England.

In the end, Spain is in the best position, especially because La Liga is a joke. All their players should be ready to rumble.

maradonna is doing white lines again, fabio capello i hope meets germany or spain in the quarter finals and the other team wins, two teams i absolutly don't want to see the world cup are 1. england for being a overated championship full of foreigners where hodgeson is the best manager whose english mabey redknapp, 2. france for having those two cowards platini,blatter the heads of the two most influential positions in almost all of worldfootball, i hope spain wins it and sticks it to the rest of the world, arriba hispania chavales! ( i hope italia go as far as possible too)

http://www.itasportpress.it/?action=...dnotizia=25488

Milan chasing Jucilei.

It is almost save, that a spanish team offered 8 M € for Jucilei...

Im happy for the Juciley news, looks like a modern player for the future. From what I saw his defending reminds me of young Emerson.

For 8mln, if that is the price, that is a 100% steal. REports say that our reinforcement for the fb position will be Aogo from HSV. A player that is good, has cross and can run, and is young... but is not class player. Sometimes its enough to have high-work-rate players in some positions, but we right now need more then that.

Originally Posted by mrki

Youŕe right, my friend.
Brasiliero, my fears for Brasil is not that the first 11-13 players cannot win the WC, its that some injuries can simply ruin Brasil for good in the WC. As you say Kaka', Robinho, L.Fabiano cannot be replaced. In my oppinion, Kaka' above all in this team.

We really don't have a replacement for Kaká. Ganso and Giuliano would be in the future(and P. Coutinho, Jean Carlo Chera in the future of the future), but even Ganso that is in a superb form, don't have the same style... and while I don't agree with 99% of the Brazilians, that believe Ganso will perform without I doubt(He clearly felt the pressure in under-20) in W. Cup, Dunga could have called him to the take Kleberson spot. He already has Melo and Ramires that can play that position.

BUT some of the players simply play 20% better when they start the game in Brasil shirts. Its really impressive what do you see whan you watch Elano play for Brasil, he sometimes looks like a world class player that came to play for real and then off to England to have fun. Same with some other players who are not superstars. I think it could be about rithm of their football etc.

Very good point, my friend. I have two reasons for that:
1- Dunga doesn't try to invent the wheel. He put the player where it's cristal clear the guy will perform. Look at Robinho's case. Capello tried hard to turn Robinho into a winger, the player didn't perform, and he just benched and cursed the player. At that time, Dunga called Robinho for NT(people in Brazil doubted about the move since Capello benched him), gave the player confidence, and most important, put Robinho as a second striker and won Copa America. Look, Capello resume talks for itself, but in contrary of others here, just because he's Italian(at least for me) doesn't mean he can't commit mistakes.

2- As Lugano(the Uruguayan) said 2 years ago in a interview here, Brazilians players think they are the best(in a good way), even when they aren't. He said laughing that in some games with São Paulo, he faced opponents that everyone was saying had a better team(and he also agree). But at the same time, when he looked to his side in the locker room, it saw players relaxed and saying to him to relax they were better and would win easily. Lugano said internally he was calling they(teammates) insane, but that when the games started, they really outplayed the ones considered the best team... As he said, it wasn't just bragging, petulance, it was just pure confidence. He said it's lacking on his national team, and as captain, he's trying to put it on the young players head.

Look at the 3 x 0 against the Argies in the final of Copa America. The world was saying Messi&co(Riquelme, Tevez, Aguero, Mascherano...) would go to run over Brazil... They(Arggies) didn't saw the color of the ball

So, even a good player like Elano, when put that yellow jersey, shows all he can do. We just need to get out of the France way. They are our nemesis!!

I'd include D.Luiz and Pato, noone more. PAto is a player for big and important games, aldough people think he isnt coz he is young. But think about goals Pato scored vs Inter, Juve, Roma, Viola twice, Real etc. D. Luiz is a good solution for a LB. Enigma is why MAXWELL isnt called up constantly, as he is by far better FB then Marcelo. At least more serious.

Agree with you. Few people in Brazil knows David Luiz. The majority just look for mid and attackers players. Just the pundits of the channel thst shows Portugal league hyped him. Pato as I always said, had no chance. Dunga never liked Pato and even bashed the kid at the press. Pato never had a chance

Btw, can't believe people still think Pato isn't a player for big games. It's a fact as you stated with names of the team he performed. People can't go against a facts... c'mon!

Marcelo had some bad games this year as LB, but if people take out the prejudice glass, could see the way he played the last part of the season as LB. Marcelo isn't a great defender, but he isn't as bad as people like to label. You can look at youtube, and most of the goals suffered by Real came from flaws of Sergio Ramos at RB. But since Marcelo is a work in progress(a former #10 turned into a LB at 15yo, and an Brazilian fullback), one flaw by him echoed more than 10 by Sergio Ramos or Alberoa.

Brasil has enough to win WC, their first 11 can do it. Its a question can their 18 do it, in my oppinion. I would be really surprised if Kaka' and Robinho have a bad WC. In that case Brasil cannot do anything.

Yep, and thats the criticism Dunga is getting here. People can't bash his first-11 cause they won everything. Sure you can change one or two players, but until today, they are the best.

But as you said, the problem is on the bench. Dunga's Brazil is amazing when they score first, and the game could become ugly for the opposite as Portugal and Argentine saw... But if they lose Kaka, Fabiano or Robinho, and are behind, there's no one on the bench(Alves and Nilmar aside) to turn the things around... and thats where I think Dunga will fail.

Memory to coaches that will face Dunga's Brazil: Don't try to be brave and play open against Brazil. Play a little catenaccio and try to score in the counter... Because we have a REAL defence(ask Messi), and when we take the ball back, you will left space enough to L. Fabiano, Robinho and Kaka explore it like nobody you've faced...
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EDIT:
Sorry for this outrageous big post... and the semis of Copa do Brazil will start now: Grêmio x Santos... a clash of styles. Shame Neymar is out because of a yellow card. But there Robinho, Ganso, Arouca and Wesley... and in Gremio, maybe Mauro Fernandes. He was injured but with a chance to play today... and Grêmio will need.

Also, but now in Libertadores, Cruzeiro x São Paulo.