AC Cesena vs AC Milan -- 11/9/2010

Well, this game proves one thing................we will not have an unbeaten season.

Skimming through the thread I found some interesting comments which I can't understand. But I guess everyone has a different view.

I don't understand how some people were blaming Abbiati. I understant that the goals MIGHT have been savable, but I didn't see too much to blame. The first goal was a great placed header and the second a good low shot. The fact is that today, there were much bigger problems then Abbiati and if anything, he is the least to be blamed for things. That's my opinion on that.

I agree with most that Papasthatopulos was terrible today. Didn't win a single battle against Bogdani. Both goals were directly his fault. Of course, indirectly before the goals actually came there were others that failed to do their job as well. But all in all, Sokratis failed to mark Bogdani. I wonder how he would mark Drogba, for example. The first goal he failed to pick up the run of Bogdani and was beaten to the ball. And tried to clear the ball with his foot rather then challenging for the header. The second goal, he went too far away from the line, which is fine. But he should have just stood of Bogdani and force him to make a back pass. Instead he over-runs the ball and tries to win it, when in fact he really had no chance nor position to win that ball. So Bogdani just holds him off and turns very calmly to face our goal and start the conter. By that point Sokratis is completely out of the play. Bonera was slowER then the Cesena player sprinting back, but I wouldn't blame him. We can't all of a sudden inject him with some Usain Bolt speed. He did what he could on that particular play, and it all goes back to Sokratis. He should have never let Bogdani turn. Practically, Sokratis took himself out of the play because he overrun the ball and tried to win a ball that he had no business winning. It was a silly mistake really.

But like people said, I won't rite him off. No way. He can improve and WILL improve. It was only none game. But there is really no reason of hiding the fact that he was poor.

The other thing that I don't agree with that's been said here is Robinho. I read some comments saying that he did better then Ronaldinho. I disagree. I think they were both crap today. The only thing that impressed me about Robinho is that on one occasion he was in our own box blocking a cross. He also seemed to move around the field and went more centrally instead of gluing himself to the line like Dinho usually does. But other then that, really a poor performance by both of them. Hopefully it was just this time and they'll both do better next time.

About Ibrahimovic....I was happy with what I saw. The way he holds the ball and brings others into play is remarkable. He is also a huge creative force in the forward line, but today, his tries simply didn't come off great. But I'm sure they'll work next time. He can really be the difference for us. A shame he didn't put away the PK. It was a good one, but unlucky.

As for everything else, it's been pretty much been said and I agree with all of it. We simply can't do with Ambro and Gattuso together anymore. We lose too much in the midfield. I wouldn't say that they were terrible. At times actually they did well, however we don't gain anything with going forward with them. And when Ronaldinho is having an off night, it really shows that these two can create simply NOTHING.

Pato did well I thought, although could have done better. A so-so night. But even as such, he scored two goals that in my eyes should have stood. I didn't see anything wrong with the goals.


Well that's over now boys. Let's get over it and move on to Auxerre. I might sound crazy when I say this, but this result should do us a lot of good. Because in the past week or so our players seemed to have crossed that line between confidence and arrogance. It's great to be confident and not fear anyone, thinking you can beat anyone and win the league. But there is a very very thin line between confidence and arrogance (thinking the wins will come just by walking out on the field and not playing). So this lose may have come at a good time to remind our players that they need to be confident, but never arrogant. The whole talk of "we need to/will win at least one of Serie A or the CL this year" was a little too much for my liking after that win against Lecce.

As always Forza Milan!!! Let's go and take it all out on Auxerre now.

Originally Posted by Tony75

Here, here. You learn more from defeat than victory, but I'd prefer if we weren't educated any more this season.

It reminds me the 3 Golden Balls attack 2 years ago

When Allegri said about CL final, I started to worry, after that, many people spoke of Milan very high, especially Ibra, Binho & Silva.

We were not very focused.

I don't blame Allegri for that line up. Boateng is maybe better than Gattuso, but playing him now is risky. If Flamini was not injuried, I think he was chosen.

I believe in Milan, in Allegri. Forza Allegri!!! Forza Milan!!!

My opinion on the game

Abbiati-Didn't have a good game, but you can't really blame him they weren't easy saves. I would like to see Amelia but I don't think we will see him against Auxerre since he has no competive matches for us

Bonera-I thought he had a solid game but we shouldn't count on him. With so many attacking players we don't need him to go forward, but he did it anyway and played horribly. Doesn't deserve a place in the team. I would prefer Zambrotta or play both Amrbosini and Flamini and play Abate

Thiago Silva-Played really well, I thought he had some communication problems with the teammates but until he got hurt played pretty well

Sokratis- A little reckless and had some mistakes but he will improve and I think he had an alright game unlike what some of you are saying

Antonini- Not much too say, average game. Didn't get forward as much as he would have liked, but I saw a couple plays where he played very well defensively

Gattuso- Horrible game, got the ball too much when it should have been with Pirlo. He can play for getting the ball, but shouldnt be involved in going forward or passing.

Ambrosini- Average game. Doesnt play very well with Gattuso.

Pirlo- Good game. Excellant distribution. Dribbling skills should be worked on

Ronaldinho- Lazy, not active at all. Seemed stranded by himself. Bad game.

Ibrahimovic- Good first half poor second half. Unlucky with the penalty but had a few good shots very good strength but slowed down the play when we needed to speed it up.

Pato- Dribbled far too much. Not a good game but he should have gotten that goal

Subs:

Abate- Not bad not good. Average game

Robinho- Very good, offensive and defensive

Inzaghi- Inzaghi is Inzaghi but needs to finish those chances that he got

Overral we didn't play very well but I am not worried. We need some time to mesh and we need to figure out the defense and defensive midfield, based on this we should play like this against Auxerre

------------------------------Abbati------------------------------------

-----Abate-----------Nesta?---------Silva?Papa?--------Antonini--------


---------------------Ambrosini--------Flamini?-------------------------

---------------------------Pirlo-------------------------------------



--------Pato----------------Ibrahimovic-------------Robinho---------

*Pirlo isn't playing as a trequartista just above two destroyers who have no offensive responsibility

*Question marks due to possible injuries

*Abate plays because since Ambrosini and Flamini/Gattuso will be playing in a more defensive role this will allow both fullbacks to play very offensive. We could win like this

Is Ibrahimovic our designated penalty taker now?

Originally Posted by Elmago99

I'm half kidding about Mexes... just I was heavily disappointed with Papastathopoulos...

maybe Onyewu would have been better.. or Yepes...

The absolute most important thing we can take from this game is that:

NESTA, ABBIATI, GATTUSO, PIRLO, AMBROSINI are getting old..

OUR Italians are getting old... WHO will replace them.. because it's time...

Nesta obviously is still a great player, but he cannot go on for ever...and is this Papa a suitable replacement? I think not....

The midfield is poor.. Flamini and KPB need to start playing a lot...

Nesta can still play, Abbiati never was good, Pirlo is still a fantastic player and his position doesn't demand much real athleticism and Ambrosini and Gattuso have been old for a while. Flamini is injured and I agree and this was the perfect oppurtunity for Boetang this game but he didn't play. Papa is a good replacement, he had a bad match at most.

One problem I saw when watching the match.

Pirlo was held up in our own half too often. I can understand he needed to recieve the ball and pass it, but once the opponents started putting pressure on Ambro and Gattuso, his midfield conduits, Pirlo started playing long, long balls up front.

I don't think he has to be the first to recieve the ball from T. Silva or Papa. Once the opponents started pressuring up front, they realised that although it was difficult in taking the ball off of Pirlo, but once they took out his passing lanes, high balls to the 3 up front were easy to deal with because not all of his long passes actually reached their target.

If we had swappeed the formation around and had Ambro or Gattuso holding the ball up to the halfway line, then playing Pirlo in, then Pirlo's ground balls wouldn't have to take such a long path to reach the front 3. Too oftern yesterday I was watching the match and thinking "alll these 50-60m long balls are being cut out, why can't we play on the ground? I only realised later that Gattuso and Ambro was being doubled up on to stifle Pirlo's options. Once they took the ball off the midfield, Cesena's legs did the rest because
(a) they were strong on the ball, we just couldn't get the ball off of them without doubling up, and
(b) once they took the ball away, the only players in defence was often just Pirlo, Silva, Papa and Bonera.

We still have plenty of time to get our formations right, I'm not that worried, but for the CL match, we cannot afford to play like this again.

On a side note, I hope Silva was taken out as a precaution and not because he was genuinly injured.

Originally Posted by Xudong

Is Ibrahimovic our designated penalty taker now?

No I don't think so Dinho is but he was off Pirlo would of taken it but they wanted Ibra to get a debut goal I think.

I don't know how can someone watch the game and rate gattuso terrible and pirlo excellent, I mean come on for god sake, gattuso wasn't superb but pirlo is excellent is a crime but it self. If he just saw the one dribble in the end of the game and missed 10000 missed chipped pass to ibra then I am extremely honored to be in a such a great forum sharing an opinion with a fellow milanista.

Guys sokratis was a mini kaladze this game no doubt about that, but overall no one was better in a defensive point of view. Thiago looked shaky and nervous which led to a terrible performance from our central defenders.

Going back to midfield pirlo is supposed to set the game up, he is supposed to create something out of nothing Damn he is the maestro. Pirlo is not getting any better, he is way so predictable so you can tell when he is going to dribble or when he is going for a chip pass. We literally had no game plan. So much individualism, no team runs or team plays. Ambrosini is the armband in the team I think this is his description for the time being and poor gattuso is the scapegoat of the fans.

Finally I am trying to figure out something, having a 195 cm tall striker means aerial ability inside the box, means put on a decent cross and what do we do ? We go crazy like it's the first time we play football, am not blaming the guys but everything they were doing was going dark. And yes ronaldinho is not the one to blame, enough with bull***t when he was orchestrating the attack it was going smoother, first finding pato at will which was leading all of the time to a 1on 1 situation but today everybody wanted to give the ball to ibra even when he was surrounded by 2 or 3 defenders. They should at least gave the ball to someone who can find him with a proper pass, not a 40 meters chip pass. Even on the corners.

The only comforting thing out of this defeat was allegri post match comments, he sent a clear message to everyone that everybody must and will work for his own neck, no one is safe not even him. Revealing locker room details was not a cool thing but it was bold,
This situation reminds me of a documentery I watched for sacchi when he first coached Milan, he lead a team of titans and failed the first five games then he and the team clicked, same thing happened to allegri first season at caglari.

I say we lower our expectations for now and wait for the team to gel and start showing strong signs. Being favourites created a very evil spirit in our camp and we need to work things in order to get the results we are looking for

Forza Milan

Originally Posted by Lebanese

I don't know how can someone watch the game and rate gattuso terrible and pirlo excellent, I mean come on for god sake, gattuso wasn't superb but pirlo is excellent is a crime but it self. If he just saw the one dribble in the end of the game and missed 10000 missed chipped pass to ibra then I am extremely honored to be in a such a great forum sharing an opinion with a fellow milanista.

Guys sokratis was a mini kaladze this game no doubt about that, but overall no one was better in a defensive point of view. Thiago looked shaky and nervous which led to a terrible performance from our central defenders.

Going back to midfield pirlo is supposed to set the game up, he is supposed to create something out of nothing Damn he is the maestro. Pirlo is not getting any better, he is way so predictable so you can tell when he is going to dribble or when he is going for a chip pass. We literally had no game plan. So much individualism, no team runs or team plays. Ambrosini is the armband in the team I think this is his description for the time being and poor gattuso is the scapegoat of the fans.

Finally I am trying to figure out something, having a 195 cm tall striker means aerial ability inside the box, means put on a decent cross and what do we do ? We go crazy like it's the first time we play football, am not blaming the guys but everything they were doing was going dark. And yes ronaldinho is not the one to blame, enough with bull***t when he was orchestrating the attack it was going smoother, first finding pato at will which was leading all of the time to a 1on 1 situation but today everybody wanted to give the ball to ibra even when he was surrounded by 2 or 3 defenders. They should at least gave the ball to someone who can find him with a proper pass, not a 40 meters chip pass. Even on the corners.

The only comforting thing out of this defeat was allegri post match comments, he sent a clear message to everyone that everybody must and will work for his own neck, no one is safe not even him. Revealing locker room details was not a cool thing but it was bold,
This situation reminds me of a documentery I watched for sacchi when he first coached Milan, he lead a team of titans and failed the first five games then he and the team clicked, same thing happened to allegri first season at caglari.

I say we lower our expectations for now and wait for the team to gel and start showing strong signs. Being favourites created a very evil spirit in our camp and we need to work things in order to get the results we are looking for

Forza Milan

The big difference between the Lecce game and this one was that Bogdani always came back and hounded Pirlo. Even if he didn't get the ball, he slowed him down and made sure everyone else closed off the channels and rushed back into position. Antonini can't make the run, because Pirlo was delayed by Bogdani.

What was missing yesterday was someone that can share the creative load with Pirlo in midfield. This is what Allegri was demanding in the summer, and he supposedly got his man in KPB. Why didn't he play him?

I'm getting an annoying feeling that Ronaldinho and Ibra aren't going to be as synergistic as Pato and Ibra obviously are. Ibra can control any ball, really, but Ronaldinho thrives on runners, like Pato, and also Borriello (he really is the perfect runner type player for R80, too bad he doesn't know what to do with it once he gets it...)

Like I said before, had we scored first, this could have been an easy game for us, but we risk a lot gambling this way. Would Honda have been a better pick over Robinho? Maybe. Since it seems Ibra would do just fine on the right wing, much better than Huntelaar at least...


Hmm...




****.

Originally Posted by Lebanese

I don't know how can someone watch the game and rate gattuso terrible and pirlo excellent, I mean come on for god sake, gattuso wasn't superb but pirlo is excellent is a crime but it self.

i've said this a thousand times - noone can give good passes / crosses to a static attack.
and if you watch the game and pay attention to the attacking line - they were standing still most of the time.

Originally Posted by nefremo

Well, this game proves one thing................we will not have an unbeaten season.

Skimming through the thread I found some interesting comments which I can't understand. But I guess everyone has a different view.

I don't understand how some people were blaming Abbiati. I understant that the goals MIGHT have been savable, but I didn't see too much to blame. The first goal was a great placed header and the second a good low shot. The fact is that today, there were much bigger problems then Abbiati and if anything, he is the least to be blamed for things. That's my opinion on that.

I agree with most that Papasthatopulos was terrible today. Didn't win a single battle against Bogdani. Both goals were directly his fault. Of course, indirectly before the goals actually came there were others that failed to do their job as well. But all in all, Sokratis failed to mark Bogdani. I wonder how he would mark Drogba, for example. The first goal he failed to pick up the run of Bogdani and was beaten to the ball. And tried to clear the ball with his foot rather then challenging for the header. The second goal, he went too far away from the line, which is fine. But he should have just stood of Bogdani and force him to make a back pass. Instead he over-runs the ball and tries to win it, when in fact he really had no chance nor position to win that ball. So Bogdani just holds him off and turns very calmly to face our goal and start the conter. By that point Sokratis is completely out of the play. Bonera was slowER then the Cesena player sprinting back, but I wouldn't blame him. We can't all of a sudden inject him with some Usain Bolt speed. He did what he could on that particular play, and it all goes back to Sokratis. He should have never let Bogdani turn. Practically, Sokratis took himself out of the play because he overrun the ball and tried to win a ball that he had no business winning. It was a silly mistake really.

But like people said, I won't rite him off. No way. He can improve and WILL improve. It was only none game. But there is really no reason of hiding the fact that he was poor.

The other thing that I don't agree with that's been said here is Robinho. I read some comments saying that he did better then Ronaldinho. I disagree. I think they were both crap today. The only thing that impressed me about Robinho is that on one occasion he was in our own box blocking a cross. He also seemed to move around the field and went more centrally instead of gluing himself to the line like Dinho usually does. But other then that, really a poor performance by both of them. Hopefully it was just this time and they'll both do better next time.

About Ibrahimovic....I was happy with what I saw. The way he holds the ball and brings others into play is remarkable. He is also a huge creative force in the forward line, but today, his tries simply didn't come off great. But I'm sure they'll work next time. He can really be the difference for us. A shame he didn't put away the PK. It was a good one, but unlucky.

As for everything else, it's been pretty much been said and I agree with all of it. We simply can't do with Ambro and Gattuso together anymore. We lose too much in the midfield. I wouldn't say that they were terrible. At times actually they did well, however we don't gain anything with going forward with them. And when Ronaldinho is having an off night, it really shows that these two can create simply NOTHING.

Pato did well I thought, although could have done better. A so-so night. But even as such, he scored two goals that in my eyes should have stood. I didn't see anything wrong with the goals.


Well that's over now boys. Let's get over it and move on to Auxerre. I might sound crazy when I say this, but this result should do us a lot of good. Because in the past week or so our players seemed to have crossed that line between confidence and arrogance. It's great to be confident and not fear anyone, thinking you can beat anyone and win the league. But there is a very very thin line between confidence and arrogance (thinking the wins will come just by walking out on the field and not playing). So this lose may have come at a good time to remind our players that they need to be confident, but never arrogant. The whole talk of "we need to/will win at least one of Serie A or the CL this year" was a little too much for my liking after that win against Lecce.

As always Forza Milan!!! Let's go and take it all out on Auxerre now.

Generally agree with your post as always. I agree about Abbiati for definite, I really don't understand the fuss around him. He was slow to dive for the goals, but they weren't easy saves as both shots were moving away from him. He was below his standard for me, which is why I think he had a poor showing, but certainly nothing to warrant some of the comments against him (and for definite I think he's better than Amelia right now).

I think it's difficult to judge Robinho as it was his first appearance after just joining (like Ibra). You make an important point about him tracking back though, as this is what Dinho wasn't doing. On the first goal in particular it's evident that for the team to succeed we must have our attackers pulling back to help out defensively and add numbers to the midfield in the defensive phase. Instead, during this goal there was a massive gap between the midfielders and attackers and it cost us as if Pato and Dinho pulled back, then we might have had cover for the Cesena winger.

Pato was actually great going forward. He linked up very well at times with Ibra and was a consistent source of problems for Cesena. Had his goals stood as they should have, I'm sure we'd all be praising him. That said, his defensive duties were left unattended, which isn't acceptable.

We failed to work as a team as I said in my post yesterday (interestingly enough both Sacchi and Allegri had alluded to this problem before the match), but I do think this defeat will serve us well for the season. Before and in the Lecce match there was a buzz surrounding the club and the team looked really hungry for victories this year. Prior to this match it seemed as though the team went on the field expecting an easy win given the quality of our squad. If we are to win, this team cannot let hype get to its head and must maintain the hunger we showed in the first match.

Something that i saw last night and it was a big joke.....
After some of rare beautiful combinations in attack of Ibra-Ronie and Pato, the ball goes to rigth side for a good cross......quess whose coming to cross......Bonera! Same thing on the left side.......ques whose coming.......Antonini........!!!!!

We have in attack Ibra,Pato,Ronie,Robinho and in a tight defence like Cesena last night the only way to break this defence is to play from the wings...... but we haven't realised that we have not a single player who can cross a f...king good ball!!!! Im not saying to cross in 10 balls 10 good crosses,..........at least the 5!!!!! DAMN!

I want Pippo to come on every game at around the 70 minute mark. He really gives us another dimension. Too bad Pato can't be this direct and hungry.

Originally Posted by Lebanese

I don't know how can someone watch the game and rate gattuso terrible and pirlo excellent, I mean come on for god sake, gattuso wasn't superb but pirlo is excellent is a crime but it self. If he just saw the one dribble in the end of the game and missed 10000 missed chipped pass to ibra then I am extremely honored to be in a such a great forum sharing an opinion with a fellow milanista.

Guys sokratis was a mini kaladze this game no doubt about that, but overall no one was better in a defensive point of view. Thiago looked shaky and nervous which led to a terrible performance from our central defenders.

Going back to midfield pirlo is supposed to set the game up, he is supposed to create something out of nothing Damn he is the maestro. Pirlo is not getting any better, he is way so predictable so you can tell when he is going to dribble or when he is going for a chip pass. We literally had no game plan. So much individualism, no team runs or team plays. Ambrosini is the armband in the team I think this is his description for the time being and poor gattuso is the scapegoat of the fans.

Finally I am trying to figure out something, having a 195 cm tall striker means aerial ability inside the box, means put on a decent cross and what do we do ? We go crazy like it's the first time we play football, am not blaming the guys but everything they were doing was going dark. And yes ronaldinho is not the one to blame, enough with bull***t when he was orchestrating the attack it was going smoother, first finding pato at will which was leading all of the time to a 1on 1 situation but today everybody wanted to give the ball to ibra even when he was surrounded by 2 or 3 defenders. They should at least gave the ball to someone who can find him with a proper pass, not a 40 meters chip pass. Even on the corners.

The only comforting thing out of this defeat was allegri post match comments, he sent a clear message to everyone that everybody must and will work for his own neck, no one is safe not even him. Revealing locker room details was not a cool thing but it was bold,
This situation reminds me of a documentery I watched for sacchi when he first coached Milan, he lead a team of titans and failed the first five games then he and the team clicked, same thing happened to allegri first season at caglari.

I say we lower our expectations for now and wait for the team to gel and start showing strong signs. Being favourites created a very evil spirit in our camp and we need to work things in order to get the results we are looking for

Forza Milan

I wouldn't say that Gattuso was terrible but the ball went to him WAY too much. Pirlo played well I think he did a great mix of passes and dribbling but I wouldn't say he was excellant. Although Sokratis didn't play well we shouldn't just count him out. He is a quality player.

I don't think we ever "officialy" Serie A favorites. Inter are still favorites. And I agree that we will gel and get better, just a blip. Allegri still needs to experiment with the players that arrived after the friendlies ended

Originally Posted by rosoneri_11

Something that i saw last night and it was a big joke.....
After some of rare beautiful combinations in attack of Ibra-Ronie and Pato, the ball goes to rigth side for a good cross......quess whose coming to cross......Bonera! Same thing on the left side.......ques whose coming.......Antonini........!!!!!

We have in attack Ibra,Pato,Ronie,Robinho and in a tight defence like Cesena last night the only way to break this defence is to play from the wings...... but we haven't realised that we have not a single player who can cross a f...king good ball!!!! Im not saying to cross in 10 balls 10 good crosses,..........at least the 5!!!!! DAMN!

The problem is that Cesena defended VERY well ...

They reminded me of Bari last year. Smart team, enthusiastic players, high pressure in midfield, and of course, like often with these kinds of team, 100% or almost of chance (1 chance = 1 goal for them, and for us, a goal = offside even without any offside), you'll see, other teams will be in trouble against Cesena !!

Then, of course, it's not the ideal way to start a championship (we lived the 2 ways: an easy and entertaining victory, followed by a loss with few chances for us), but I prefer to see us lose that kind of game the way we lost it now rather than in 2 months !!

PS: The main problem of yesterday is we were beaten physically by the other team, it looked like our players were unable to change the rythm, playing a slow passes game.