Gourcuff-Ancelotti

To get this clear.
I can not understant Ancelotti's treatment with Gourcuff. Against Genoa, even though i don't know if he was on the bench, he used the regular subs, Emerson ( a 32 year old ), Brocchi ( the same ), and Gilardino ( a player that needs confidence and not a typical appearance in 15 minutes ). Where is Gourcuff?
The one thing is that Ancelotti is clearly obsessed with expirienced players, that would react with no pressure. If we do accept that Gourcuff is not able to reach that level at the age of 21, what happens with Pato? An 18 year old player gets a staring place in a team where players like Baggio struggled to get a regular place. So i don't think that it has to go with age or expirience, but, i'm afraid it has to do with-as Ancelotti sees it- innability. He considers this player a Coppa Italia level man. If things appear to be so, the only thing that can be done, is we will destry the career of this man. Why should we keep a player, since now we were eliminated by Coppa Italia? What keeps that player motivated in Milan when he sees a player like Brocchi getting into the pitch while he sits on the bench?
I can accept that Pato got an empty spot in Milan's starting 11, while Gourcuff has to drop either Kaka or Seedorf. But, against Genoa, it is extremnly useless to suggest that we need Seedorf to win it. If we can smoothly put a young guy in the squad against a team that should be beaten easily, when will that happen? If we can't win Genoa in San Siro, with Gourcuff instead of Seedorf, then we deserve being 10th.
The same goes for Gilardino. I stronlgy believe that Gilardino, in terms of ability, is one of the best strikers in Italy. No one scores in Italy without being good. But under these circumstances, no one would perform as he used to. Playing under great dispute and questioned all the time, a constant on/off in the transfer list, a crowd with no clear feelings about him and an uncertain position in the pitch even when a team plays with one single striker, is all together the reason why he can't score in the one-on-nobody. I am sure that he is a lost case for Milan, but if he goes to another top team ( Juventus ) and play with another forward next to him he will shine, unbothered by other problems.
With those, I don't blame Ancelotti, I'm just thinking. I would like to see your oppinion.

Well I do blame Ancelotti...maybe I'm completely wrong in doing so...but I disagree with his subs and I'm really getting fed of that defensive approach at home against weaker teams.

I also wonder why are we keeping Gourcuff...there's no point in having one of the hottest prospects in Europe who used to captain the u-21 side (IIRC) playing in Coppa Italia matches and giving him 2 minutes on the field whenever (rareeeely) Ancelotti decides to put the guy on...Note: In those two minutes we just try to keep possession of the ball to kill the game so why bother?

I also agree that if we can't beat Genoa at home with Gourcuff playing instead of Seedorf then we really should be 10th or even lower in the table, is our squad that bad that we can't win a game if we don't play with our Strongest XI? (Which is not even that strong anymore)

IMO Ancelotti has lost it (at least in the league) and is lacking ideas/players/guts and while I'd thank him for all he's done for this side...I wouldn't be sad to see him leaving for a top coach like Lippi/Mourinho...or Wenger (my dream coach)

Gourcuff and gila havent really lit it up when they have gotten the chance...

now gourcuff hasent had as many chances, but i guarentee that when he over-dribbles, or is out of position, carlo goes crazy. that being said, i think he requires more chances with the first XI...so he can learn the system and where to be ect. Also, seedorf plays much better when rested.

gila...well that a slippery slope and intense thread...

Gourcuff is simply yesterday's news for this team now. Why does Pato get to start when Gourcuff has to sit till he rots? Didin't you hear the president talk about how Pato is the new megastar for this team and that he is going to score 30 goals in half a season? To be fair, neither Gourcuff nor Pato really should be starting right now because both need a lot more seasoning to fully utilize their potential. But Pato is the only new signing this team made last year and is supposed to be the hope of the franchise. He has to start because otherwise the fans will demand Berlusconi to spend more money on the market and buy some real players, and we all know how he feels about that. If you can remember this, the same thing happened last season with Oliveira and Gourcuff. Both of them stunk in games and clearly didn't deserve to play at all, but Ancelotti still gave them plenty of time to prove themselves. Not because Ancelotti loved those two guys to death, but because the management wouldn't let their investments look like jokes, even though that is the reality.

Originally Posted by slifersd

But Pato is the only new signing this team made last year and is supposed to be the hope of the franchise. He has to start because otherwise the fans will demand Berlusconi to spend more money on the market and buy some real players, and we all know how he feels about that. If you can remember this, the same thing happened last season with Oliveira and Gourcuff. Both of them stunk in games and clearly didn't deserve to play at all, but Ancelotti still gave them plenty of time to prove themselves. Not because Ancelotti loved those two guys to death, but because the management wouldn't let their investments look like jokes, even though that is the reality.

Good points, slifersd. Perhaps more than anything Carletto likes the stability the most. With Seedorf-Pirlo-Rino has been gelling one to another for years and Ambro's revival, it will be utterly difficult for Gorky to play, even as a sub. The good thing is Gorky said that he'd fight for a spot at least until this season ends. I like that kind of mentality, but frankly speaking I think this season is likely the last opportunity for him to prove his worth

Here's my 2 cents:
What makes Milan Milan (or at least Carlo's Milan anyway) is POSESSION. Carlo has to deal every day with the problem of very little width and hardly any speed aside from Kaka Pato or a fit Ronaldo. Hence we use Seedorf EXTENSIVELY to hold on to posession and distribute the ball far up front.

As talented as he Gorcuff is nowehre near Seedorf in terms of keeping posession. He might be good in attack but Carlo needs more than that. The game against Atalanta clearly showed how POOR we are at dealing with lost posession.....esp as Gattuso is pretty quiet in these games.

My one cent-Gorky rots this year because he was given chances last year. Pato plays because he obviously has been aces in training, and have produced the goods on the pitch. Watching Gorky is frustrating because he a) is young and should play and develop, yet b)frustrates the heck out of me becuase he always seems out of position, losing the ball, not looking like he DESERVES to play...it is a bum situation, I am glad he'll fight till the end of the year, but I think he knows that it is time for him to move on. hopefully we can get a price for him.
peace out

Originally Posted by jtelly

My one cent-Gorky rots this year because he was given chances last year. Pato plays because he obviously has been aces in training, and have produced the goods on the pitch. Watching Gorky is frustrating because he a) is young and should play and develop, yet b)frustrates the heck out of me becuase he always seems out of position, losing the ball, not looking like he DESERVES to play...it is a bum situation, I am glad he'll fight till the end of the year, but I think he knows that it is time for him to move on. hopefully we can get a price for him.
peace out

I agree about Gourcuff. He should develop and play games. I think, Milan should loan him, he is right now not suitable for Milan. This is his last chance, if he still cant get games, he should go (I prefer loaning him). He must play (a situation that Milan cant give right now)!

Without being convinced either that Gourcuff is Milan starting 11 quality, not all the 20 year old players have the immidiate effect with Kaka. To be sure that Gourcuff deserves to be in Milan, not even 10 games can prove that. He should first feel important, and not that he is taking an every day exam.
I am not saying Ancelotti is wrong. I'm just curious about his thoughts about him when he gets home.
As for possesion football played by Milan, I agree, but sooner or later, Seedorf will retire ( even though in Milan he could play until 40 ), and we will ask for a replacement. Same goes with Pirlo and Gattuso. I hope we won't realize that we had the replacement in our squad but sold him. Rijkaard was once going to be replaced by Vieira, but we threw away that option. With the attitude shown right now, either we lack judgement, or we pay a non-worthing youngster.

Gourcuff cant prove him self by playing 20 min in few games.

20 minutes is pushing it. He gets at most 10 minutes every 4th match we play. When anybody else in our team is in bad form, Carlo shows trust in the player and allows the player to get back into top form. Seedorf for example was DISASTROUS in the first half of last season. Pirlo regardless of form is played, as is Gattuso etc etc.

Even if Seedorf is in good form as he is now, 25 minutes can't be TOO difficult to give Gourcuff. He has the skills to cause the opposing defense trouble, has a good cross, nice vision and a good shot as well. Keep in mind that I am in no way suggesting that Gourcuff is better than Seedorf. However, Seedorf is getting older and can't/shouldn't play as many games in a row. Gourcuff is a young promising player who has shown that he can do a good job in our midfield( recall Kaka calling him his Messi after the AEK game). If Gourcuff doesn't get more chances this year then I'm 100% certain that his father will go to the management and request at least a loan so that his son can get more playing time. His career is basically getting stifled the way things are going.

Barcelona I'm sure can be considered a great/big club. Look at what they've done with Krcic, giving him enough substitute chances (i.e. MORE than 5 minutes) so that he got integrated and forced his way into the starting 11. All I'm asking is to at least consistently give Gourcuff the chance to impress. That for me is at least 20 mins a match with the occasional start here and there. If that's too much then it's a waste of his time and our money to keep him here.

like every other star i think when seedorf or majority of other of our midfielders are injured and carlo is forced to play gorcuff than i think is when he will really be able to try to stay in the starting rotation i think that is the only way he will get his chance while carlo is at milan or in that case gorcuff as well

Good thread...good thoughts, and all with valid points.

I think that Gorky has been in Carlo´s bad books ever since the Celtic game, where he allowed the Celtic player to be onside, which cost us the game.

Its difficult (it seems) for some players to regain Carlo´s trust..and I will go further to say that Pato cant really be considered with Gorky, because our forward situation is vastly different to what obtains in the midfield...

We have a completely different picture in the midfield, while with R99 and Pippo out, thru injury, plus the amount of money paid for him, combine to force him into the starting 11 (not to mention Gila´s sputtering form)

That being said, Gorky IMO should get more playing time....but since none of us here are watching the training sessions, we cant kno for certain that he is impressing Carlo enough to warrant more time.

Indeed, if he cant wedge himself into our starting 11 by the middle of this half of the season, we should see about loaning him out, depending on what our midfield looks like, or potentially looks like, come the start of next season.

Part of it is due to our ongoing inability to put lesser teams away, but I also think it's because people have bought into the ridiculous hype of Gour being the "next Zidane" or whomever, and expect him to be God in return. Not every youngster is going to be an instant Messi or Kaka.

Originally Posted by BMWTaylor

Part of it is due to our ongoing inability to put lesser teams away, but I also think it's because people have bought into the ridiculous hype of Gour being the "next Zidane" or whomever, and expect him to be God in return. Not every youngster is going to be an instant Messi or Kaka.

but messi and kaka were given the chance to play...just like bojan at barca...and gorcuff its been nothing...emerson is being picked over him...brochi is being picked over him....how are we ever suppose to develop for the future? ok i agree we have one of the best midfield...but when seedorf or kaka need rest and we are playing against relegation zone teams gorcuff needs to play..carlo has really dissapointed me ...if gorky doesnt play he will go to a team like arsenal or MAN U where they AcTUALLY develop youngsters