View Full Version : Milan v Chievo October 25th ...
You didnt understand what I was saying about young players...(yes some of them are attacking midfilders...but it doesnt matter, they score goals).
Yes it does matter! What's easier for a young player? To play in midfield, put in good performances and be carried by 4 other midfielders when things don't go so well? Or be your team's main striker, to lead the line and carry the majority of responsibility for your team winning? For an 18 year old bursting onto the scene IN A DEMANDING LEAGUE (for those who didn't read that the first time i mentioned it!) it's easier and more common to find young first choice midfielders than young first choice strikers. So your whole argument that Gilardino didn't do so well in his early seasons at Verona and Parma is for my money null & void as he was clearly still learning the art of a striker.
Ever heard about Wayne Rooney or Ronaldo or Even robinho? didn't think so This is the type of players that deserve the red and black
Read my post again, i said a DEMANDING league. Strikers scoring goals for fun in Brazil or Holland are two a penny, yet when they move to a better league half don't perform as well. Have i heard of Wayne Rooney? Hmmm ... let me think, living in England, supporting England, seeing the Premiership every week ... no, i don't think i know him :rolleyes: Is Robinho a consistent player? No!
Of course every player can have his down period...but not as long as Gila has.
lets see ... Raul has been poor for over 12 months and is finally coming back to some decent form, this is the leading goal scorer in CL history don't forget so i'd say he has some pedigree. Crespo was rubbish for a while before he came to us and then again while he was with us. Morientes was awful at Liverpool for 18 months, yet has recaptured his form at Valencia. RVN suffered a dip in form for a few months. These things have happened to more established players than Gilardino, they came back, so can our man!
Ever heard about a player nemed Kevin Phillips? He did exactly the same thing. So did James Beattie. So Do many players in serieA and La Liga. It happens
What does Phillips and Beattie have to do with Egoistka declaring that all of Gilardino's goals for Parma in his last 2 seasons for them were down to luck? I'm not denying the fact that some strikers have good seasons and then for the rest of the time they aren't as prolific. But saying all of his 50 odd goals are down to luck? Get real! :delol:
And I suppose you do? I can only judge what I see/ don't see and what I don't see are goals.What I do see is a pathetic player who can't even help in the attacks properly
Did i say i did? I wasn't the one declaring how Gilardino will behave for the rest of his career!
Welcome to the forums icculus, if you haven't already you should tell us all a bit about yourself in the Presentations section :D
One of the things i disagree with in your post is your comparison of Gilardino to Inzaghi. You're comparing an intermediate with a veteran, in terms of learning and experience. I don't remember how old Inzaghi is, but he has at least 7 years more experience in knowing where to run, how to do this, that, the other. However he still can't stay onside properly! :D
Inzaghi was probably a bit more clinical in his finishing and a bit more instinctive in his movement, but these all improve with time. Obviously i'm comparing Inzaghi to Gilardino when he was scoring freely, not the Gilardino of this exact moment before anyone makes a wise-ass comment.
Oh ... everyone's gone offline, Egoistka, Drucurl, zZ[-_-]Zz and icculus ...
Well that's me out of this mini debate then, i very rarely come back to a discussion after it's all died down a bit ...
Egoistka
26-10-2006, 13:45
Hope u dont mind me asking but why are u both so anti gila, did you have a ex boyfriend who looked like him or something.. i hate zidane with a passion, but u dont hear me bitchin' about him, Gila must cry himself to sleep everynight if he reads the forums...
Why? There is a very good explanation for that: why do we need to like striker who doesnt score goals? His performance is horrible - and that is the reason...boyfriends, girlfriends do not have anything to do with it.
Keep the discussion civil and keep personal matters out of it. Its getting annoying, the forums are lately only about Gila, Gila, Gila.
BTW Welcome Icculus :)
Egoistka
26-10-2006, 13:52
Yes it does matter! What's easier for a young player? To play in midfield, put in good performances and be carried by 4 other midfielders when things don't go so well? Or be your team's main striker, to lead the line and carry the majority of responsibility for your team winning? For an 18 year old bursting onto the scene IN A DEMANDING LEAGUE (for those who didn't read that the first time i mentioned it!) it's easier and more common to find young first choice midfielders than young first choice strikers. So your whole argument that Gilardino didn't do so well in his early seasons at Verona and Parma is for my money null & void as he was clearly still learning the art of a striker.
Look...you again didnt get the idea. What I was saying is that there are young players (strikers, midfilders, goalkeepers, defenders) with consistently good performance. It doesnt really matter how old are you, if you have talent - you ll play good...if not...then it doesnt matter wheather you are 18 or 29. So my examples of attacking midfilders are relevant.
lets see ... Raul has been poor for over 12 months and is finally coming back to some decent form, this is the leading goal scorer in CL history don't forget so i'd say he has some pedigree. Crespo was rubbish for a while before he came to us and then again while he was with us. Morientes was awful at Liverpool for 18 months, yet has recaptured his form at Valencia. RVN suffered a dip in form for a few months. These things have happened to more established players than Gilardino, they came back, so can our man!
Being poor is different from having "0 - goal period" for so long, considering that Gila was always in the starting line up..only now the situation is changing for him.
What does Phillips and Beattie have to do with Egoistka declaring that all of Gilardino's goals for Parma in his last 2 seasons for them were down to luck? I'm not denying the fact that some strikers have good seasons and then for the rest of the time they aren't as prolific. But saying all of his 50 odd goals are down to luck? Get real! :delol:
I didnt say 50 odd goals...I said why he scored them. I think Gilardino is one lucky goal time wonderer. Its like some singers who ve done only one song, but so great that people still listen it in 20 years time and like it.
Egoistka
26-10-2006, 13:57
Keep the discussion civil and keep personal matters out of it. Its getting annoying, the forums are lately only about Gila, Gila, Gila.
BTW Welcome Icculus :)
The reason why everybody talks about Gila now is because he is a real big problem...Milan needs goals
Graeme C
26-10-2006, 14:07
The reason why everybody talks about Gila now is because he is a real big problem...Milan needs goals
Inzaghi and Oliveira are there too...
he scored 5 goals in the first season and another 50 in the second and third. After that he moved to Milan....I dont really see brilliant statistics...Two lucky seasons. Yes, it is called luck, and nothing else.
Yes, you said why Gilardino scored those goals ......... through luck! That is exactly what you said.
Poor form or 0 goals, i would imagine they are pretty similar. I doubt any of the players i mentioned were scoring alot considering the form they were in.
zZ[-_-]Zz
26-10-2006, 14:27
Jim... you talk about Serie A bein' a demandin' league... yeah you are right... but at the same time... Milan has demandin' fans (me bein' one of them)... and we demand a top quality striker that can score... so are we wrong in that sense? if Gilardino is not that solution... surely it is not wrong of us to bench him...
the whole SerieA being a demanding league thing for me is abject nonesense. I was really a follower of the doctrine up until I saw Tevez, Sheva and Crespo struggling. I am also convinced the especially Gila wouldn't make it in England. To me Spain is the only place where it is relatively easy to score and its also for this reason I am cautious about looking to ronaldinho/ Torres as our saviour.
Anyway Milan always at least had a great striker up fornt whether it was Sheva, Bierhoff :D Weah or MVB. No one but no one can tell me that Gila is in the class of any of these. For this reason he isn't Milan Material. There are many much better players his age and younger who have been held to much higher standards at smaller clubs. e.g. Nilmar was sent back to Brazil DESPITE his scoring for (PSG?) Fred gets the bench ever so often at Lyon Rooney is harshly criticized despite him already scoring three goals this season. All these guys are younger and come form smaller clubs. So why do we have to put up with Gila?
Graeme C
26-10-2006, 14:51
Bierhoff was brilliant at heading, but couldnt dripple the ball very well, and could only really use 1 of his legs. Gila on the other hand beats him on the ground, in the air Bierhoff is better... But again they are different types of players...
Of course it's not wrong to be demanding Dan, i am demanding just like most other fans. But i don't buy this ridiculous notion though that a prolonged period of stuttering in front of goal from Gilardino means we should sell him immediately! Bench him? Sure. Make him fight for us place? Of course. But keep in mind we only have limited options up front, so wether the anti-gila people like it or not, he will get more opportunities than some think he deserves. But sell him? No way.
Drucurl you're not getting the point about demanding leagues. Scoring alot of goals in a demanding league such as Serie A, Premiership or La Liga is more difficult than in leagues from Brazil, France or Holland. Now do you see the point?
Where on earth do you get the idea that people supporting Gilardino are saying he's as good as Shevchenko, Van Basten, Weah or even Bierhoff?
Jim_UK
Registered User
Of course it's not wrong to be demanding Dan, i am demanding just like most other fans. But i don't buy this ridiculous notion though that a prolonged period of stuttering in front of goal from Gilardino means we should sell him immediately! Bench him? Sure. Make him fight for us place? Of course. But keep in mind we only have limited options up front, so wether the anti-gila people like it or not, he will get more opportunities than some think he deserves. But sell him? No way.
Drucurl you're not getting the point about demanding leagues. Scoring alot of goals in a demanding league such as Serie A, Premiership or La Liga is more difficult than in leagues from Brazil, France or Holland. Now do you see the point?
Where on earth do you get the idea that people supporting Gilardino are saying he's as good as Shevchenko, Van Basten, Weah or even Bierhoff?
Well the fact that we have all acknowledged that he isn't means that he shouldn't be our starting foward. Our starting fowards have always been among the world's best or at least near to them (except Jose Maria).
This admission in itself is the point of much of the "anti-gila" camp.
I don't see how Holland is seen as a lower league either. MVB and a boatload of Serie, Permiership and LA Liga stars came form there, so I don't get your point. In any case, you were implying that Italy is more demanading than England. If you viewed England as a demanding league then you wouldn't have dismissed my examples of Phillips Beattie etc or the point that Rooney and Robinho Ronaldo have all performed in "demanding leagues" as well so please re-formulate your ideas and try again!
zZ[-_-]Zz
26-10-2006, 15:33
i'm never in favour of sellin' Gilardino despite sometimes mentionin' it... i may not be nice with my posts about him here... but for sure... i am defendin' him whenever in the presence of my other friends who keeps remindin' me about his lack of goals...
my motto in life is simple... never settle for second best... because once you do... you will never be able to fulfill your own potential... and it will limit yourself to mediocrity...
and at the moment... Gilardino is second best & his performances is barely adequate...
Well the fact that we have all acknowledged that he isn't means that he shouldn't be our starting foward. Our starting fowards have always been among the world's best or at least near to them (except Jose Maria).
So Oliveira, Boriello and Inzaghi are among or near to the world's best? No, i didn't think so either.
I don't see how Holland is seen as a lower league either. MVB and a boatload of Serie, Permiership and LA Liga stars came form there, so I don't get your point.
You're saying that it's just as hard to score in Holland as it is to score in England, La Liga & Serie A? Sorry, i can't agree with you at all there.
In any case, you were implying that Italy is more demanading than England. If you viewed England as a demanding league then you wouldn't have dismissed my examples of Phillips Beattie etc or the point that Rooney and Robinho Ronaldo have all performed in "demanding leagues" as well so please re-formulate your ideas and try again!
I did nothing of the sort, how i phrased my post and how you interpreted it seem to be two different things. It's not my fault if you grasped it wrong, i think it's you who need to try again :rollani:
poor gila...
the fact that he makes more $$ in one year than i will make in a life time makes it hard for me to have too much sympathy for him, however...
i just started following soccer (football) about 3 yrs ago & was extremely excited gila. with all the hype, my son and i thought he was the second coming of (insert great player here).
i think the big question is "how long does he get to start performing on the level expected?" - couple games, 1/2 a season, a full year...2 yrs?
the smaller question is "if he doesnt turn it around, & i think everyone agrees he must, what sort of market will there be for him?" -
whatever the case, i think we all really, really, really want him to play up to his expected level.
Hey how about Dida...a lot of people were running him out of town b4 the beginning of the season...and he has looked stellar.
ACMILAN1983
27-10-2006, 04:23
Firstly, before I reply, don't swear, it's against forum rules. (goes for all posters)
Why do you compare Gila to Boriello. This comparison doesnt have any ground, same as comparison between Gila and Oliveira. Boriello and RO didnt immidiately get the place in the starting line up, unlike Gilardino. They had only several games to prove themselves, considering that they almost never play the full game or from the start of it. Yes Boriello misssed many opportunities...nobody here says that he ve done really well, but Boriello havent got any chances to play, what do you expect from him. He is a bench man.
I was talking about the Chievo match, where Borriello had just as good chances as Gila and missed, yet there were no real complaints (just a few laughs) over that. My point is every player in the squad has a role to perform and they are expected to do the job when called on. Currently, NONE of our forwards are doing their job, but only Gila is getting complaints. Blaming the individual when clearly there are deeper issues is just pointless.
Oh yeah? He contributes by loosing the ball, wasting 100 percent goal opportunities and not scoring goals at all? Do you mean this contribution? Stop mentioning THE PRESSURE...Its ****! (I m not going to sware, but everyone understands what I mean). About his assist statistics for the last season....he had 2 assists for the whole previous year. Is it considered the greatest number of assists?
This argument is just plain stupid. Firstly, he statiscally counted up for having 10 assists all of last season (like I've mentioned, this probably includes penalties won). Of course, in the situations where he did win freekicks or penalties, you'll probably argue back he shouldn't have been getting fouled and should've scored anyway :rolleyes: . He's very good at holding up the ball and waiting for midfield support. He makes fairly intelligent runs and drops deep very well when required.
Also, the pressure he is under is very real, because his form has been blown out of proportion and everyone seems to act like he's the sole reason for our stagnant attack.
Gila played for Hellas Verona for 2 seasons and scored only 5 goals, then he moved to Parma where he scored 5 goals in the first season and another 50 in the second and third. After that he moved to Milan....I dont really see brilliant statistics...Two lucky seasons. Yes, it is called luck, and nothing else. The second season was lucky and third he scored many goals only because of being UP...being not moody. Maybe he should have stayed in Parma...he is not MIlan quality player.
lol, yes, I believe you when you see that good scoring records in 3 successive seasons is based purely on luck. When he was at Verona he was VERY young and just barely breaking through and his first season at Parma wasn't a key player.
In CL Gila cannot score, in Seria A Gila is not scoring for a long long long period...So yes, of course, he is a brilliant striker! Just THE ONE we need. Gila is just a dream of every team...
Oh yes, clearly Gilardino is a waste of our time because everyone knows that decent strikers won't have times when they're struggling. If we followed your logic, Inzaghi and Sheva would have been sold off long ago. :rolleyes:
About the target man...yes Sheva left, but even playing with Sheva Gila didnt score in the second half of the season. Now there is Kaka...so there is help for Gila. Dont try to say that noone helps him, noone passes on him...Its not everybody's fault that Gila is not scoring - it is Gila's fault.
STOP constantly mentioning PRESSURE, POOR SERVICE etc....This is not the problem. What is Kaka supposed to do (or Pirlo, Oliveira, Inzaghi, Seedorf, Kaladze....)? Push Gilardino with the ball to the net, so he d finally score?
Notice that Gila's form dropped as Inzaghi was returning and Sheva's form had dropped. He isn't a player who is capable of doing huge things on his own (like Sheva and Kaka), he's a goalscorer who needs to be supplied opportunities and needs others to help him open up defences (like Pippo and Crespo).
Quite frankly your arguments suggests of you having a greater personal issue with Gila than him really performing as badly as you say. Half of the arguments you present are a completely joke (lucky to score 20+ goals in 2 successive seasons :haha: ) and those where you possibly have a valid point are so heavily dramatised and subjectively masked with a clear disliking of the player that you ruin your own argument.
I'm not happy about Gila's performances this year, but the way he's treated is a complete joke. If I was him, I'd probably consider leaving Milan because the attitude of some fans is just disgusting.
^ the way he's treated? Easy there sparky :D Gila won't ever read this forum so I doubt you can hurt his feelings.
Jim UK I was not saying that it is as easy to score in Holland as in England just merely that the gap isn't as huge as you might suppose. Gosh you English are conceited about your league aren't you?
I am beginning to doubt your literacy as well since I said "our starting fowards" which would rule out the list you so generously posted
ACMILAN1983
27-10-2006, 07:42
^ the way he's treated? Easy there sparky :D Gila won't ever read this forum so I doubt you can hurt his feelings.
Firstly, you are in no position to say whether he knows or reads this forum, or do you know him personally?
Besides, I'm talking about respect, not just his feelings. The lack of respect he gets from posters here is vomit inducing, and I'm ashamed that Milan fans treat their players that way.
why must I show respect to a player who hurts my team? whenever a player is crap we should accept it and try to improve rather than shoot the messenger. Otherwise we'd still have guglimenpietro, Laursen roque Junior and Helveg.
If your Gila is the star of your wet dreams then at least be prepared to take criticism directed towards him without throwing up at the thought of critique.
A real Milan fan would want the team to do well and please the other fans. Tell me Mr Moderator is Gila doing this? At least Ollie excites the fans with his runs and Pippo works his butt off what does Gila do?
why must I show respect to a player who hurts my team? whenever a player is crap we should accept it and try to improve rather than shoot the messenger. Otherwise we'd still have guglimenpietro, Laursen roque Junior and Helveg.
If your Gila is the star of your wet dreams then at least be prepared to take criticism directed towards him without throwing up at the thought of critique.
A real Milan fan would want the team to do well and please the other fans. Tell me Mr Moderator :ban: is Gila doing this? At least Ollie excites the fans with his runs and Pippo pleases us by working his butt off what does Gila do? :p1510:
sorry about the double post :D
ACMILAN1983
27-10-2006, 10:54
why must I show respect to a player who hurts my team? whenever a player is crap we should accept it and try to improve rather than shoot the messenger. Otherwise we'd still have guglimenpietro, Laursen roque Junior and Helveg.
If your Gila is the star of your wet dreams then at least be prepared to take criticism directed towards him without throwing up at the thought of critique.
A real Milan fan would want the team to do well and please the other fans. Tell me Mr Moderator is Gila doing this? At least Ollie excites the fans with his runs and Pippo works his butt off what does Gila do?
Gila deserves enough respect because he's the one out there every week trying to provide for this club. He's trying to do well for the club and provides a lot more for it than you can ever claim to do as a fan.
the messenger can say the player isn't playing well, especially if they offer what they feel is constructive criticism. This I see almost none of on these threads. Instead I see immature posts saying Gilardino is to blame for every problem Milan is having and how he deserves to be left for the vultures.
Also, of the players that have ever played for Milan, every single one including those you listed deserves this basic respect I'm talking about, because each one gave what they could to Milan, even if they weren't always Milan standard.
I'm not blind, I know how Gila is performing and I'm not pleased. Just because the attitude posters like you show towards him make me sick, doesn't mean I think he's playing well.
lol, your concept of what a "real" Milan fan is makes me glad that I'm not this type of fan, I'm much happier being a non "real" fan who doesn't rain abuse on one of the players because he's struggling, all with the excuse of "I want to improve the team".
If you want to know what I think Gila does, re-read my longer post, as I quite clearly stated what he does in there.
Finally, don't call me Mr Moderator, I'm just a normal poster unless I have to moderate.
In fact, I also want to add that it's not even necessarily about football, my biggest problem is you don't even treat Gila with common courtesy, that everyone should get.
Liput_lo
27-10-2006, 10:57
Bravo Jim! Three words and much depth to it. It says a lot about you and deserves commendation.
For those who want to claim being "anti Gila"... for what reason do you want this? I wasnt too thrilled when we bought him but since then I will be pro-Alberto Gilardino as long as he wears the Red and Black. He will score for us and perhaps at a time when we desperately need it. I have the faith in our club to bring him full circle. You nattering nabobs of negativism need to stop these useless and vitriolic attacks on anyone of our players... staff included.
The life cycle of Milan through the good times and bad, succeses and adversity is not a product! It is a LIVING PROCESS that is not a RIGHT but a PRIVILEDGE which us fans need to come to appreciate.
Good job TEAM MILAN! I know more is to come.
FORZA MILAN!
He means Gilardino is amazing with all of the miss ....
hehehehehe .....
btw, FORZA MILAN
why must I show respect to a player who hurts my team? whenever a player is crap we should accept it and try to improve rather than shoot the messenger. Otherwise we'd still have guglimenpietro, Laursen roque Junior and Helveg.If your Gila is the star of your wet dreams then at least be prepared to take criticism directed towards him without throwing up at the thought of critique.
A real Milan fan would want the team to do well and please the other fans. Tell me Mr Moderator is Gila doing this? At least Ollie excites the fans with his runs and Pippo works his butt off what does Gila do?
I guess we should thank you personally for Guly, Laursen, Helveg, R Jr leaving right?
A real Milan Fan is fan despite the teams place or standing. I think this club has earned that right after so much accomplishments. There's no condition to one day being a "FAN" and all of a sudden not being a fan on the basis of such condition.
The point is friend, that we will support Gila for the fact that he is a MILAN player. I dont know why anyone wouldnt support Gila. Not supporting him is not supporting the team. I would hope the players dont take the position you do. Can you just imagine if Pirlo or Maldini says the cr@p you're saying? Really... they're a bit more commited than a "fan" so your "real fan would want" little statement just doesnt hold up to an what an actual "real player" would want. I'm pretty sure they dont say Gila sucks now do they?
Oh so I'm a plastic fan 'cause I want Gila gone? Great! Why don't we just accept/ tolerate everyone here? When Vieri who was utter rubbish for us was here, were you defending him this way?
Its absolute rubbish that players deserve our respect vsimply because they workm hard for their team.....it's their job!!! would you respect a doctor who performs poorly on you simply because "he tried hard"???
And no Kui I didn't personally boot out the aforementioned but other people concerned with the club's welfare did.
Oh so I'm a plastic fan 'cause I want Gila gone? Great! Why don't we just accept/ tolerate everyone here? When Vieri who was utter rubbish for us was here, were you defending him this way?
No in one sense. unlike Gila, because he didn't have any credible record with Milan
yes in another way: some people here did defend him, and heis not getting as much criticism anyway.
Perhaps the greatest argument against anti-Gila group is that it is yet to be explained how other Milan strikers are also experiencing poor form lately.
This, unfortuntely, has never been directly addressed, although a few mentioned that "Inzaghi scored for Milan before" and "We should give Oliveria more time"
Although this argument may itself stand alone, the fact that their poor form coincides with Gila's goal drought (and Milan's goal drought) seems to weaken this argument, as both Inzaghi and Oliveria have not really contributed to the team except for the game against Lazio, the first game of Serie A.
Hereby until further evidence is presented, I doubt if anti-Gila group argument will stand. This, of course, does not mean that Gila is performing well. He is performing poorly, but so does the rest.
Look my comrades. Let's bury this nonesense! I think Gila is crap and doesn't deserve to start. I hope he gets better and scores a boatload and makes me look like a raving madman /moron.
I cheer on Milan just as much as nay other real fan and I don't care if we get relegated to serieC. Forza Milan and all of its fans! both the pro-Gila the anti-Gila and the undecided! :D I want to save enough money to come to Milan and see a Milan match at the San Siro!
I think Gila is crap and doesn't deserve to start.
Ok............... if that's your argument, I should respectfully accept it, although I don't see in any way different from saying, I think ____________ (fill in the blank) is crap and doesn't deserve to start.
zlatanov
27-10-2006, 13:49
I really don't see any point in this discussion going on since after 10 or so pages on Gila we haven't moved a bit from the starting line. The best part of it all is that there wasn't any namecalling in here ... and maybe to keep it this way, it would be best for this thread to be closed and let peacefully go down in the archives ...
rahul.acm
27-10-2006, 14:44
.........
If your Gila is the star of your wet dreams then ....
:haha:
I really never thought that one day I will become a wannabe but this statement I quoted above is really over the top. Gila is no Paris Hilton to come in my dreams. Everybody has a different and a special place.
------------------------------------------
I really don't see any point in this discussion going on since after 10 or so pages on Gila we haven't moved a bit from the starting line. The best part of it all is that there wasn't any namecalling in here ... and maybe to keep it this way, it would be best for this thread to be closed and let peacefully go down in the archives ...
Never mind, there are loads of places where Gila can be slaughtered but I guess it would be better because points from the plaintiffs and defendants have been placed repeatedly and there is nothing new to talk about Gila and his form.
I don't think my literacy skills are in question here drucurl, it's your ability to understand what i've written that's at fault. Go back and re-read all the posts made and you'll see that it's either your interpretation skills or your eyesight that's gone wrong. I don't know if you're reading what i've put and then understood it as something completely different or if you're just seeing things that aren't there.
Another thing, you don't know me so don't call me conceited.
ACMILAN1983
27-10-2006, 16:44
Oh so I'm a plastic fan 'cause I want Gila gone? Great! Why don't we just accept/ tolerate everyone here? When Vieri who was utter rubbish for us was here, were you defending him this way?
Its absolute rubbish that players deserve our respect vsimply because they workm hard for their team.....it's their job!!! would you respect a doctor who performs poorly on you simply because "he tried hard"???
And no Kui I didn't personally boot out the aforementioned but other people concerned with the club's welfare did.
Did I call you a plastic fan?
When Vieri was here, yes I did support him all the way, even though his performances weren't any good.
Players deserve respect as much as any human does. It's their job but if they unintentionally make mistakes, they don't deserve wave after wave of abuse.
As for your doctor analogy, firstly they have a greater degree of control in their profession, which means I expect greater and more consistent degrees of success. However, if a doctor does mess up and something really bad happends, of course I won't be happy, but I'd understand that the doctor didn't intentionally do what he did, and so I wouldn't abuse him either.
The same concept with Gila. I'm not happy with his performances, everyone knows he hasn't played up to standard, BUT I know he can't always perform at his peak, so I'm not going to abuse him for playing poorly.
What about this concept is so difficult to understand? I respect them enough to not abuse them (which is what you do), even though I'm not pleased with their performances (which I have stated numerous times)!
Egoistka
27-10-2006, 21:03
I was talking about the Chievo match, where Borriello had just as good chances as Gila and missed, yet there were no real complaints (just a few laughs) over that. My point is every player in the squad has a role to perform and they are expected to do the job when called on. Currently, NONE of our forwards are doing their job, but only Gila is getting complaints. Blaming the individual when clearly there are deeper issues is just pointless.
How can you compare 2 players performance in the same match, nmot considering differences in their form? Boriello and Oliveira dont really get a chance to play...and Gila is playing every game.
This argument is just plain stupid. Firstly, he statiscally counted up for having 10 assists all of last season (like I've mentioned, this probably includes penalties won). Of course, in the situations where he did win freekicks or penalties, you'll probably argue back he shouldn't have been getting fouled and should've scored anyway :rolleyes: . He's very good at holding up the ball and waiting for midfield support. He makes fairly intelligent runs and drops deep very well when required.
Oh, you mean those assists, where he fallen down dramatically from a small push or a little touch of the defenders? Then its called simulation. Yes Gila is very good at simulation.
Also, the pressure he is under is very real, because his form has been blown out of proportion and everyone seems to act like he's the sole reason for our stagnant attack.
Everyone is at pressure in professional football - cannot take a pressure dont play professional football.
lol, yes, I believe you when you see that good scoring records in 3 successive seasons is based purely on luck. When he was at Verona he was VERY young and just barely breaking through and his first season at Parma wasn't a key player.
Yes? And now he is probably not scoring because he is too young. 6 months no scoring period - is a disaster. Talented players can have their down periods, but not for so long without scoring even one goal.
Oh yes, clearly Gilardino is a waste of our time because everyone knows that decent strikers won't have times when they're struggling. If we followed your logic, Inzaghi and Sheva would have been sold off long ago. :rolleyes:
Sheva have never had 6 months without a goal (injuries time is not counted), same as Inzaghi. Dont forget please that Gila is in the starting line up and 100 percent fit.
Notice that Gila's form dropped as Inzaghi was returning and Sheva's form had dropped. He isn't a player who is capable of doing huge things on his own (like Sheva and Kaka), he's a goalscorer who needs to be supplied opportunities and needs others to help him open up defences (like Pippo and Crespo).
As I said stop blaming Kaka and other players for Gila not scoring the goals. He is pretty well supplied by Kaka and other players. As I earlie said, the last thing to help Gila to score, that Kaka may do - is just push Gila with the ball to the net. All the rest have been tried and failed. Last season Gila was pretty good supplied, for example by Sheva...still he had his ) - goal period.
Quite frankly your arguments suggests of you having a greater personal issue with Gila than him really performing as badly as you say. Half of the arguments you present are a completely joke (lucky to score 20+ goals in 2 successive seasons :haha: ) and those where you possibly have a valid point are so heavily dramatised and subjectively masked with a clear disliking of the player that you ruin your own argument.
All my arguements are fact based, or common-sense based. He is not scoring and I dont want him in Milan, because Milan despirately needs goals now. Ecpessially after the judges decision not to give any more points back to Milan. There is nothing personal...
20+ goals an artistic type person can score..Same as there an example of a singer, who produces one great song..and after that trying to do smth like that again and just cannot. Same is with Gila...he had a lucky season, being probably emotionally up. But there is at all no guarantee that he ll ever repeat that record again. And I really do not see any talent in him...he is as bad as I say. He doesnt help the team at all. Most of the time, being a ghost (this even commentators and newspapers say). So not only he doesnt score, he doesnt help at all.
I agree with Zlat, this discussion is going nowhere. There is one thing I have learnt, which is that don't try to change another person. For example, if they don't respect others, that's their own problem, there is nothing you can do about it.
Having said that, I suppose most members do support Milan. As long as we don't have another KingHenry or whatever his name was, I am happy enough. I support Gilardino with all my heart, and will patiently wait for his first goal, hopefully tomorrow.
I agree Xudong that you can't change people's views, but i think the story here is that some of the arguments against Gilardino are so poor that they are laughable!
Argument 1: Gilardino must be poor because he's gone 6 months without scoring for Milan.
Utter rubbish. This 6 months includes the summer and the world cup! People (sorry Egoistka but you're one of them) are using this figure of 6 months to make it seem more dramatic. How many league games has he failed to score in? I'll tell you how many 11 !!!!! Yes, that really is a 6 month dry spell isn't it! :rollani:
He hasn't scored in the league since April 22nd (i think that's the date) when we played Messina and won 3-1. There were 3 league games left of that season and we've played 8 so far this season. Somehow that doesn't equal 6 months. So i think that is that argument against Gilardino well and truly quashed as i'm sure many of our strikers in the past have gone a similar length without scoring! If not, then lets not forget that there was a world cup in the middle and a break for the new season, both of which can cause some rustiness to some players when returning. Not an excuse, just a factor to consider.
Argument 2: Gilardino is in the starting line up more often than the others so he must be blamed more.
You can't factor in Oliveira & Boriello in the last 3 league games of last season where he failed to score for us as obviously neither of those 2 players were with us. So lets move to the current 8 league games we've played. We have 4 strikers, Inzaghi, Oliveira, Gilardino & Boriello. I think it's clear that Ancelotti doesn't have faith in Boriello otherwise he'd have surely had more playing time this season. Why else would you prefer to play Gilardino with his dry spell and leave Boriello on the bench or sometimes not even in the squad?
Next we turn to Oliveira. Alot was made of his injury when he came to us, he even said himself it would take him a while to be totally fit, which therefore surely ruled him out of starting alot of games as he wasn't ready. So if he's not fit enough to command a starting position, that leaves 2 other strikers, one of which is Gilardino! So i think it's obvious he would have started more games as the alternatives we had we're quite poor!
20+ goals an artistic type person can score ... But there is at all no guarantee that he ll ever repeat that record again.
You keep mentioning that he was lucky to score over 20 goals in a season, but then he done it a second time and then almost managed it a third time!! So he did repeat the first record, twice! (give or take a goal). If it's purely down to luck though, he must be the luckiest guy around (in which case i should have asked him to pick some lottery numbers for me!) or maybe, just maybe he's a bit better than you can bare to give him credit for.
ACMILAN1983
28-10-2006, 05:15
How can you compare 2 players performance in the same match, nmot considering differences in their form? Boriello and Oliveira dont really get a chance to play...and Gila is playing every game.
Oh, you mean those assists, where he fallen down dramatically from a small push or a little touch of the defenders? Then its called simulation. Yes Gila is very good at simulation.
Everyone is at pressure in professional football - cannot take a pressure dont play professional football.
Yes? And now he is probably not scoring because he is too young. 6 months no scoring period - is a disaster. Talented players can have their down periods, but not for so long without scoring even one goal.
Sheva have never had 6 months without a goal (injuries time is not counted), same as Inzaghi. Dont forget please that Gila is in the starting line up and 100 percent fit.
As I said stop blaming Kaka and other players for Gila not scoring the goals. He is pretty well supplied by Kaka and other players. As I earlie said, the last thing to help Gila to score, that Kaka may do - is just push Gila with the ball to the net. All the rest have been tried and failed. Last season Gila was pretty good supplied, for example by Sheva...still he had his ) - goal period.
All my arguements are fact based, or common-sense based. He is not scoring and I dont want him in Milan, because Milan despirately needs goals now. Ecpessially after the judges decision not to give any more points back to Milan. There is nothing personal...
20+ goals an artistic type person can score..Same as there an example of a singer, who produces one great song..and after that trying to do smth like that again and just cannot. Same is with Gila...he had a lucky season, being probably emotionally up. But there is at all no guarantee that he ll ever repeat that record again. And I really do not see any talent in him...he is as bad as I say. He doesnt help the team at all. Most of the time, being a ghost (this even commentators and newspapers say). So not only he doesnt score, he doesnt help at all.
I'll be honest, I didn't read your post, don't intend to and am not actually going to reply to whatever you said, because I'm wasting my time here.
Perhaps the greatest argument against anti-Gila group is that it is yet to be explained how other Milan strikers are also experiencing poor form lately.
Can only agree with those who say that this argument is carrying us nowhere. After all, no critics has yet to answer my previously posted question, which I now quote.
I'll be honest, I didn't read your post, don't intend to and am not actually going to reply to whatever you said, because I'm wasting my time here.
Thats the only way. Some people here are posting anti Gila posts here like they think hes going to be sold magically after posting on MM.
Egoistka
29-10-2006, 16:02
So as I am not going to reply or give any more stats - it doesnt make any sense. You guys are blind...But trhat is your choice - you want to believe in him - do so.
So as I am not going to reply or give any more stats - it doesnt make any sense. You guys are blind...But trhat is your choice - you want to believe in him - do so.
BLIND??? :wallbang: :wallbang: :wallbang:
Egoistka
30-10-2006, 15:47
BLIND??? :wallbang: :wallbang: :wallbang:
Of course you are blind...You dont want to see that he doesnt do any progress in Milan (for me it doesnt matter what he did in Parma, as long as he doesnt show any good results in Milan. I am not Parma supporter, I m Milan supporter). You, guys, say that as long as he wears red&black t-shirt you are going to believe in him, and support him, no matter what he does. So its pointless to discuss smth in here if you are going to support him in whatever he does, no matter what....
Of course you are blind... You, guys, say that as long as he wears red&black t-shirt you are going to believe in him, and support him, no matter what he does. So its pointless to discuss smth in here if you are going to support him in whatever he does, no matter what....
that's why I say i'm blind and i agree with you. Hurray! You score a point!
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