@Siregar What best clubs in Europe. Spurs lost to Dinamo and are 7th in league, Arsenal 9th. Juventus lost to Porto, still fighting for top 4. How can a closed format competition bring quality. The small cubs already have extremely hard path to get into CL, so they got there deservedly. Isn't it bad enough that these clowns have enormous budgets, now they want a league they can't be relegated from. If you want to watch circus and have everything nice and sparkly, go ahead, watch circus, but don't push that agenda to football. It's been raped by greedy idiots more than enough, let's try to keep some dignity by stopping this.
Jovola, My post was related to what you wrote, but it wasn't a post "at" you. I agree with you guys. 100%. I hate this idea. I think it's bullshit.
But we, the fans, have a right to that. What I'm more annoyed is the bullshit from people like UEFA, the individual leagues, FIFA, Bayern, PSG, and the like of Neville, etc....they are the ones that piss me off. For years they've all benefited from the bullshit in football. They destroyed smaller leagues and smaller clubs and kept lining their pockets. And now they wanna talk shit. It just pisses me off. Where were they all this time? Why were they not fighting the good fight until now? Because they were comfortable. It worked for them. Now that their own existence is threatened, they decide to speak up.
I guess better late then never.
Again, to be clear...I hope this doesn't happen.
Exactly that. What is criteria for "the best"? Cause some of "founding fathers" of this competition are not amongst best for decades. And now ,how ironic for "the claim" ,they will get chance to play against best not by "hard work and extreme fight on the field" but because they're "known"? OM ,Ajax, Porto ,Celtic, Benfica ,Zvezda ,Steaua... They all won EC(CL) ,some of them multiple times... Aresenal ,City, Tottenham... NOT... What is even criteria to be "known"? To be rich? To be "trendy" in last decade or two?! City was kicking bucket for leveling goal difference few years ago...
and yes ,FIFA and UEFA made this. They developed and nurtured "spoiled child" and now they're angry cause that child grew up and decided to kick out mommy and daddy from sharing loot...
(04-19-2021, 11:41 AM)nefremo Wrote: [ -> ]Disclaimer: I am against this. 
BUT...we can not act as if the current system is a gift from god. The fact that everyone is going crazy right now, and that European Football as we know it is on the brink of collapse...says it all about the current system. We are talking about 12 clubs completely destroying that system. Just listen to how ridiculous that sounds. 12 clubs.
So if I'm not clear...let me elaborate......
The current system, the current "great system"...has created an environment where 12 out of the 1000s clubs in Europe, can decide to destroy it.
So then...is it that great? Did it do its job in preserving competition, and the pyramid, etc, etc? Barcelona and Real have been robbing La Liga blind for years now. For years they took in 90% of the income there and nobody cared. People looked at these clubs like icons. Gary Neville was all happy when United paid 100mil for Pogba and 25mil of that went to Raiola. But now he talks shit??? City have spent billions, but nobody cared. Nobody wanted to speak up then. Because guess what..their billions and the exposure of that money, brought success to the PL...and even MORE money. PSG paying 220mil for Neymar. But oh no...now they are all holy and they "stand with UEFA". Bayern monopolizing the German League by taking everyone else's players way below market value by signing players years in advance when they legally can. But no...now they are all holy.
So spare me the bullshit of how the current system is some kind of holy grail. The system died in the 90s. When everyone, EVERYONE, gave in to the greed. We used to see Milan with 7 Italians and 3 foreigners. Of the 7, many came from the academy. We used to see Steaua Bucurest in European Cup finals. We witnessed Red Star belgrade win a European Cup. Because the competition was level.
They (everyone, EVERYONE, not just the big clubs) destroyed THAT football. It's been destroyed for years now. Yet nobody complained because it benefited them one way or another, and they could line their pockets. Not that even that's being threatened, NOW everyone wants to start a revolution.
Like Norwegian national team coach Ståle Solbakken said it today:
"Well done, for making even UEFA and FIFA look like Mother Teresa."
(04-19-2021, 12:46 PM)Jovola Wrote: [ -> ]@Siregar What best clubs in Europe. Spurs lost to Dinamo and are 7th in league, Arsenal 9th. Juventus lost to Porto, still fighting for top 4. How can a closed format competition bring quality. The small cubs already have extremely hard path to get into CL, so they got there deservedly. Isn't it bad enough that these clowns have enormous budgets, now they want a league they can't be relegated from. If you want to watch circus and have everything nice and sparkly, go ahead, watch circus, but don't push that agenda to football. It's been raped by greedy idiots more than enough, let's try to keep some dignity by stopping this.
I won't support opinion only from 1-2 games, it's absolutely absurd. Based quality only from one season could mislead.
Budget is out of topic since all clubs have opportunity to use money. The problem is if they have money or not.
(04-19-2021, 12:58 PM)Sampinjon Wrote: [ -> ]Exactly that. What is criteria for "the best"? Cause some of "founding fathers" of this competition are not amongst best for decades. And now ,how ironic for "the claim" ,they will get chance to play against best not by "hard work and extreme fight on the field" but because they're "known"? OM ,Ajax, Porto ,Celtic, Benfica ,Zvezda ,Steaua... They all won EC(CL) ,some of them multiple times... Aresenal ,City, Tottenham... NOT... What is even criteria to be "known"? To be rich? To be "trendy" in last decade or two?! City was kicking bucket for leveling goal difference few years ago...
and yes ,FIFA and UEFA made this. They developed and nurtured "spoiled child" and now they're angry cause that child grew up and decided to kick out mommy and daddy from sharing loot...
Consistency and reputation.
The ESL is all over the financial news outlets. Many discussions about the impact on the financial market. They said that clubs have signed a binding contract and JP Morgan is underwriting the effort. This is getting big.
@Siregar So we can use historical success of these clubs. Things would get even worse for eight of those, so what kind of criteria are you talking about. And why exactly is budget out of topic, is it non relevant factor in your opinion. How a team plays on a season, decides on if it will play a European competition, be relegated, or become a champion, but you consider this unimportant. What kind of logic are you using, I am really interested to hear your concept now.
(04-19-2021, 01:43 PM)Siregar Wrote: [ -> ]Consistency and reputation.
Than at least half of clubs I mentioned should be part of this superleague instead of some teams which are currently there...
(04-19-2021, 01:54 PM)Jovola Wrote: [ -> ] What kind of logic are you using, I am really interested to hear your concept now.
there is no logic in his claims. Just spin. I'm hoping ,for his sake ,that he's just trolling. Badly...
He's claiming how "unknown clubs" (unknown to who?) don't deserve to play against "best" ,despite them going through bunch of ridiculous qualification games and what not to earn that "privilege". Now he wants to kick them out and instead of them to throw in teams which for decade or so could not earn that "privilege" on the field. Cause they're ,I guess ,"known" (again ,known to who?).
I mean ,it's his legit right to want or not want this competition ,just please don't speak about who "deserve" to play against "best"... It's... well... don't want to risk legal actions from administration...