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Ufficiale, Beckham al Milan
Galliani conferma: "Viene per 4 mesi"
L'affare Beckham-Milan si può fare e ha tutta l'aria di andare davvero in porto. Ad annunciarlo al Corriere della Sera, confermando di fatto una indiscrezione di Sportmediaset, ci ha pensato direttamente Adriano Galliani, che non ha lasciato molto spazio a eventuali dubbi sulla serietà dell'operazione: "Beckham vuole allenarsi e giocare con il Milan, verrà 4 mesi in prestito", ha detto l'ad rossonero. Non resta dunque che aspettare gennaio.
Già, perché, a quanto pare, si tratta di una semplice questione di tempo. Di aspettare cioè la riapertura del mercato e mettersi comodi per accogliere nel migliore dei modi il più mediatico dei giocatori in circolazione. Che l'affare sia anche, se non soprattutto, una questione di immagine è infatti abbastanza chiaro. Beckham, inutile dirlo, porta sponsor, attenzione internazionale e, di conseguenza, soldi. Un dettaglio, quest'ultimo, che in via Turati non si trascura minimamente: "Il calcio di oggi - precisa giustamente Galliani - non è soltanto tecnica e tattica. E' anche stadi pieni, audience e sponsor. Nessuno può vantare i 65mila spettatori che abbiamo avuto noi domenica. Gli stadi si riempiono solo con le star mondiali e Beckham ha chiesto ospitalità al Milan e non a un altro club". Come dire, insomma, che lo Spice Boy sarà il benvenuto che dia il suo contributo sul campo o, semplicemente, contribuisca a far fieno nelle casse rossonere.
Sta di fatto che da qui a gennaio il Milan, Becks e i Los Angeles Galaxy, la squadra dove l'ala inglese gioca attualmente, si parleranno eccome. Si siederanno attorno a un tavolo e valuteranno con attenzione le convenienze reciproche dell'affare. Galliani ha chiesto e ottenuto il prestito gratuito per quattro mesi: da gennaio a fine aprile, quando riprenderà il campionato statunitense e l'esterno inglese tornare ai Galaxy. Quattro mesetti buoni per qualche apparizione a strisce rosso e nere e per godersi lo spettacolo di un attacco sempre e comunque da prima pagina con Dinho, Kakà e, appunto, Beckham. "Con loro tre insieme, anche per pochi mesi - spiega Galliani - potrebbe essere un Milan stellare". E ancora, attraverso il sito ufficiale della società: "Arriverà? Sì, credo proprio di sì. Resterà qui al Milan in prestito per qualche mese - dice l'ad rossonero - ne stiamo parlando con il suo agente. Lo tessereremo per qualche mese e poi ripartirà. Beckham ha scelto il Milan. La nostra squadra è ultracompetitiva e resterà così com'è, ma Beckham è qualcosa di diverso e di intrigante. Il Milan non fa la raccolta delle figurine, il Milan è invece molto orgoglioso della politica che sta facendo. Siamo l'unico club in controtendenza: la gente va allo stadio a vedere il Milan. Non è un caso se 65mila persone vanno a vedere Milan-Sampdoria. Se vanno allo stadio vuol dire che il Milan è un prodotto che piace"..
ANCELOTTI LO PORTA GIA' IN UEFA
Da Galliani ad Ancelotti anche perché, alla fine della fiera, sarà lui a doversi prendere cura dello Spyce Boy: "Per me sarà un piacere - chiarisce il tecnico rossonero - Beckham è un atleta serio, un grande professionista. Se sarà disponibile per quattro mesi con noi ne saremo molto contenti. Se diventerà disponibile per il Milan, lo sarà evidentemente sia in Italia che in Europa".
22 ottobre 2008
Beckham in Milan...and now he have the oldest squad that has EVER played calcio!! At least we wiull earn money and Silvio can say thank you to Cappello for making money for him by making Beckham move to Milan.
On the other note, we will have a man who can cross from corners as Pirlo cant!! :)
Where can Beckham play? I hope in the middle, but I wouldnt be surprised if we see Sergio II on the right wing. after wingers turn 35, they tunr into fullbacks in Milan...
Seriousely, the best role for him in today's Seedorf role. But I dont expect him to play a lot. In rotation maybe, like Sheva. For Beckham is important to train in Milanello and be on the list for WC 2010 and Cappello.
And then, THEMOST IMPORTANT THING; is that we bring back YOan Gourcuff in the summer and LET GO BECKHAM!!!!
Warro Bantan
22-10-2008, 06:40
Wow! And before anyone gets to thinking that I am all happy and excited: that "Wow!" Is one of amazement.
I am well and truly amazed at this move, which I guess has more to do with "brand Beckham" and filling the San Siro, than anything else....despite Uncle Fester's protestations to the contrary.
The good things about this move for me, are that:
a) We will pack in more fans, and their families, to see Becks
b) We will sell some more shirts
c) We may have a traditional "winger" for the first time since Guglielmienpietro....
d) Carlo now has more of a choice for his starting 11 (though I hardly see Becks doing more than coming off the bench)
e) someone has arrived that can teach our players (wing-backs especially) how to cross the ball into the box and...
f) $heva, Boriello/Ambro can get some quality service in the air from other than R80, Kaka and Seedorf (with Pirlo being out injured of course)
There are plenty of negatives...but I will leave those for others to post...its too early in the morning in JA for me to be pessimistic...as the Great Bob Marley said:
"Sun is shinin, the weather is sweet....makes u wanna move, your dancing feet"
Warro Bantan
22-10-2008, 06:45
I left the best part of his move out of my post above:
g) Its not permanent! :D
Im just waiting for the sunday afternoon, 15:00h, San Siro. Milan starts with lineup:
---------------Dida-----------
-Beckham-Nesta-Maldini-Zambrotta-
---------------Pirlo----------
------Gattuso-----Seedorf-------
---------Kaka'---Ronaldinho----
-------------Shevchenko-----
And plays 1:1 with atalanta... And then I will die from heartattack!
Hasan Rossonero
22-10-2008, 06:50
What a disgusting shambles we have become, hiring a slow, aging David Beckham to fill our stadium. We have become everything Real were, but unfortunately we get to players 5 years past their sell by date.
Let's applaud our management who would rather address our commercial success before our creaking defence. I cannot believe you all are not up in arms. I don't care whether Beckham plays a minute or all games, this move stinks to high heavens of a very strange Milan attitude. Is that we have become? Do we have to be the ones to revive the career of all fading stars?
Finally Warro, Fester has admitted this is a marketing move, and unabashedly so.
Milan: give us your old, satiated and forgotten stars.
Anyway, welcome David Beckham. Welcome to the San Siro.
Beckham is the ONLY player Milan bought for marketing. Dinho is something different, he is capable of playing top football. And Ronaldo is IL FENOMENO, Always will be.
But this is ridiculous, Milan should be filling the stadium by having a team that plays great football and is winning the scudetto and making the fans coming to the stands!!
But this is a free move that will make us money, and in the summer Milan will spend in sure. Its not possible to buy top class denenders in january. We need to be real.
ACMILAN1983
22-10-2008, 06:56
despite Uncle Fester's protestations to the contrary.
Far from it Warro, Galliani has come outright and said Beckham's a marketing move as football is now more than just about tactics and technical skills.
I'm not sure what to think about this move. I heard about it over the past couple of weeks and thought it was just headlines for papers. From a marketing perspective, it's a brilliant move as Beckham's probably the most marketable player ever.
On the other hand, it feels low to buy (or loan) players like this just for marketing, and takes away from the value of football. Tactically, it's tough to work out how Beckham will fit, and I can really only see him playing a bit part role (if he plays one at all), as Pirlo's understudy in midfield, or as a wide option like Ancelotti tried with Dinho a couple of times.
I'm not really sure if I'm pleased or upset with this transfer, I'm simply in shock. Welcome to Beckham I guess.
Lebanese
22-10-2008, 07:04
guys chill out beckham is not this bad, he is old true but not bad, better than brocchi. after all its about adidas, have you guys forgot that adidas marketing department is the one responsible for our image and marketing. its not like what it seems. do you guys imagine the overheads we pay. We are in red. and thats not good Bechkam move is a business term and trust me he can be useful, at least his image. milan aint this stupid he wants to keep his fitness and we want some money thats the deal.
i agree with you with what you said buddy, just watching machester vs roma. i wanted him so bad in my team i wanted someone who would remind me of our beloved kala.
thats what i meant,youre here just to prove my point..im sure that was one of 3 or 4 football matches that you have ever watched in your life..
dude your point is toooootally ridiculous honestly..
i think that galliani,braida etc know better than both of us which is the best solution,and although mexes would cost us more he is our first option..
im really glad some of you are not managing this team..
What a disgusting shambles we have become, hiring a slow, aging David Beckham to fill our stadium. We have become everything Real were, but unfortunately we get to players 5 years past their sell by date.
Let's applaud our management who would rather address our commercial success before our creaking defence. I cannot believe you all are not up in arms. I don't care whether Beckham plays a minute or all games, this move stinks to high heavens of a very strange Milan attitude. Is that we have become? Do we have to be the ones to revive the career of all fading stars?
Finally Warro, Fester has admitted this is a marketing move, and unabashedly so.
Milan: give us your old, satiated and forgotten stars.
Anyway, welcome David Beckham. Welcome to the San Siro.
tottally agree mate,you saved me some time there..
guys chill out beckham is not this bad, he is old true but not bad, better than brocchi. after all its about adidas, have you guys forgot that adidas marketing department is the one responsible for our image and marketing. its not like what it seems. do you guys imagine the overheads we pay. We are in red. and thats not good Bechkam move is a business term and trust me he can be useful, at least his image. milan aint this stupid he wants to keep his fitness and we want some money thats the deal.
old but not bad (really!?!)
better than brocchi (that's true:w212:)
for the rest of your post i totally agree
Peachtot
22-10-2008, 07:55
when i was around 14 y.o i got a present beckham's jersey & short
now i will buy another beckham shirt by my own :D
Im just waiting for the sunday afternoon, 15:00h, San Siro. Milan starts with lineup:
---------------Dida-----------
-Beckham-Nesta-Maldini-Zambrotta-
---------------Pirlo----------
------Gattuso-----Seedorf-------
---------Kaka'---Ronaldinho----
-------------Shevchenko-----
And plays 1:1 with atalanta... And then I will die from heartattack!
The game will be played in Bergamo, not Milano.
kakacmilan best
22-10-2008, 11:31
What about Emiliano Viviano for GK I heard he will have a huge potential.
The game will be played in Bergamo, not Milano.
No, this one will be played in Bergamo. And when Beckham arrives it will be played in Milano.
Gabriel489
22-10-2008, 11:37
By getting Beckham, the real Milan is really becoming my Winning Eleven Milan team.
Now all Milan needs to do is trade Seedorf for Ballack, Sheva for Gomez, Kaladze for Santacroce, Emerson for Sammarco, Bonera for Canini, Favalli for Di Silvestri and release Dida, and boom, thats my Winning Eleven Milan team.
I am having mixed feelings about Beckham, as he is really becoming a more all around footballer as he ages but I really think this is a deal for PR, esp of what Galliani said.
Just bring me Santacroce and I will be happy, btw, I just became a father today and I can't wait to watch a Milan game with my baby-boy Graham.
Dutchie-Milan
22-10-2008, 12:11
transfermarketweb and german+turkish media are saying that Milan are preparing a bid in January for the Turkish defender Servet Cetin from Galatasaray...
YEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSS i really really really hope he is coming,he isnt the youngest with his 27 years but he is awsome,he is very big(bigger than Kaladze)he is fast for his size,he never gives up and he has a great header.He has also great marking skills.This is the guy we need,on Euro 2008 he played a hell of a tournament....IF he comes(and i really hope so)then our defence is ultrasolid.
Kaka1899
22-10-2008, 13:53
By getting Beckham, the real Milan is really becoming my Winning Eleven Milan team.
Now all Milan needs to do is trade Seedorf for Ballack, Sheva for Gomez, Kaladze for Santacroce, Emerson for Sammarco, Bonera for Canini, Favalli for Di Silvestri and release Dida, and boom, thats my Winning Eleven Milan team.
I am having mixed feelings about Beckham, as he is really becoming a more all around footballer as he ages but I really think this is a deal for PR, esp of what Galliani said.
Just bring me Santacroce and I will be happy, btw, I just became a father today and I can't wait to watch a Milan game with my baby-boy Graham.
i cant wait to see Beckham play a game for us will be an odd expirience although it does show we have not lost our pulling power for the stars, and from the marketing side well what can we say, Kaka,Dinho and Beckham!
btw
Congratulations i wish your son a healthy and happy Rossonero life, shame he will never witness Maldini :5ok:
HO-YOUNG
22-10-2008, 14:06
BECKHAM TO FULL THE SAN SIRO!!!
Kaka & Dinho: 2 European and World footballers or the year + Many italian World cup winners cant full the San Siro????
I hope the referees will look at Beckham crossing the ball and not notice the off sides...
I hope he doesnt come here with the LA Galaxy LUCK...
let us see what happens wen he gets here....
i think all transfers/loans should be given a chance to perform on the pitch b4 the lambasting, if they suck...flame away. plus if its free... why not?
Hasan Rossonero
22-10-2008, 14:55
By getting Beckham, the real Milan is really becoming my Winning Eleven Milan team.
Now all Milan needs to do is trade Seedorf for Ballack, Sheva for Gomez, Kaladze for Santacroce, Emerson for Sammarco, Bonera for Canini, Favalli for Di Silvestri and release Dida, and boom, thats my Winning Eleven Milan team.
I am having mixed feelings about Beckham, as he is really becoming a more all around footballer as he ages but I really think this is a deal for PR, esp of what Galliani said.
Just bring me Santacroce and I will be happy, btw, I just became a father today and I can't wait to watch a Milan game with my baby-boy Graham.
Congrats! Best wishes.
I don't see why some of the people here are flaming Becks. Didn't Man Utd pull something similar before with Henrik Larson? I mean, give the guy a chance before we flame him down. Just because he's been playing in the states in a below par team doesn't mean he's totally forgotten how to play football :P
hitmannq8
22-10-2008, 19:17
Emiliano Viviano was absolutely great in the Olympics for Italy..I am a big fan of him, and I also heard at a point we were after him. I hope we get him instead of the Brazilian keeper Felipe or something.
... btw, I just became a father today a...
best transfer ever...
congratulation bro!!!
Peachtot
22-10-2008, 20:45
Congrats Gabriel !
May you'll be alot like milan than inter for caring ur son :D
By getting Beckham, the real Milan is really becoming my Winning Eleven Milan team.
Now all Milan needs to do is trade Seedorf for Ballack, Sheva for Gomez, Kaladze for Santacroce, Emerson for Sammarco, Bonera for Canini, Favalli for Di Silvestri and release Dida, and boom, thats my Winning Eleven Milan team.
I am having mixed feelings about Beckham, as he is really becoming a more all around footballer as he ages but I really think this is a deal for PR, esp of what Galliani said.
Just bring me Santacroce and I will be happy, btw, I just became a father today and I can't wait to watch a Milan game with my baby-boy Graham.
Congratulations. safe to say this boy will be singing rossoneri chants before he learns the alphabet.
ACMILAN1983
23-10-2008, 02:12
By getting Beckham, the real Milan is really becoming my Winning Eleven Milan team.
Now all Milan needs to do is trade Seedorf for Ballack, Sheva for Gomez, Kaladze for Santacroce, Emerson for Sammarco, Bonera for Canini, Favalli for Di Silvestri and release Dida, and boom, thats my Winning Eleven Milan team.
I am having mixed feelings about Beckham, as he is really becoming a more all around footballer as he ages but I really think this is a deal for PR, esp of what Galliani said.
Just bring me Santacroce and I will be happy, btw, I just became a father today and I can't wait to watch a Milan game with my baby-boy Graham.
Congratulations, that's really great to hear. :)
How many midfielders are we going to have?
20?
It's just insane... Pirlo, Gatusso, Ambro, Flamini, Cardisso, Emerson, Ronnie, Seedorf, Kaka and now Becks!
That's 10, not sure if I missed anyone else...
I just don't get it...
transfermarketweb and german+turkish media are saying that Milan are preparing a bid in January for the Turkish defender Servet Cetin from Galatasaray...
YEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSS i really really really hope he is coming,he isnt the youngest with his 27 years but he is awsome,he is very big(bigger than Kaladze)he is fast for his size,he never gives up and he has a great header.He has also great marking skills.This is the guy we need,on Euro 2008 he played a hell of a tournament....IF he comes(and i really hope so)then our defence is ultrasolid.
Not another Umit, no Dutchie???
Warro Bantan
23-10-2008, 06:55
Congrats Gabriel on the birth of ur son...FORZA Graham!!!...the youngest Milanista!!
Congrats Gabriel!!! You know what the first gift is you need to spend on- Maldini's shirt :)
Interisti ( Morratti, toldo ) are making fun of Beckham's signing, while Cappello and Sacchi are the ones who convinced Galliani that Becks still plays good football and can be usefull.
Milan will earn around 13mln euro for 4 months of Beckham. 13mln+15 of Yoan+some of Silvio and we have Fabregas who said he has an important opffer from Italy :)
come on mkri why fabregas?as much as we like him you know we need that money for a wc defender first..:cheers:
How many midfielders are we going to have?
20?
It's just insane... Pirlo, Gatusso, Ambro, Flamini, Cardisso, Emerson, Ronnie, Seedorf, Kaka and now Becks!
That's 10, not sure if I missed anyone else...
I just don't get it...
Well you have to understand that in Galliani's world Ronaldinho, Kaká and Seedorf, and sometimes even Ambrosini (!), are strikers...:pp20:
So...no problem, right?
Gabriel489
23-10-2008, 10:43
Thanks bros for all the wishes, I actually can't wait to put the little Milan kit on him.
As for Beckham, well, even if Beckham can be good for 4 months or a year, it is still a good gamble for Milan as believe it or not, the marketing opp are just too great.
Lebanese
23-10-2008, 11:01
the opportunity is not in shirt sale or attendance. its about something bigger. milan were able to pull a sold out stadium when they were in serie B. so we got fans. this move is about a global thing after all adidas is now our marketing department and i wont be surprised about this move. after all its a marketing move nothing more. this guy needs to train and we are willing to get money out of any opportunity so why not
Congrats Gab!
I hope we don't sell Gorky if he continues this form.
Maldini+Nesta
23-10-2008, 17:51
Dear lord!
Milan need to get Gourcuff back
and get a CB and LB
RB is fine...I'm a big fan
of Zambrotta.
:3band:
There's one more thing we need now, namely someone to accompany Carletto watching and studying football DVDs. A female is preferred :)
http://www.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=927278
come on mkri why fabregas?as much as we like him you know we need that money for a wc defender first..:cheers:
Cesc is a league or two above most of midfielders in football world now. It's always an advantage to have him in your team. Besides, except Kaka, our other midfielders like Seedorf, Rino, Max, and Pirlo are not young anymore
Beckham can play both rightback and defence midfield. Carlo will make this work out.
looks like Fabregas refused to sign a new deal with Arsenal,
can we do a Flamini here again? :D
This is probably the best central midfielder in the world right now, after Pirlo of course :)
Lebanese
24-10-2008, 04:44
Barça Wants Busquets Deal To Fend Off Interest
Barcelona are locked in talks with Sergio Busquets about a new deal after the youngster's incredible rise to prominence after his elevation to the first team this season.
The 20-year-old has won many plaudits in his first campaign at the highest level and has also attracted a lot of interest from some of Europe's richest clubs.
Busquets' contract is due to expire at the end of the current season and Blaugrana technical secretary Txiki Begiristain is desperate to see him ink a new one.
According to Marca, Barça believe that the playmaker knows of the interest from other major sides, in particular AC Milan, and that he could use that to earn himself a larger deal.
Talks have been ongoing between the Catalan giants and Busquets' agent, José Maria Orobitg, but have yet to produce an outcome after an initial offer was rejected.
While a four-year deal has been agreed in principal, it is the financial side that has caused the sticking point with the player knowing what he is worth and what he could earn elsewhere.
Having not earned many headlines with Barça B, the son of former Blaugrana keper Carles Busquets has caused a surprise with his strong performances in the centre of midfield.
Coach Pep Guardiola knows all about the Sabadell-born starlet from his time in charge of the club's second string and has been instrumental in his rise.
While there is also talk of interest from clubs in England, Sport believe that Busquets has no intention of leaving Barcelona now that he has a regular first-team place.
A repeat of what Cesc Fàbregas did is always the fear at Camp Nou, but he opted to move on without ever competing for a place in the team.
Source Goal.com
looks like Fabregas refused to sign a new deal with Arsenal,
can we do a Flamini here again? :D
This is probably the best central midfielder in the world right now, after Pirlo of course :)
His contract still runs to 2010, doesn't it? Even if Cesc really want's out (which I doubt) and Arsenal will sell this summer (so as to not lose him on a free the year after) he would still by very, VERY expensive, and his favoured destination would surely be Barcelona.
Anyway I don't think he's the best CM in the world now, Iniesta and Xavi are better, so I don't know why Barca want Cesc back (both on account of having better players and how he left them in the first place).
At any rate, midfield is probably the last part of the team we should be enforcing.
ACMILAN1983
24-10-2008, 07:02
Beckham can play both rightback and defence midfield. Carlo will make this work out.
I disagree, I don't think he's really suited for either position. His tactical awareness isn't the best and he isn't suited to run long distances up and down the pitch (needed at RB). He's a hard worker, which benefits the side a lot, but I personally don't think he's suited to either role mentioned.
I'd say he's better suited as a deep lying distributor (but would need to build up tactical discipline for it) or as a wide man who can put in crosses. This is an important element of his game and for Pato and Borriello, who are both strong at heading, it could be very useful.
As for the Fabregas rumours, I'd love to see him in Milan if he's available and would take him without a second thought, but at the same time I don't see it happening that easily. He would be a natural successor to Pirlo (who at 29, probably won't remain at the top for many more years now).
At any rate, midfield is probably the last part of the team we should be enforcing.
not neceseraly. Next year Milan will have Pirlo, Ambrosini, Rino, Seedorf ( over 30 ), Flamini. Kaka' and Dinho are not midfielders.
If we, realistically, see off Emerson and Bourdoux buys Gourcuff, and with money from Beckham ( they say around 15mln ), milan would be able to get Fabregas. And if there is ANY chance for that, we NEED to make it. MAybe even Seedorf's time is over. He is 33(?) and Milan doesnt have a creative CENTRAL midfielder in our team. Only Seedorf can play it, but he cant play it all the time as a CM.
I dont have anything against Milan selling Yoan, Seedorf and Emerson and bringing Fabregas. But that will not happen 99.9%.
Other solution is of course Yoan and investing money in defence. Which is realistically better. But I was just talking about Fabregas as it was the subject. However, Im sure Inter or Barcelona are ready to offer more money then Milan.
kakacmilan best
24-10-2008, 08:45
. However, Im sure Inter or Barcelona are ready to offer more money then Milan.
I don't accept on this!!!
If Berlusconi realy want Fabergas we are the favorites in all the things that belong to money.
But in the end I think he will stay in Arsenal or move to Barca because he is a fan of them.
http://www.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=929433
Baloteli want to leave Inter!
I know that he loves Milan but I dont thunk that Inter will sell him for us.
Fabregas is a dream signing for me but the chances of us spending that kind of money to get Clarence upset are slim to none. Fabregas is perfect for our midfield though. He's like Pirlo except he runs more...and scores/assists more. Can't ask for any more than that :D
Maldini+Nesta
24-10-2008, 12:24
looks like Fabregas refused to sign a new deal with Arsenal,
can we do a Flamini here again? :D
This is probably the best central midfielder in the world right now, after Pirlo of course :)
Fabregas already signed last
year for something like 5
or 10 years?
Originally posted by acmilan1983
I disagree, I don't think he's really suited for either position. His tactical awareness isn't the best and he isn't suited to run long distances up and down the pitch (needed at RB). He's a hard worker, which benefits the side a lot, but I personally don't think he's suited to either role mentioned.
I'd say he's better suited as a deep lying distributor (but would need to build up tactical discipline for it) or as a wide man who can put in crosses. This is an important element of his game and for Pato and Borriello, who are both strong at heading, it could be very useful.
Like you said he is a hard worker, the work ethic will help him compensate his unfamilarity with both positions. he played rightback once for national team in an emergency sitiation,his performance was on the better side of adequate.and I think his tactical awareness is among the top level.
About the deep lying distributeor position, we have two reliable veterans pirlo and seedorf, Beckham's chance is minimal.Maybe rightback position is not so crowded, and we are little bit short of accurate longball crossing from that department.
Snapster
25-10-2008, 03:33
Originally posted by acmilan1983
About the deep lying distributeor position, we have two reliable veterans pirlo and seedorf, Beckham's chance is minimal.Maybe rightback position is not so crowded, and we are little bit short of accurate longball crossing from that department.
If you are going to put someone who cannot defend at a reasonable level week in week out that player better be the best person in the world and getting up and down the pitch and contributing to the attack (ie Cafu in his prime).
Becks is a great crosser of the ball but crossing from deep, eg a right back position requires we have someone up front who has enough strength and/or height to deal with them, of which currently only Borriello could. Becks would be much better suited on the right of midfield or as a sub for Pirlo.
If we, realistically, see off Emerson and Bourdoux buys Gourcuff, and with money from Beckham ( they say around 15mln ), milan would be able to get Fabregas. And if there is ANY chance for that, we NEED to make it.
rather than selling gourcouff to bourdoux,we should bring him back..he's worth more than the 15mln they offer..after getting him we can trade him for fabregas with arsenal..since arsene wenger has a fantasy for gourcouff he might as well be tempted if we make an offer(gourcouff+few mlns)..
if not arsenal atleast we can include him in a trade for benzema..
though i would like to see him play for milan..
The good sign for Milan is that we obviousely are earning more money of tv rights, shirts, tickets, sponsors since Dinho arrived. And now with Beckham Milan could earn a good ammount of money for the important summer mercato moves. That is the point of Beckham to Milan. Nothing more. If he plays some games and maybe makes an assist or two, even better. Then ge'll go and Yoan will be back. And the money can be used to rplace players like Emerson, Favalli, Maldini, $heva...
Dont forget we have Abate, who plays great as a midfielder and even RB. Great young modern player.
Beckham will apparently make us at least £7 million in sponsorship deals just by being with us for 3 months!
Well you have to understand that in Galliani's world Ronaldinho, Kaká and Seedorf, and sometimes even Ambrosini (!), are strikers...:pp20:
So...no problem, right?
Then we have Pippo, Boriellio, Pato, Shevchenko, Kaka, Ronaldinho, Seedorf and Ambro...
That's 8 strikers...
Still a problem right? :v46:
Beckham will apparently make us at least £7 million in sponsorship deals just by being with us for 3 months!
Sweet deal!
Plus i'm quite sure Becks will contribute something on the pitch as well...
But i do hope we don't sell Gorky...
Don't want another 'Viera-type' mistake...
Lebanese
25-10-2008, 22:54
The good sign for Milan is that we obviousely are earning more money of tv rights, shirts, tickets, sponsors since Dinho arrived. And now with Beckham Milan could earn a good ammount of money for the important summer mercato moves. That is the point of Beckham to Milan. Nothing more. If he plays some games and maybe makes an assist or two, even better. Then ge'll go and Yoan will be back. And the money can be used to rplace players like Emerson, Favalli, Maldini, $heva...
Dont forget we have Abate, who plays great as a midfielder and even RB. Great young modern player.
True, After this season i guess Our dear president will get over Sheva, after all it wasn't London's weather that dropped his form, its him. i think inzaghi will go too, retire all depends on his injuries. Maldini will retire, Favalli will go play golf in milan charity tournaments. so we need like 5 players. abate will come back so does gourcuff. we need 3 more players, but i have a feelings that milan will not invest heavily next season they have to cover some loss. i just hope we count on our young defenders in some games. we just need a good 2 central defenders and a left back (hope antonini adapts good in that position).
Bosniaco
25-10-2008, 22:57
Antonini is actually doing very well an the right flank. I really did not see him play on the left side.
I think we can only tell if Antonini is a world-class player when Milan plays against stronger team. I think he is a useful rotational player at the moment, which is just great because we don't have many of that player.
Antonini doesn't need to be WC, just good enough. IMO there aren't any wc wide defenders anymore.
Lebanese
26-10-2008, 03:14
Gazzetta - Atalanta, Cigarini: "Vedo il Milan nel mio futuro"
26.10.2008 08.09
Fonte: Gazzetta dello Sport
L'essere considerato l'erede di Pirlo lo onora, e per il proprio futuro il centrocampista dell'Atalanta, Luca Cigarini (22), vede proprio rossonero: "In quale squadra mi vedrei bene? Quella che, da sempre, gioca il miglior calcio è il Milan, se trova la partita perfetta è devastante, senza rivali. Da fuori il Milan sembra bello in tutto. Ecco, mi piacerebbe finire lì".
Go please Galliani, just get this player. Cigarini wants to play for milan
Cigarini is a brain of Italia U21, Giovanni will confirm it. And all the people that saw italy U21 play. People talk abouit Balotelli and Giovinco, but Cigarini is their's Pirlo. I love this player and I've seen him like 100 000 times and every time he showed he can play with brains and with technique. A future of Italian football for sure.
Abate has also shown he could be a great player inthe future. A bit og raqw and roung diamond, but an EXTREMLY fast ( and I mean it, he is absolutely FAST player ) player that plays now as a RM for Toro and Italy, but is seen like RWB in/for Milan. Has power, shot and feels the game well. LAcks a bit of positioning. But I like this player.
yoan is alsoi here for us. And with players like Emerson, Favalimnho, Paolo, $heva, Oddo, Dida, maaaaybe Pippo ( I doubt it though...I thing he will stay and I want him to stay) retirying, Milan will just need to patch up a team. Yoan, Abate, one CB and maybe one forward and that is it.
Lebanese
26-10-2008, 05:59
Cigarini is a brain of Italia U21, Giovanni will confirm it. And all the people that saw italy U21 play. People talk abouit Balotelli and Giovinco, but Cigarini is their's Pirlo. I love this player and I've seen him like 100 000 times and every time he showed he can play with brains and with technique. A future of Italian football for sure.
Abate has also shown he could be a great player inthe future. A bit og raqw and roung diamond, but an EXTREMLY fast ( and I mean it, he is absolutely FAST player ) player that plays now as a RM for Toro and Italy, but is seen like RWB in/for Milan. Has power, shot and feels the game well. LAcks a bit of positioning. But I like this player.
yoan is alsoi here for us. And with players like Emerson, Favalimnho, Paolo, $heva, Oddo, Dida, maaaaybe Pippo ( I doubt it though...I thing he will stay and I want him to stay) retirying, Milan will just need to patch up a team. Yoan, Abate, one CB and maybe one forward and that is it.
I agree with you:pr115:
Originally posted by jeff
I think we can only tell if Antonini is a world-class player when Milan plays against stronger team. I think he is a useful rotational player at the moment, which is just great because we don't have many of that player.
Agree. our rotation system works extremely well in recent weeks,hope carlo stick to this entire season. we need team guys like antonini.
As for next season, I still have a crash for adebayor, power centers proved to be very efficient when face teams put 9 players on backline.one boriello is not enough.
look at this..
we ve become a circus and even our players are being sarcastic about it..
Kaladze: First Beckham, Now Brad Pitt And George Clooney...
http://www.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=932080
Then we have Pippo, Boriellio, Pato, Shevchenko, Kaka, Ronaldinho, Seedorf and Ambro...
That's 8 strikers...
Still a problem right? :v46:
Not really...We're an attacking side, you know :5guitar:
GilAttack [11]
26-10-2008, 21:22
tevez, anyone?
http://www.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=920365
I suggested Tevez before he joined ManU and found lot of opposition here, saying he was a team cancer (LMAO) and some other cheap things.
Of course Tevez proved them wrong, he was fantastic for ManU scoring many clutch goals. He was better than Rooney.
And beggining this season, he was their best player while Ronaldo was out but Ferguson always stick with Rooney, for whatever reason (he is playing much better as of late). And then they bought Berbatov, so of course they wont pay that much for him just to sit.
I think its a very unfair situation for Tevez, but he has not made a problem out of it (Cancer, huh?).
He is a fan favorite there (as I predicted he would be) and seems to love Manchester.
But if for some reason there is a chance to sign him, I would probably go after him. Problem is he isnt an ideal partner for Pato and Milan regards him as their future.
Tevez is an excellent addition for any team in the world. Thats for sure.
look at this..
we ve become a circus and even our players are being sarcastic about it..
Kaladze: First Beckham, Now Brad Pitt And George Clooney...
http://www.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=932080
I think he is really just joking lol :)
look at this..
we ve become a circus and even our players are being sarcastic about it..
Kaladze: First Beckham, Now Brad Pitt And George Clooney...
http://www.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=932080
LOL.. add his wife too, Posh Spice who I hope will brings her "team mates" and sing "Wannabe" together :D
ps. I dont know that Kaladze is have a good sense of humour. His face always looks very serious :D
Lebanese
29-10-2008, 06:25
Tuttosport - Milan, non solo Fabregas per il centrocampo
Mentre si continua a sognare Cesc Fabregas e mentre Ariedo Braida vola in Sudamerica dove, assieme a Serginho, valuterà alcuni giovani interessanti, il Milan ha inviato in Olanda alcuni emissari per osservare i centrocampisto dell'Herenveen Pranjic e Beerens. Missione anche in Svezia e Ucraina per vedere all'opera il 17enne del Goteborg Soder ed il mediano della Dinamo Mykhalyk.
Intresting News, not the Cesc rummor but Braida's Brasilian trip with serginho. something is being cooked at via turti
kakacmilan best
29-10-2008, 06:59
I hope we will sign Hernanes.
hitmannq8
29-10-2008, 08:34
dont be too excited...last time Braida went to South America and back we ended up with Leandro Grimi!
Goal.com has lots of Sergio Ramos to Milan rumors lately, I like those very much :)
Goal.com has lots of Sergio Ramos to Milan rumors lately, I like those very much :)
Well, yes, but I think people should really forget about Ramos, Fabregas etc. it's not gonna happen (Ramos is the future of Madrid, and if Fabregas leaves it's most likely for Barca), and frankly given the massive prices we'd have to pay, the money would be better spend elsewhere - such as getting a less profilic full back + top 'keeper + top CB, and replace any player that might leave/retire.
Santacroce has also been linked with Milan, by my standards it is an optimal solution. In two years this man will be a better Cb then Ramos is now.
Milano84
29-10-2008, 14:32
Santacroce has also been linked with Milan, by my standards it is an optimal solution. In two years this man will be a better Cb then Ramos is now.
ramos is a RB
Gabriel489
30-10-2008, 03:57
I think Santacroce is the next Nesta
Goal.com has lots of Sergio Ramos to Milan rumors lately, I like those very much :)
Errr.. I'd rather have a real player coming here than a bulk of rumours :5ok:
ramos is a RB
Then we dont need him at all. But Milan sees him as CB in Maldini's place. And I still claim Milan needs to pay for Santacroce as he will be twice of a defenders Ramos is. But Napoli will try to wil lo scudetto in next years and most likely will not sell star players.
Im not for Ramos. Better for Zapata, Santacroce, Mexes and one fullback for that money: Doissena, Pasqual.
Then we dont need him at all. But Milan sees him as CB in Maldini's place. And I still claim Milan needs to pay for Santacroce as he will be twice of a defenders Ramos is. But Napoli will try to wil lo scudetto in next years and most likely will not sell star players.
Im not for Ramos. Better for Zapata, Santacroce, Mexes and one fullback for that money: Doissena, Pasqual.
I have long thought about Pasqual as a new LB for us. I haven't seen him that many times, but he has never let me down, when I've watched him. And with Vargas and even Massimo Gobbi ahead of him at Fiorentina, it shouldn't be too hard to get him.
Regarding Ramos, if we sign it has to be to play him at RB, other wise it'd be wiser, as you said, to spend the money on someone like Santacroce or Zapata, and a fullback to play on the opposite flank of Zambrotta.
On another note, according to Corriere dello Sport, one of the players Braida is looking at in South America is Ezequiel Muñoz of Boca Juniors. He's just turned 18, is a CB, 1,85 m tall and plays for the Argentine u-20 NT.
Then we dont need him at all. But Milan sees him as CB in Maldini's place. And I still claim Milan needs to pay for Santacroce as he will be twice of a defenders Ramos is. But Napoli will try to wil lo scudetto in next years and most likely will not sell star players.
Im not for Ramos. Better for Zapata, Santacroce, Mexes and one fullback for that money: Doissena, Pasqual.
Milan need a quality full-back, be that a left or right back to compliment Zambrotta. Ramos shouldn't be discounted as he would be a welcome addition to any side. I think Maldini see's Ramos as his heir because he probably believes the rampaging right-back can become a decent CB in his later years, it's not to put the Spaniard straight into the middle.
We don't need Mexes, Zapata & Santacroce will be enough. If you want the best players you have to pay for them wether they are at Napoli, Madrid or anywhere else. As for left-back, Zhirkov is the man to get, forget Dossena & Pasqual they're not as good as the Russian.
Anyone seen these two South American's play? I know one is 24 so he's not exactly a youngster anymore.
Warro Bantan
30-10-2008, 11:56
From channel4.com:
http://www.channel4.com/sport/football_italia/oct30l.html
Milan shop in South America Thursday 30 October, 2008
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Milan scout Serginho (pictured) has brought two young South American defenders to the attention of Adriano Galliani and Ariedo Braida.
The former Rossoneri left-back believes Ezequiel Munoz of Boca Juniors and Joao Miranda de Souza Filho have what it takes to succeed at San Siro.
Munoz, 18, is a strong centre-back with real aerial prowess who was recently called up to the Argentina Under-20 squad.
Meanwhile, Filho is 24 and has made his name at Sao Paulo where he marshals the back line to superb effect.
Braida is said to be keen on both of them, but awaits further reports before advising Galliani to draw up a bid in January.
Milan are also interested in making Philippe Senderos' loan from Arsenal permanent and feel Roma could be tempted to part with Philippe Mexes.
To be honest I dont think Napoli will sell any of their players untill they create a team that can fight for the scudetto. Right now they have top class players like Hamsik, LAvezzi, Santacroce, Gargano, Denis ( also a great player ). Some very good like Blasi, Maggio, P.Cannavaro... Adding F.Cannavaro is very likely and with the brilliant scouting team they have I do expect Napoli to be a serie a contender in 2-3 years time.
But IF I could choose, my solution for Milan would be Santacroce and Abate back from torino.
http://www.goal.com/en/articolo.aspx?contenutoid=939988
The Rossoneri have always been keen on the Spanish international who is one of the best midfielder's in football.
The Italian club is now ready to take their interest in him further as they have put together a mega bid to try and tempt Arsenal to part-company with their man.
Calciomercato.com claims that sources in England have revealed Milan are moving and shaking for the player and the transfer could take off.
Il Diavolo have already made a €35m bid and it's believed the North London-based side are analysing whether or not to sell up.
However, the Gunners star may not be interested in moving to Serie A as he always revealed his penchant for heading back to La Liga.
Arsenal have always scoffed at attempts on their players from other clubs but the reported offer from Milan may be too good to refuse.
Fabregas has played at the club since he was 16 and, with no major success on the pitch in Europe over the past two years, he may look for an adventure elsewhere.
Milan's plan is to form a team of Galaticos and the Arsenal man would be a great addition to the squad.
hmmmm....?
Giovanni
30-10-2008, 13:40
Official: Becks to Milan from January 7th.
Source: www.acmilan.com
Some very good like Blasi, Maggio, P.Cannavaro...
But IF I could choose, my solution for Milan would be Santacroce and Abate back from torino.
I still think it was a shame we couldn't persuade Maggio to join us. Naturally he probably wanted more definate playing time, something that i guess isn't guaranteed with us. However, Maggio at RB & Zambrotta at LB would have been a good basis for our defence.
I can agree with you about Abate, i hope we don't sell him like Foggia. But i don't think we should put him in as a full-back as you've mentioned in the past.
Giovanni
30-10-2008, 13:53
Jim, Foggia was sold cause he was a bit of a hot head and i've heard the old guard didn't like him and his attitude. More or less the same as Donati.
I'm surprised we want to sign Senderos as we haven't really seen him play yet!
I doubt Senderos news are true. But maybe Senderos showed good things in Milanello, for Billy, C.Maldini, P.Maldini, Baresi it doesnt take much time to see and evaluate a CB.
About abate, Giovanni - do you remember, or I am wrong as it is possible, that Abate already played as a RB in season before this in his loan spell? I can see some atributes in him that can make him powerfull wingback. His fitness abilities are extraordinary, and you can see he has a feeling for passes and the game in general. His speed is simply amazing, we could see Giovinco taering his shirt apart after Abate starter sprinting at the SAME time as Giovinco for the ball. With a bit of tactique and defensive duties he could play rB. If Sergio could, everyone can :)
Giovanni
30-10-2008, 17:01
I doubt Senderos news are true. But maybe Senderos showed good things in Milanello, for Billy, C.Maldini, P.Maldini, Baresi it doesnt take much time to see and evaluate a CB.
About abate, Giovanni - do you remember, or I am wrong as it is possible, that Abate already played as a RB in season before this in his loan spell? I can see some atributes in him that can make him powerfull wingback. His fitness abilities are extraordinary, and you can see he has a feeling for passes and the game in general. His speed is simply amazing, we could see Giovinco taering his shirt apart after Abate starter sprinting at the SAME time as Giovinco for the ball. With a bit of tactique and defensive duties he could play rB. If Sergio could, everyone can :)
Abate has a big personality. I remember his debut: he came in in the second half and changed the pace of our attacks. A youngster who does that in a debut at the San Siro is remarkable. At Milan he played as winger in some Coppa Italia matches, maybe against Palermo or Perugia, two ot three years ago.
I don't know if he's good in defending, that's my only concern about him turning into a RB. But even Serginho learnt, so i assume that this is possible. It'd be a waste, IMO, cause our fullbacks are more defensive minded, since we have so many other attacking players in other areas, in order to avoid counterattacks. By late they are locked to the defence, and locking a player of Abate's quality is a shame.
Milano84
30-10-2008, 22:07
Abate has a big personality. I remember his debut: he came in in the second half and changed the pace of our attacks. A youngster who does that in a debut at the San Siro is remarkable. At Milan he played as winger in some Coppa Italia matches, maybe against Palermo or Perugia, two ot three years ago.
I don't know if he's good in defending, that's my only concern about him turning into a RB. But even Serginho learnt, so i assume that this is possible. It'd be a waste, IMO, cause our fullbacks are more defensive minded, since we have so many other attacking players in other areas, in order to avoid counterattacks. By late they are locked to the defence, and locking a player of Abate's quality is a shame.
we could use him as a winger n a 4-2-3-1.... think him and kaka at outside attacking positions, ronnie behind pato or borriello as a striker. Also gourcuff could be rotated at and of 3 AM positions...Behind them we can have flamini and gattuso. it would add another element to our team.
and urright he does possess pace and skill to be a supersub initially (he is very young, and break into first team)...like nani was initially at manutd or walcott last year for arsenal
Milano84
30-10-2008, 22:15
I still think it was a shame we couldn't persuade Maggio to join us. Naturally he probably wanted more definate playing time, something that i guess isn't guaranteed with us. However, Maggio at RB & Zambrotta at LB would have been a good basis for our defence.
I can agree with you about Abate, i hope we don't sell him like Foggia. But i don't think we should put him in as a full-back as you've mentioned in the past.
if im correct, napoli paid 10 million euros for him, which is alot for a player not as proven at the time.....however i think its turned out alright and he fits napoli tactics perfectly.... Still him or dossena would have been very good WB purchases.
what do people thing of Giandomenico Mesto (of genoa) He's a RWB, 26 years old.. i dunno he impressed me 1 time i saw him last year, but maybe i just caught a good day lol. Also i think corluka could be stealable next season (unless tottenham REALLY turn it around....like europe turn it around)
Burdening Abate with the responsibility of defending will have a negative impact on his attacking ability. The times when you want him to attack will be lessened because the defensive duties comes first, this isn't the way to fully nurture his talent or to let him grow as a player.
This isn't to say he couldn't be a solid RB in his later years, but defending is an art and takes time, not all players can adapt to this mind set. Best to let him develop as a winger and see what happens.
But then I dont see im fitting in Milan's conception as we dont use a winger and cant use a winger in our formations. Maybe as an AM, but we have Dinho, Kaka', Seedorf and most likely Yoan next year...
Fullback it is :)
ACMILAN1983
31-10-2008, 08:12
Regarding transfers, firstly welcome to Beckham, may he bring us lots of money. :D
Fabregas would be a great signing imo. He's incredibly talented and his vision is outstanding. He's the best replacement I can think of for Pirlo, something which will need to be considered for the long term and his partnership with Flamini is excellent, something which could develop into a Pirlo-Rino like partnership for years to come. If we can get him, without a doubt I'd get him.
Bringing back Abate would be a great move too. He's proving himself in Serie A and has already had a couple of good seasons behind him. We will need reinforcements in wide areas, whether it's fullbacks or wingers, and he'd be a good start.
Finally, Napoli have some very bright youngsters, and like mrki I really like the look of Santacroce to reinforce our defence. They seem unattainable for now, but worth keeping an eye on for definite.
But then I dont see im fitting in Milan's conception as we dont use a winger and cant use a winger in our formations. Maybe as an AM, but we have Dinho, Kaka', Seedorf and most likely Yoan next year...
Fullback it is :)
Using Serginho as an example again, we found space for him in our side in an attacking position so there's no reason to think we can't find room for Abate.
I still think we should not give up on a 4-2-3-1 formation. To be truly successful we will need to be flexible with our formations and be able to play in different ways with confidence. Next season, i would expect Ronaldinho to be back to full fitness and running all over the place (there would be concerns if he wasn't), therefore he could be played out wide with Abate on the other side and Kaka in the middle ... all behind Boriello. Add Gourcuff, Pato and possibly Shevchenko to that mix and we suddenly look quite adaptable.
Those keen eyed readers out there will notice i've not included Seedorf in that list. The way i see it is if (and it's a big if) we were to bring back both Abate & Gourcuff, not to mention any other central midfield signings we might make (Fabregas, Hamsik or otherwise), then there would be no need for Seedorf. To move the side forward we must make sacrifices and for me keeping hold of a 33 year old (next year) midfielder, no matter how influential at times, is maybe something we must consider.
Milano84
31-10-2008, 11:37
think of the 4-2-3-1 this way.....
--------bori/pato----------
--kaka---r80---abate-----
-----flamini--gattuso-----
--------back four--------
its a beautiful counter attacking formation, we have 2 players breaking up there midfield, and pace to counter.... r80 in center behind striker as he is best natural playmaker in world, and when uptop, a great eye for goal...
it reminds me of what france used alot france....
----------henry-----------
--ribery--zidane--malouda--
-----viera----makelele-----
i said it before but i believe henry is a more realistic future comparison to pato than ronaldo. Zidane, like Ronnie now, was never fast... and although zidane was more physical, ronnie can play in the tightest of places and his distribution and playmaking sense is just as good as zidanes. Ribery and kaka can be similar too.... both r playmakers, ribery tends to play wide rolls but he's not a real winger. Eitherway kaka can have freedom to cut in alot, perhaps zambrotta plays down his flank to add a wide infleunce. Finally, the only true winger was malouda or govou. On that side of defense we can play a more defensive FB as we dont need a cafu type racing down the flank, just some1 tactically intelligent.
the beauty of this formation is, i think if we wanted pato has ability to drop to 1 of AM rolls. He could play a CF roll instead of r80. And Gourcuff can also play all 3 rolls.
the issue becomes players like seedorf and pirlo. Seedorf is going to be 33 this season, he is on his way out, however pirlo will be 30 and has many years left. Personally i think he can handle a DM position in a 4-2-3-1. He is tactically smart and can position himself well enough to intercept passes etc. Also if u remmber in 2003-2005 we really only played with 1 DM next to him, often putting serginho or seedorf at LM. I'm not saying make it our base formation, but i think if abate and gourcuff come back we have the personnel to run it beautifully. Its a beautiful formation, and can be effective. Roma nearly won serie A with it, and theres no way you can tell me aside from de rossi (and totti who was hurt last part of season when they surged up top) roma has near the mf or attack players milan does.
I'm not saying even run it soley, just simply an option. To do so we do need to sure up the backline though
With 4-2-3-1 its a problem to play Pirlo in this "2" part, as he is unable to cover space as a real DM. Fabregas would that, while Pirlo has some qualities Fabregas doesnt have.
If Moggi was our director, this summer we would all say bye-bye to Pirlo as he would probably be off to Barca or Real for 35mln and Milan would birng Fabregas. But this will not happen and Milan will not go for Fabregas at all. Only solution is:
Seedorf leaves Milan, Gourcuff is sold to Bordoux, Emerson retires and Fabregas takes old Sedeorf CM position next to Pirlo and Rino. Which, by me, is the best solution ( since we are talking about fantasy football in here :) ).
-----------pirlo--------
----------(flamini)------
---Rino--------Fabregas---
---(abate)-----(Ambro)--
-------Kaka'-Dinho---
fior sure, the way Seedorf plays AM in Milan, Fabregas can also play that.
Personally i think he can handle a DM position in a 4-2-3-1. He is tactically smart and can position himself well enough to intercept passes etc. Also if u remmber in 2003-2005 we really only played with 1 DM next to him, often putting serginho or seedorf at LM.
Pirlo we talk about, so people know.
In that 2003 season, what was our back line: Dida - most likely with gigi the best GK in the world. Cafu - no words needed. Nesta - at top. Maldini - Maldini is Maldini. Billy - still brilliant there. Stam later on... Kaladze as a LB, not CB.
that back line was 3 times better then this one and could hod up the midfield by pushing up and winning 90% of 1 on 1's in every game. This Milan back 4 cant play like that and Pirlo needs to drop deeper to protect players like Bonewra, Kaladze as a CB, slow Maldini sometimes, Favalli, Marek in defensive phase.
Its not the same situation. Midfield is addicted to back 4 and their quality. And back 4 to GK's safety.
Milano84
31-10-2008, 12:06
Pirlo we talk about, so people know.
In that 2003 season, what was our back line: Dida - most likely with gigi the best GK in the world. Cafu - no words needed. Nesta - at top. Maldini - Maldini is Maldini. Billy - still brilliant there. Stam later on... Kaladze as a LB, not CB.
that back line was 3 times better then this one and could hod up the midfield by pushing up and winning 90% of 1 on 1's in every game. This Milan back 4 cant play like that and Pirlo needs to drop deeper to protect players like Bonewra, Kaladze as a CB, slow Maldini sometimes, Favalli, Marek in defensive phase.
Its not the same situation. Midfield is addicted to back 4 and their quality. And back 4 to GK's safety.
point taken but we could use 4-2-3-1 with pirlo not in lineup w/ flamini/gattuso
News flash: According to Corriere dello Sport one of the defenders we've been linked, Thiago Silva, has struck a deal with Inter to move in January.
Lebanese
31-10-2008, 17:51
think of the 4-2-3-1 this way.....
--------bori/pato----------
--kaka---r80---abate-----
-----flamini--gattuso-----
--------back four--------
its a beautiful counter attacking formation, we have 2 players breaking up there midfield, and pace to counter.... r80 in center behind striker as he is best natural playmaker in world, and when uptop, a great eye for goal...
it reminds me of what france used alot france....
----------henry-----------
--ribery--zidane--malouda--
-----viera----makelele-----
i said it before but i believe henry is a more realistic future comparison to pato than ronaldo. Zidane, like Ronnie now, was never fast... and although zidane was more physical, ronnie can play in the tightest of places and his distribution and playmaking sense is just as good as zidanes. Ribery and kaka can be similar too.... both r playmakers, ribery tends to play wide rolls but he's not a real winger. Eitherway kaka can have freedom to cut in alot, perhaps zambrotta plays down his flank to add a wide infleunce. Finally, the only true winger was malouda or govou. On that side of defense we can play a more defensive FB as we dont need a cafu type racing down the flank, just some1 tactically intelligent.
the beauty of this formation is, i think if we wanted pato has ability to drop to 1 of AM rolls. He could play a CF roll instead of r80. And Gourcuff can also play all 3 rolls.
the issue becomes players like seedorf and pirlo. Seedorf is going to be 33 this season, he is on his way out, however pirlo will be 30 and has many years left. Personally i think he can handle a DM position in a 4-2-3-1. He is tactically smart and can position himself well enough to intercept passes etc. Also if u remmber in 2003-2005 we really only played with 1 DM next to him, often putting serginho or seedorf at LM. I'm not saying make it our base formation, but i think if abate and gourcuff come back we have the personnel to run it beautifully. Its a beautiful formation, and can be effective. Roma nearly won serie A with it, and theres no way you can tell me aside from de rossi (and totti who was hurt last part of season when they surged up top) roma has near the mf or attack players milan does.
I'm not saying even run it soley, just simply an option. To do so we do need to sure up the backline though
that was the formation that won 98 world cup? come on. this is the same formation of roma. u can never play wide in serie A. look at inter, look at roma this formation can do wonders in spain or england but not in italy. we cant play 2 midfielders and 3 attacking midfielders. in this formation u can never use the full backs because one mistake boom ur concended.
the best possible solution for milan is this. we need midfielders who are able to attack and keep the ball and at the same time we need them to defend. this is the only solution.
we have pirlo, gattuso, ambrosini, flamini, emerson, seedord, kaka, ronaldinho
7 of them will demand a starting spot. how can we do that?
i have a question, why sheva has not been given the time to regain his old form?
because there are too many players to warm the bench. honestly i would play 4312. but come on do you think ronaldinho will want to be benched?
Galliani said today that rotation system is only for uefa cup and italian cup but not for Serie A.
i have a question, why sheva has not been given the time to regain his old form?
Very simple: Shevchenko is not even good enough yet to regain his form on the field.
Milan doesn't just 'ruin' players like Gourcuff who have huge potential but also bench players who are not good enough (compared to others in their departments) to play. Favalli is playing only because we don't have better alternate, otherwise you won't be seeing him play. Same for Shevchenko: We have Inzaghi, Pato, and Borriello, + Kaka` and Ronaldinho. Why would Sheva start unless he is really fit? :)
Lebanese
31-10-2008, 23:15
Very simple: Shevchenko is not even good enough yet to regain his form on the field.
Milan doesn't just 'ruin' players like Gourcuff who have huge potential but also bench players who are not good enough (compared to others in their departments) to play. Favalli is playing only because we don't have better alternate, otherwise you won't be seeing him play. Same for Shevchenko: We have Inzaghi, Pato, and Borriello, + Kaka` and Ronaldinho. Why would Sheva start unless he is really fit? :)
Jeff with due all respect, i guess sheva made two crucial passes last match that would ended in the goal. we are not showing trust in sheva. am not defending sheva or anything. honestly i dont want him in the team. talking about fitness do you think ronaldinho got any?
After all we need a coach with balls who is able to sub a *star* player who is not performing, trust me on papers we got 11 stars but on the field we find out they are different.
Favalli thing, please have mercy on me :kap: did u see his ariel ability? positioning? passing? marking? .... etc this guy is nothing in football the only good game favalli played in his entire career was against inter last year when we won 2-1 and he was playing a left back. I am not hating on favalli or anything after all he is wearing milans shirt, am willing to respect anyone wearing milan shirt even if it was matrix him self. we have better alternatives yes, we have darmian. Do you think italian press and analysts would call him a hot prospect if they did not see a thing in him, i saw this guy in friendlies and trust me he can deliver instantly, i dont know how to include a player in your first team if your not gonna play him or trust him !!! We never heard of paloschi until we saw him playing! how about darmian everybody know him and know his abilities
well, we're not in trainings, so we dont know why Carlo picks those players.
we're not the coach so again we dont know why those players are picked.
Sheva might have made couple of great moves and shots on goal, but yet he's not as fast as Borriello and Kaka nor can he finished properly, he had 3 1on1 chances that Borriello, Inzaghi and hell, even Pato could have finished them into the back of the net, but where did those balls end up?
as for the Paloschi-Darmian arguement..
Paloschi was played because we had an attacking crisis on our hands.
Remember that Kaka, Inzaghi, Pato were all injured and Gilardino has lost his confident that season, so he had to play.. Also at times we had to play Ambrosini as an AMF and also as a 2nd striker :wallbang:
as for Darmian, he was/is playing with the U18 team, so he's getting the time to develope, and so is Paloschi, I believe that Darmian is going to be loaned to get 1st team action rather as soon as our defenders are back..
and our other young defender, Pasini, will go with him :D
There is no point in playing an 18 year old boy defender in Milan. Its not the same with forwards and CB's. Darmian needs to be loaned out and I hope he will be.
As far as Carlo is a coach we will rely on experience. Even when it is overplayed in any sence.
$heva is not ready and not fast enough yet, Carlo said so himself. Dinho is different matter, untill now he brought us more then $heva.
Lebanese
01-11-2008, 08:01
There is no point in playing an 18 year old boy defender in Milan. Its not the same with forwards and CB's. Darmian needs to be loaned out and I hope he will be.
As far as Carlo is a coach we will rely on experience. Even when it is overplayed in any sence.
$heva is not ready and not fast enough yet, Carlo said so himself. Dinho is different matter, untill now he brought us more then $heva.
He is young yes but lot of milan legends started playing at 18 and in defence too
Lebanese
01-11-2008, 08:23
My point was: Darmian is a better CB than Favalli.
I believe that Darmian is going to be loaned to get 1st team action rather as soon as our defenders are back..
and our other young defender, Pasini, will go with him :D
i think that albertazzi kid is also fantastic..he should also be loaned..i think he'll end up being better than both darmian and pasini..just my opinion..
Giovanni
01-11-2008, 10:05
You guys are all like women, always talking about shopping :D
Peachtot
01-11-2008, 22:57
Hahaha.. I think they're preparing all things needed for Christmas, Gio :grinser:
And their using someone else's money too. Seen Darmian for Italy U19 during Summer, and thought he was very poor. Albertazzi though stood out.
Giovanni
02-11-2008, 05:47
I'd like to know where are those who were crying for Galliani to sign QueerAssma or Manuel Viagras of Fiorentina. :D
kastriot
02-11-2008, 06:46
I'd like to know where are those who were crying for Galliani to sign QueerAssma or Manuel Viagras of Fiorentina. :D
My guess is they are hiding.:grinser::grinser:
I agree partially with your comment.
Quaresma has been really poor since joining inter,I dont except much of him,his like a spoiled kid o smth, as for vargas Gio, his been solid so far IMO. Maybe with time he will regain his old form back.
Quaresma wouldnt make it in the first team of MIlan playing like this, he plays for inter cuz Mou is stubborn enough to see that 4-3-3 isnt working. On the other hand Vargas would be playing in our first team since I dont see Janku or Antonini as a better options, in fact I think Vargas has played better this season than our LB options, Janku,Antonini and the almighty Favallinho.
Graeme C
02-11-2008, 07:00
How about Dossena? rumours are that he is going to leave Liverpool in Jan? not a bad loan option? still better than favalli at Left back
Vargas has been ok by my standards as far as I have seen him.
Giovanni
02-11-2008, 09:14
I've always liked Grosso. With Italy he always performs well, and knows how to eventually dive if your team is locked on 0-0 at the 90th minute :sun:
I've always liked Grosso. With Italy he always performs well, and knows how to eventually dive if your team is locked on 0-0 at the 90th minute :sun:
:grinser: :ilol:
yep that was pretty much a great moment :guw:
Emanuelson from Ajax
i think this would be a great transfer
he reminds me of Sergio
I m watching fiorentina s game and frey has once again made some extraordinary saves..
Lebanese
02-11-2008, 11:09
I'd like to know where are those who were crying for Galliani to sign QueerAssma or Manuel Viagras of Fiorentina. :D
Never liked QueerAssma, but to be honest i wanted Viagras so bad on the left department, well he didn't adapt i guess but this guy has it in him, not his season and team, but he is not a one season wonder player.
was reading something on tuttomercatoweb that milan tonight are watching carefully two players
Lavezzi Uncle Berlu is falling for him and he wants him no matter what
Santacroce Anchelotti wants him so bad.
The one Ancelotti wants will not come to Milan :)
Never liked QueerAssma, but to be honest i wanted Viagras so bad on the left department, well he didn't adapt i guess but this guy has it in him, not his season and team, but he is not a one season wonder player.
was reading something on tuttomercatoweb that milan tonight are watching carefully two players
Lavezzi Uncle Berlu is falling for him and he wants him no matter what
Santacroce Anchelotti wants him so bad.I still think Queerassma is a FANTASTIC player. Mourinho is asking him to do FAR too much defensive work. He should be free to do whatever he wants like CR7 does in Manchester. I can't see how a player that fast and skillful could play so much crap :dontkn: but then again Seedorf and Pirlo weren't lighting the world on fire at printer either.
Lebanese
03-11-2008, 02:41
I still think Queerassma is a FANTASTIC player. Mourinho is asking him to do FAR too much defensive work. He should be free to do whatever he wants like CR7 does in Manchester. I can't see how a player that fast and skillful could play so much crap :dontkn: but then again Seedorf and Pirlo weren't lighting the world on fire at printer either.
Not every Fast And Skillful player is tactical. Even CR7 is gonna fail in Serie A. In Our league its about how to create the space not about running into the space and making monkey moves
I still think Queerassma is a FANTASTIC player. Mourinho is asking him to do FAR too much defensive work. He should be free to do whatever he wants like CR7 does in Manchester. I can't see how a player that fast and skillful could play so much crap :dontkn: but then again Seedorf and Pirlo weren't lighting the world on fire at printer either.
The question is when was/is he fantastic? When? Only in Portugal?
When he was very young, he was a fantastic talent but only that, not more. I admire him when he played in USA especially against Milan in friendly match but he couldn't continue what he did in USA in La Liga.
Peachtot
03-11-2008, 04:00
I admire him when he played in USA especially against Milan in friendly match but he couldn't continue what he did in USA in La Liga.
i remembered that time with barcelona everytime he had the ball the stepover dribble show always appeared :)
after the pre-season 2003, he had no place in rijkaard scheme 4-3-3. Dinho on left flank, luis garcia on the right accompany saviola as target man
Zhirkov is clearly the LB we want as he's better than all of the names that have been offered so far. But because he's non-eu we'd have to wait until the summer.
I read we were looking at Pranjic a little while back, but i'm sure that was just because we were playing Heerenveen.
Dru, C.Ronaldo is classes above Quaresma as a player. Just wanted to say that.
And the choice is now definite: new Cb of Milan should be Santacroce!
Kalstroem6
03-11-2008, 08:41
Pranjic,Zhirkov e.t.c,we need more competition for the left FB.
Santacroce would be awesome,Zapata too.
then please a complete player who'll play next to Gattuso and Pirlo,considering Ambrosini offers little offensive contribution and Seedorf at 33 cant play all games.
Then if Pato goes on like this and if Sheva still wont find his self at the end of this season,a new striker should be considered as well.we need a bit continuity in attack department.Borriello cant find it thanks to injuries.
i would certainly choose santacrocce and mexes over zapata..
just look at romas defence when they play without him these days,they're tottally ridiculous..
and then a better gk,especially frey imo hes one of 3-4 best keepers around..
i dont think we need a great lb like zhirkov cause he would cost us a lot..ranjic dossena???not good enough for starters but good back ups..marek is better than them imo..
if we got frey,santacrocce or mexes(or even both of them if nesta is not fit in the years to come) and a back up full back,i would be extremelly happy..
Lebanese
03-11-2008, 12:03
i would certainly choose santacrocce and mexes over zapata..
just look at romas defence when they play without him these days,they're tottally ridiculous..
and then a better gk,especially frey imo hes one of 3-4 best keepers around..
i dont think we need a great lb like zhirkov cause he would cost us a lot..ranjic dossena???not good enough for starters but good back ups..marek is better than them imo..
if we got frey,santacrocce or mexes(or even both of them if nesta is not fit in the years to come) and a back up full back,i would be extremelly happy..
yeah i watched Juventus vs. roma and this guy was something the second goal was his fault by all standards
Lebanese
03-11-2008, 12:10
I am not really worried of defence right now, as we have the second best defence across europe, chelsea is first with 4 goals from 11 matches, milan and inter are second and the next two matches can't be considered as a threat on our defence. so i believe we need a fit, concentrated and self motivated players starting from round 14 when we play palermo and so on till the winter break
yeah i watched Juventus vs. roma and this guy was something the second goal was his fault by all standards
yeah whatever..it was riise's fault dude..
although he did nt make any mistakes he was not in a good day..
I am not really worried of defence right now, as we have the second best defence across europe, chelsea is first with 4 goals from 11 matches, milan and inter are second and the next two matches can't be considered as a threat on our defence. so i believe we need a fit, concentrated and self motivated players starting from round 14 when we play palermo and so on till the winter break
that doesnt mean kaladze favalli bonera are good enough..and there is no chance we ll make it with those..i just w8 nesta senderos and paolo back..
I'd take Zapata over Mexes, i think the Udinese CB is a much better option for us.
I know our defence is performing quite well right now, but it doesn't mean we can't keep our eyes open for improvements (of which there are many).
Actually, I don't see any other need in defense than Santacroce !!
This guy is terrible, we all already knew that, he's the next big thing if he continues in this way, but I wanted to wait until he plays directly against us and he was magnificient by stopping all our actions on his side and even giving good balls to his midfielders when it was needed ...
Amazing ... never saw that since a while !!
So for our defense, Santacroce + a young and good RB (on LB position, we would already have Janku-Antonini + Zambrotta if needed) to substitute Zambrotta or even take his place, because next year, Zambrotta will probably start to have some physical problems (and if it's not next year, it'll be the following one).
EDIT: and let's not forget that Oddo could come back and be a good bench player on RB position ...
Anyway, we won't see any of these purchases on the winter mercato !!
If Gourcuff comes back, we won't need anyone in midfield and competition in this area will be amazing in our team !! (we'll be able to have 2 competitive teams with our current midfield + Gourcuff)
Maybe we'll need someone instead of Sheva if he doesn't regain a good form and more probably instead of Inzaghi who can't be counted like a all-season-striker anymore ...
I am not sure if Santracroce is that good. What I always see that normally the DCs of the opponents play very well against us especially when the score is 0-0. What Santracroce has to proove is against small team when Napoli play offensively (leave space in the back) and he also has to be consistent in a good form. I have heard praise for Barzagli more than praise to Santracoce and we know he ends up.
I think, it's better to wait and see.
hitmannq8
03-11-2008, 13:23
I am not sure if Santracroce is that good. What I always see that normally the DCs of the opponents play very well against us especially when the score is 0-0. What Santracroce has to proove is against small team when Napoli play offensively (leave space in the back) and he also has to be consistent in a good form. I have heard praise for Barzagli more than praise to Santracoce and we know he ends up.
I think, it's better to wait and see.
You are totally wrong here. Barzagli's praise was never justified. Barzagli at best was nothing more than a solid defender, who managed to shine in a team of nobodies (Palermo). They all kept comparing Barzagli to Nesta's class and strength but every time I watch Palermo play he has never lived up to it, and I mean never. Same goes to Zaccardo, who is even worse. That was a time where Lippi was trying to bring in two young Italian defenders into the squad to learn from Cannavaro/Nesta/Materazzi for the future, so everyone dubbed them as the next great Italian defenders automatically.
I even used to watch Zapata play often but he does not impress on a regular basis like Santacroce. Santacroce is different. Everytime I seen him play he seems to be leading the defense and is always in the thick of things. At his very young age I've already seen him deal with strikers like Ibrahimovic, Del Piero, Amauri very well. He can only improve and I think he is the next great big thing.
Giovanni
03-11-2008, 13:38
Santacroce is very good, but we should wait for some big test to see if he's really the next big thing. Watching him play in the last performances surely suggest that.
You are totally wrong here. Barzagli's praise was never justified. Barzagli at best was nothing more than a solid defender, who managed to shine in a team of nobodies (Palermo). They all kept comparing Barzagli to Nesta's class and strength but every time I watch Palermo play he has never lived up to it, and I mean never. Same goes to Zaccardo, who is even worse. That was a time where Lippi was trying to bring in two young Italian defenders into the squad to learn from Cannavaro/Nesta/Materazzi for the future, so everyone dubbed them as the next great Italian defenders automatically.
I even used to watch Zapata play often but he does not impress on a regular basis like Santacroce. Santacroce is different. Everytime I seen him play he seems to be leading the defense and is always in the thick of things. At his very young age I've already seen him deal with strikers like Ibrahimovic, Del Piero, Amauri very well. He can only improve and I think he is the next great big thing.
How can I believe only on 1 person (you) but dont believe to many opinions (fans, news etc)? I can't.
I still think that Santrococe is just like Barzagli etc except he can proove with consistent performance not only with defensive tactic and many mifielders protecting him but also when as I said Napoli play offensively (not defensively).
It's still premature to evaluate Santrococe in this stage.
Santacroce is very good, but we should wait for some big test to see if he's really the next big thing. Watching him play in the last performances surely suggest that.
I absolutely agree with you. It's very difficult to find (buy) very good defender (very good when already play with Milan). Just wait and see how Santracoce performance this season (and next season maybe).
Santacroce is very good, but we should wait for some big test to see if he's really the next big thing. Watching him play in the last performances surely suggest that.
As would the fact he's been sent off twice already this season.
I even used to watch Zapata play often but he does not impress on a regular basis like Santacroce.
Maybe that's because he's not played at all this season and has a serious injury. Given time to recover, he will be as good as he was and on a similar level to Santacroce.
my favorite player for the moment on the defence is Santaccroce i also used to see both of them (santaccroce and zapata) i think santaccroce is better would be great if we sign him.
I just knew that Santacroce has played ONLY 20 games in Serie A (13 games last season). Still too early to say Santacroce is great defender. He still needs to prove a lot.
Giovanni
03-11-2008, 17:02
Santacroce's anticipation on the opposer is 100% Cannavaro-ish.
But higher then Cannavaro and has technique similar to Nesta. And is able to play at a RB if needed!
But Im 99% sure that Napoli will not sell Santacroce! Anyway, he is the best Italian defender for future, and if we are to spend we should at least try for him. It was clear even last year he is a special player. Even more special then Chiellini was at that age.
For winter mercato we know our player: Becks :)
How about the CD from Argentina that Serginho recommended (according to the football news)? I read that he is still 18 years old but already play for U-20. His height is 185 cm if I remember correctly.
Anyone has seen him play? Or any clips about him?
Giovanni
03-11-2008, 17:43
On another note, Mourinho is melancolic and he's starting to feel the pressures of Serie A. Another evidence that training here is very difficult.
You find coaches of lower teams that stay awake at night to study videos, trying to block your game.
Mourinho's approach to Italy hasn't been very appropriate. As someone on tv said, he wanted to be leading protagonist of a corrida, but he's finding out that in the arena of Serie A, many are able to fight.
As i said when it was much more difficult to say: Carlo for life. Carlo aka the Normal One.
__________________
Peachtot
03-11-2008, 20:41
for years.. i often read in media that journalists or football fans from various countries stated that premier league more competitive than serie a. they said in premier league lower team has bigger opportunity to beat upper team than in serie a. By that thought there must be an opinion araised that even a lower team of premier league can compete in european competition. But the facts didnt prove that.
Based on that reality, I think in EPL lower team could beat upper team in many occasion caused the upper team ain't more tactical or strategical. They are used to beat the lower team because the players are better indeed in technique & skill aspect. Management bless coach with decent players
In serie a, i think it's different. Yes, you need decent players. Beyond that, tactic & strategy play big part in every game and also to count how you dive to seek freekick, penalty, cards or just to delay the game for some breath taking or waiting the final whistle. Sometimes it's ridiculous seeing a man down on the field then pretend suffering alot but nothing caused him seriously. But then you have to agree it's an evidence that Serie A more tactical and more difficult than other league :D :grinser:
My fantasy transfer campaine for next summer.
1 Bring back abate and gorky
2 Get santaccroche,zhirkov,adebayor(by the way,Does anyone knows our NE status)
That will cost about 60 mil euros,quite reasonable to strengthen weak spots on current squad and rebuild a core for next 8 years at the same time.
Giovanni
04-11-2008, 04:27
Everyone who is interested in football market, should tell us not only how to buy players and what players, but, more importantly, how to SELL players.
If you list 5 new players, you should tell us who you are going to sell and for what price, looking at his original price in order to avoid minusvalences.
This is real market, not just a list of fantasy names.
Im sure Milan doesnt have any plaers to sell for some serious money, just Yoan is there to go for possible 15mln. Maldini, Favalli, Emerson, $heva, Dida, Kalac, Oddo - those are palyrs you cant sell for big money.
But this year we have made big profits from Dinho and soon from Beckham, so that is also a part of club's politics, economical.
On another note, Mourinho is melancolic and he's starting to feel the pressures of Serie A. Another evidence that training here is very difficult.
You find coaches of lower teams that stay awake at night to study videos, trying to block your game.
This is a reason why i think Benitez would probably be quite successful in Serie A. He has an incredibly studious approach to the game, when he's not training players he's repeatedly watching videos of the opposition to find weaknesses and videos of his own team to find out where to improve. He often says he lies awake at night thinking of tactics and line-ups, you don't get that impression with Mourinho. With Jose i think he does some studying but not much and relies on his man management skills to make his team more positive.
for years.. i often read in media that journalists or football fans from various countries stated that premier league more competitive than serie a. they said in premier league lower team has bigger opportunity to beat upper team than in serie a. By that thought there must be an opinion araised that even a lower team of premier league can compete in european competition. But the facts didnt prove that.
Based on that reality, I think in EPL lower team could beat upper team in many occasion caused the upper team ain't more tactical or strategical. They are used to beat the lower team because the players are better indeed in technique & skill aspect. Management bless coach with decent players
In serie a, i think it's different. Yes, you need decent players. Beyond that, tactic & strategy play big part in every game and also to count how you dive to seek freekick, penalty, cards or just to delay the game for some breath taking or waiting the final whistle. Sometimes it's ridiculous seeing a man down on the field then pretend suffering alot but nothing caused him seriously. But then you have to agree it's an evidence that Serie A more tactical and more difficult than other league :D :grinser:
If people are saying that the EPL is more competitive than the Serie A, there's something wrong. In England there's four teams capable of winning the league, and it's the same four every year. To think that a team outside the big four could win the league is crazy as even cracking the top four is impossible (unless Man City really get a trillion £s from their new owners!)
In Italy there's also a sort of big 4, but then there's Napoli, Lazio, Fiorentina and even Udinese who at least have a shot at finishing in the top 4. And in Spain there's always Barca and Madrid, but this year Valencia, Villarreal, Sevilla and Atletico each have the quality to get in to the top 4, and the first two could definately win the league.
Really you can just look at the points amassed by the top teams in each country. The English top 4 in last 5 years always have the highest score (with the exception of Inter's post-calciopoli season), followed by Italy and Spain. Usually when a top team in England face a team from the bottom they win easily, in Italy upsets are much more frequent and in Spain they happen every week. Madrid just drew with Almería, you wouldn't see Chelsea do that with, say, Sunderland (who like Almería are in their second season in the top division), would you?
Conclusion: England is the least competitive big league when it comes to top vs. bottom games.
This is a reason why i think Benitez would probably be quite successful in Serie A. He has an incredibly studious approach to the game, when he's not training players he's repeatedly watching videos of the opposition to find weaknesses and videos of his own team to find out where to improve. He often says he lies awake at night thinking of tactics and line-ups, you don't get that impression with Mourinho. With Jose i think he does some studying but not much and relies on his man management skills to make his team more positive.
I thought Mourinho apply the same method too. I read somewhere that he has an assistant who provides him the statistics of the opponents, it's so complete that it includes players' personal tendencies to act under certain circumstances. Then Mourinho analyze it. I think he just need to get used to the serie-A atmosphere
Kalstroem6
04-11-2008, 07:27
-Zhirkov
-santacroce/Zapata
-Hamsik/Moutinho/Gourcuff(if he will play with regularity and will get as much as playing time like Seedorf and Ambrosini does)
-striker(we should find the continuity in attack department,Borriello cant find it thanks to injuries,you know Pato,Pippo will be 1 years older,Sheva still didnt prove anything yet)
kastriot
04-11-2008, 09:58
This is a reason why i think Benitez would probably be quite successful in Serie A. He has an incredibly studious approach to the game, when he's not training players he's repeatedly watching videos of the opposition to find weaknesses and videos of his own team to find out where to improve. He often says he lies awake at night thinking of tactics and line-ups, you don't get that impression with Mourinho. With Jose i think he does some studying but not much and relies on his man management skills to make his team more positive.
I think Mou gives as much time as Benitez for tactics and understanding the competition.And he is a great tactician. however he made some crucial judgmental mistakes.
1.He though he would be accepted with the same enthusiasm as in england.and everybody will love him.
2.He thought the media would be his best friend as in england( normally because reporters love individuals like Mou).read the latest article at goal.com,it describes it perfectly what I want to say.
3.He decided for the 4-4-3 tactics even before steeping in Italy,and then tried to adapt the squad to the tactics, its the other way around.
4.Hi transfers were bad. MAncini and Quaresma are never gonna be Joe Cole and Robben.And he misses a Lampard and a Drogba in his team, cuz Ibra is no Drogba,(meaning, he cant play with his back to the goal, and he will never pass you, instead he will shoot even though he didnt have the enough space to do so.
5.As Gio pointed out earlier, in England you have one Manager who is tactic driven(Benitez) and Mou always struggled with him.In italy you have 20 tacticians always searching for a way how to stop you,regardless how destructive they are. And he underestimated them, (Ranieri case).
Last but not least is "MILAN" hopefully we can be the reason he dosnt succeed in Italy. and of course he is the manager of inter, itself is a major reason to fail.:devf::devf:
ACMILAN1983
04-11-2008, 10:42
I think Mou gives as much time as Benitez for tactics and understanding the competition.And he is a great tactician. however he made some crucial judgmental mistakes.
1.He though he would be accepted with the same enthusiasm as in england.and everybody will love him.
2.He thought the media would be his best friend as in england( normally because reporters love individuals like Mou).read the latest article at goal.com,it describes it perfectly what I want to say.
3.He decided for the 4-4-3 tactics even before steeping in Italy,and then tried to adapt the squad to the tactics, its the other way around.
4.Hi transfers were bad. MAncini and Quaresma are never gonna be Joe Cole and Robben.And he misses a Lampard and a Drogba in his team, cuz Ibra is no Drogba,(meaning, he cant play with his back to the goal, and he will never pass you, instead he will shoot even though he didnt have the enough space to do so.
5.As Gio pointed out earlier, in England you have one Manager who is tactic driven(Benitez) and Mou always struggled with him.In italy you have 20 tacticians always searching for a way how to stop you,regardless how destructive they are. And he underestimated them, (Ranieri case).
Last but not least is "MILAN" hopefully we can be the reason he dosnt succeed in Italy. and of course he is the manager of inter, itself is a major reason to fail.:devf::devf:
Excellent post. Pretty much hit the nail on the head. Culturally, Italy and England are very different, and while Mou was a source of entertainment in England and treated as a celebrity, in Italy he's viewed as a professional, and so his obnoxious behaviour is frowned upon.
Tactically, I also agree he's too set in his 4-3-3 ways, and we know (especially at Milan during times when Ancelotti was stuck with a single system) in Italy you have to be able to change things around when needed in matches.
He's an excellent coach and his teams are always dangerous, but up until now he's dropped the ball on many occassions. If he is to succeed in Italy he needs to look to change some of his ways, most notably how he acts (otherwise he'll dig himself into such a deep hole he'll never get out) and his ideas on how to approach opponents.
what do yall think about Rene Adler, Bayer 04 GoalKeeper who won the german goal keeper of the year.
Lebanese
04-11-2008, 12:55
what do yall think about Rene Adler, Bayer 04 GoalKeeper who won the german goal keeper of the year.
Abbiati made so far 5 clean sheets, i wouldn't consider another keeper not before the end of the season, to see an overall evaluation. one more thing our defence is playing good for how long only god knows. i read somewhere that nesta is leaving again to USA just like 2006 that means another 2,3 months . what we need in winter mercato a world class central back . thats our priority Favalli played good but we need safety we need something like nesta, Kaladze is not safe too and il capitano is doing more than what we expected. sendros i dont know if the guy is gonna start sometime soon but from what i saw in arsenal this guy has nothing special .
by the winter break we will be playing 10 games at home that leave us with only 9 games and 10 but luckly the toughest matches will be at home so we need a brand new defence and with the defence we have you can only rotate with zambrotta,janku and antonini.
Dutchie-Milan
04-11-2008, 13:33
Great news guys,i just found out that Santacroce grew up as a big AC Milan fan,so if he leaves Napoli his dreamclub would be.....!!!!!!!!!!!!
Of course the main difference Mourinho hasnt felt untill he came to serie a is that Italian fans dont live for papers and tv shown about Beckham and Mourinho's stupid statemantzs which sound like they have been said by child comparing to what is Carlo saying lately... Mourinho really dissapointed me with his behaviour here.
EPL is, tactically, except 4,5 clubs HORRIBLE! There are clubs out there who are completely unable to adopt the way they play to certain match. There are coaches out there that wouldnt get a licence in Italia. and so on.
Cappello said: " There is no such coach in theworld taht can come to Italy and learn italian coaches somthing, in here everything about football in known."
But I dont agree on Ibra-Drogba: Ibra CAN play with his back on the goal, even better then Drogba. And Ibra is a reason Inter is not 5-6 points behind us.
Still, the difference is tactical approach of other italian coaches, which does not excist in Portugal and England ( except for big 5 which are coached by Ferguson, Benitez, Scolari and Wenger ). The other ones are ridicuious.
If you have time, take a look of a, lets say... Bolton-Wigan and you'll see that there are no tactical variation at all. Strenght is a main carecteristic of EPL, while in serie a its tempo changes and tactical planing.
Forza Milan! :)
Great news guys,i just found out that Santacroce grew up as a big AC Milan fan,so if he leaves Napoli his dreamclub would be.....!!!!!!!!!!!!
Where did you see this?
:hopefull:
I think Serie A is probably more technical than most other leagues, but i think you can make a case for other leagues quite easily. Some of the arguments here are quite weak and very circumstantial.
As for Dutchie-Milan's post about Santacroce being a Milan fan when he was younger, what difference does that make? Raul dreamt of playing for Milan too, doesn't mean they're going to make the move to us.
Giovanni
04-11-2008, 18:33
I think Mourinho's mistakes are several:
- didn't consider that italian media are very different from british ones
- didn't consider that with the huge amount of good homegrown coaches, we would have never liked a coach who claims to be the prophet of football on Earth
- didn't consider that italian society is deeply divided and nervous, so his attitude has been taken very seriously and probably misunderstood by media and fans in general
- didn't consider that 4-3-3 is a typical EPL module, while in Italy it never was successful
- didn't consider that italian coaches of lower teams (some of which he disrespected, like calling Beretta "Barnetta" ) are as tactically prepared as the big ones
On a less serious note, did you guys read what Lo Monaco, Catania's Director, told Mourinho? Firstly he said that Mourinho should be beaten up with a piece of wood, then he declared that he was misunderstood, and that Mourinho should be shut up with concrete in his mouth, but these are just folcloristic sicilian expressions :haha:
Lebanese
04-11-2008, 19:11
Have you guys seen the UCL matches today? inter suffered miserably, Roma played great football and showed everyone out there whats up i hope fiorentina and Juventus get good results tomorrow. and honestly i feel Whole europe miss A.C Milan. we are born to play in UCL but its all good. we are preparing something for all Geeks out there and we are gonna be winners in 2009/2010
yes, Gio, I read that, but that was probably a couple months ago... Still Mourinho finds a way to be more notable during the press conference than on the pitch... and he keeps making enemies... I don't think he will be in Italy for a long time...
Originally posted by giovanni
Everyone who is interested in football market, should tell us not only how to buy players and what players, but, more importantly, how to SELL players.
If you list 5 new players, you should tell us who you are going to sell and for what price, looking at his original price in order to avoid minusvalences.
This is real market, not just a list of fantasy names.
Here is the list players will retire or go next summer: M3,favalli,emerson,oddo,sheva,maybe sendros(depend on his performance,his height and low price will make a bargain). and loan out younsters in our squad for them to get mature.
If nesta is continuously plagued by his back, we should consider bring in Mexes also.
Milan is not a club selling players to meet budget.and I think 60MIl euros is not a huge spending spree for us.Althougth our management prefer 1 major star + some free veterans + some unproven future investment policy in recent years.
Peachtot
04-11-2008, 21:01
I think Serie A is probably more technical than most other leagues, but i think you can make a case for other leagues quite easily. Some of the arguments here are quite weak and very circumstantial.
IMO :
- Serie A : more tactical & strategical
- Premier League : more speedy & powerful
- La Liga : more skillful & technical
Great news guys,i just found out that Santacroce grew up as a big AC Milan fan,so if he leaves Napoli his dreamclub would be.....!!!!!!!!!!!!
Many times, childhood dream and its realisation in the future are two different things. It's good to know that he grew up as a Milanista, but that doesn't necessarily put us in the pole position, not in this modern football with all its economical calculations.
Balotelli is a Milan fan too, at least that's what I read. But will Moratti ever let his wonderkid move to his neighbour cum rival?
and honestly i feel Whole europe miss A.C Milan.
I'm not sure if you're saying that the CL isn't the same without our club or if European fans miss our club. I think both views are quite arrogant (not saying that's how you intended it to sound) and we deserve to be where we are. The only fans that care about our club are our own, fans from other clubs couldn't care less if we're in the CL or not.
In other news, Inzaghi has signed a renewal with us apparently.
kakacmilan best
05-11-2008, 06:36
BREAKING NEWS!!!!
Nesta To Quit Football - Reports
Milan defender Alessandro Nesta could be forced to retire from football at just 32 years of age as a result of on-going injury problems, according to La Stampa...
The Rossoneri stopper has spent more time in the treatment room than on the pitch over the past few seasons with an on-going back problem.
He has missed a number of important games for his side and he may end up missing the rest both this season as well as in the future.
Turin-based newspaper La Stampa claims the former Italian interntional may have no choice but to hang up his boots as a result of his injury.
It is believed Nesta has problem with a slipped disc in his back and he has been allowed to fly back to Miami to see a specialist.
Reports suggest the stopper may even need an operation which could put his career in jeopardy. If Nesta does need the operation then the chances of him returning to the game will be slim.
The Italian has been a great servant to the club ever since joining them from Lazio in 2002.
Milan fans will be hoping the World Cup-winning defender doesn't need surgery so he can return to the pitch sooner rather than later.
----------------------------------------------------
I hope he will be back but we must not count on him!!!!
We sould be a very good CB!
I think we sould buy Zapata or Santacroce in the winter in ant cost!
Peachtot
05-11-2008, 07:05
you cant say on buying a player at any cost in milan.
lately we calculated all economical aspect precisely, even for a player who comes for free, player who comes for treatment and player who comes for practice in short time to regain a place in his NT :D
kakacmilan best
05-11-2008, 07:12
Report saying that Milan have secured ac option on Cigarini!
He will be Milan's player from the summer.
If the reports are right...
http://www.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=949484
Gabriel489
05-11-2008, 07:46
Actually I believe in the Cigarini's rumor as it makes a lot of sense.
So next year, Milan will have Cigarini and Canini(also secured first option) joining.
In other news, Inzaghi has signed a renewal with us apparently.
I might have misread this as it might just be saying he's "refreshed" or "re-energised". There's a bit of an interview on CH4 with Pippo and he talks about targets, winning the Uefa Cup and scoring 300 career goals, so that would lend itself more to a renewal of himself than a renewal of a contract.
ACMILAN1983
05-11-2008, 09:58
I might have misread this as it might just be saying he's "refreshed" or "re-energised". There's a bit of an interview on CH4 with Pippo and he talks about targets, winning the Uefa Cup and scoring 300 career goals, so that would lend itself more to a renewal of himself than a renewal of a contract.
I think he is set to be given another year's renewal Jim of his contract. Apparently Milan have offered him the same as Maldini, they allow him to renew until he's ready to hang up his boots.
Cigarini sounds like an interesting prospect. Alternative to Fabregas, but being Italian I can see us buying him instead of Fabregas.
Not just Italian...I think the main thing is that he's 5000000x cheaper than Fabregas plus already having played in Serie A. Also Fabregas might be too good and bench some of our stars...and we don't want that now do we? :grinser:
p.s. Inzaghi has renewed till 2010...oh my.
Milano84
05-11-2008, 22:19
Not just Italian...I think the main thing is that he's 5000000x cheaper than Fabregas plus already having played in Serie A. Also Fabregas might be too good and bench some of our stars...and we don't want that now do we? :grinser:
different players..... fabregas is better, but cigarini is a more natural fit at DM in say a 4-2-3-1 formation. him +flamini high work rate, technical enough to advance it forward, both r more skilled thnan gattuso or ambrosini.. although neither have the leadership of those 2 (Then again who does)
fabregas is a star though, he is also a good leader, a player to build ur midfield around..... we already have kaka and ronaldinho
Not just Italian...I think the main thing is that he's 5000000x cheaper than Fabregas plus already having played in Serie A. Also Fabregas might be too good and bench some of our stars...and we don't want that now do we? :grinser:
Agreed. Fabregas has a very great skill and a good leadership. But do we want to change the team as a mini Arsenal ?:tong: LOL.. actually I dont think that we need Fabregas here because we already have Kaka and R80. Too many stars being bench isnt a good atmosphere there. And I agreed that we should buy Cigarini. He can be use as Pirlo's replacement if the time comes.
p.s. Inzaghi has renewed till 2010...oh my.
I wouldnt mind considering that Pippo is always consistent to score. Even when he just has little time he could maximize that to a goal /goals. But sure we lose 1 spot for new fresh blood for a striker ^^
p.s. Inzaghi has renewed till 2010...oh my.
Player like Pippo can score even when he's 40. He's not the kind of striker who tirelessly chases the ball, or whose main strenght is his explosiveness, but he's the sneaky one and honestly I've never seen a striker who has an instinct like him. It's true that he often falls down quite easily, misses a sitter, or that he "was born offside" as SAF put it a couple of years ago, but he has a champion mentality, and when it comes down to score goals, I think he's still reliable up until 2010, at least as a supersub (or the first choice for any final :rock3:)
I don't think we need Cigarini soon (next season) as we have been covered pretty well in the central-midfield. As backup for Pirlo we have Emerson (who I suppose still play next year except his contract ends in the end of this season), Seedorf who has played well there this season (note : he played there against big teams like Inter and Napoli), Flamini (something that I haven't seen yet but I do think he can fit there and allow more offensive player beside him) and Cardaccio. Gattuso has played also there and so is Ambrossini.
I prefer that Milan buy a more offensive player as that kind of player something we lack of (for central-midfield not for postion behind striker).
Player like Pippo can score even when he's 40. He's the kind of striker who tirelessly chases the ball, or whose main strenght is his explosiveness, but he's the sneaky one and honestly I've never seen a striker who has an instinct like him. It's true that he often falls down quite easily, misses a sitter, or that he "was born offside" as SAF put it a couple of years ago, but he has a champion mentality, and when it comes down to score goals, I think he's still reliable up until 2010, at least as a supersub (or the first choice for any final :rock3:)
I ONLY hope that he still CAN run next season. :)
I ONLY hope that he still CAN run next season. :)
Provided his life is spared, I'm sure he still can run next season, sometimes a bit too early and being flagged offside, sometimes he'll be running in the sand pit, but on another occasions when he's just fit enough to play he'll give you his 100% and the next thing you know is . . . :p283:
Just ask Pepe Reina if you don't believe me :hmmm:
Never seen Cigarini at all this season. But considering Gorky's display lately and the possibility of his return, there'll be so little (if any) space for him next season. Personally, I'd rather take Paloschi back and add another CB
Originally posted by siregar
I don't think we need Cigarini soon (next season) as we have been covered pretty well in the central-midfield. As backup for Pirlo we have Emerson (who I suppose still play next year except his contract ends in the end of this season), Seedorf who has played well there this season (note : he played there against big teams like Inter and Napoli), Flamini (something that I haven't seen yet but I do think he can fit there and allow more offensive player beside him) and Cardaccio. Gattuso has played also there and so is Ambrossini.
I prefer that Milan buy a more offensive player as that kind of player something we lack of (for central-midfield not for postion behind striker).
Cigarini is a good choice. he is italian football proven,and our defensive midfield is ageing(except flamini),It's time bring young promising guns to get playing minutes with our veterans.Maybe emerson and cardaccio(looks like his debut never gonna to come) could make room for him.
As for offensive mid player you mentioned, we can have gorky back to play that role.
I think it's too early for Paloschi to come to Milan. Let him grow and develope for more years. He is still very young and need tons of games. I prefer that he come to Milan in next 2-3 years.
Kalstroem6
06-11-2008, 05:06
Cigarini would be awesome,i wish we can offload Cardaccio and Emerson for both Gourcuff and Cigarini.from our last game with them,he really looked amazing,Organized the Atalanta midfield well and played the players and made them better,i still remember our 3 players can manage to steal the ball from him.
Then i really would like to see a FB who can add more competition to Marek Jankulovski,Zhirkov is weak on defence but with the players like Maldini and coachs like Tasotti he can impove on defence,but in a league like Serie A,Zhirkov is what we asked for,he is a player who can make very good offensive contribution to us.
Mexes is my 3rd choice after Santacroce and Zapata,like i said before,maybe we should sign 2 CB and both of Zapata and Santacroce,Next year we'll have CL and in the case Nesta's retirerent claims,we had better to sign 2,also considering Maldini will retire next year.Favalli as well.All Milan CBs depents on Bonera and Kaladze,its so early to talk about Senderos,so we all dont know what his future will be,a big question mark so far,also considering Kaladze's injury rate in the last 2 years,2 world class CB is a must.
hope Sheva find his self again and we wont need to spend for a striker.
Peachtot
06-11-2008, 05:25
i dare to say that sheva will decrease in performance more & more. i didnt see the same enthusiasm Dinho has on sheva case to revive. For me, his loan wont be extended by management and that will be best decision for us :)
I hope it was a loan move not permanent move.
i dare to say that sheva will decrease in performance more & more. i didnt see the same enthusiasm Dinho has on sheva case to revive. For me, his loan wont be extended by management and that will be best decision for us :)
Yes, I agree! :)
Pippo just needs to score few more in UEFA and then Galliani will be able to say:" we have prolonged a contract with the best European scorer of all times, now noone can catch him...he will play untill 2020!)
Kidding, Pippo is a true legend, Im happy for his renewal. $heva is the one we need to replace.
I dont see Cigarini playing in Milan EXCEOPt if we sell Gourcuff and dont prolong Emerson contact. But Gourcuff and Cigarini are two different player completely. We need a player that is able to play CM and go forward, as Clarence can/could, and Yoan can ( as far as I can see this year ).
But Cigarini is super talented player for sure! Maybe he'll do another year with torino, Reggina, Atalanta-who knows.
And, Thiago Silva has 95% joined Intermerda... :(
I hope it was a loan move not permanent move.
Sheva's transfer was a permanent deal. We're stuck with him. All we can do is hope he finds his scoring boots.
Sheva's transfer was a permanent deal. We're stuck with him. All we can do is hope he finds his scoring boots.
Nope, no one knows what kind of contract Milan did for Sheva except Milan and Chelsea boards.
Nope, no one knows what kind of contract Milan did for Sheva except Milan and Chelsea boards.
if he keep going on like this, I don't think Chelsea wants him back.
I do hope he scores some more for Milan.
Bout Cigarini... why not buy him now n loan him to others... that way, if he do turn into a helluva player, we don't have to spend crazy amount of cash...
Nope, no one knows what kind of contract Milan did for Sheva except Milan and Chelsea boards.
When he came to milan the official site said something like this:
"Milan have bought Andrij Shevchenko on a permanent basis. The terms of the transfer are undisclosed."
When he came to milan the official site said something like this:
"Milan have bought Andrij Shevchenko on a permanent basis. The terms of the transfer are undisclosed."
No, I didn't read anything like that. The aggreement was confidential.
Than we must agree to disagree:D
Absolutely, as you can't proove anything for your statement saying that the Sheva came on permanent basis.
ACMILAN1983
06-11-2008, 08:00
I dont see Cigarini playing in Milan EXCEOPt if we sell Gourcuff and dont prolong Emerson contact. But Gourcuff and Cigarini are two different player completely. We need a player that is able to play CM and go forward, as Clarence can/could, and Yoan can ( as far as I can see this year ).
But Cigarini is super talented player for sure! Maybe he'll do another year with torino, Reggina, Atalanta-who knows.
And, Thiago Silva has 95% joined Intermerda... :(
I don't see why Cigarini and Gourcuff will have problems for space in our squad, they're two very different players, a point you've made yourself. Pirlo, Emerson and possibly to a lesser degree Seedorf are the biggest opposition to Cigarini getting a spot in the deep lying playmaker/distributor role.
For Gourcuff, Seedorf, Ambro and Flamini are the most likely players to possibly get in his way of a first team spot, for that midfield role you described (although it was more LM than CM). Realistically, only Seedorf and Ambro will challenge Gourcuff for the role, as Flamini is Rino's understudy.
Cigarini (or Fabregas, depending on who the newspapers decide to say) would be a good purchase for us. We're clearly building the future based on a similar mould we already have in place. Flamini will be Gattuso's natural successor and Gourcuff can replace Seedorf, meaning one of Cigarini or Fabregas would naturally fill Pirlo's role.
Do you guys think we need more than 1 new midfielder for next season. We are already overloaded and at the moment Pirlo and Cardacio are no where near the list of realistic starters.
If we say Milan will start with one striker then that leaves 5 positions for the midfielders.
2 0f those positions will be taken by Kaka and Pato/Ronnie
This leaves 3 positions for Pirlo, Seedorf, Flamini, Rino, Ambrosini and Emerson.
We can add Gourcuff to that, but realistically he is better off staying an extra year on loan to develop further or to another Seria A team. It would be wise to send Cardacio to the same team so they can forge an understanding for their future at Milan.
Milano84
06-11-2008, 12:41
if he keep going on like this, I don't think Chelsea wants him back.
I do hope he scores some more for Milan.
Bout Cigarini... why not buy him now n loan him to others... that way, if he do turn into a helluva player, we don't have to spend crazy amount of cash...
cigarini is co-owned by atalanta and parma. Parma sold 50% of cigarini and dessena's (to sampdoria) rights because they r too good to play serie B, or did not want to.
it would surprise me if we swapped paloschi for cigarini.
as for space in squad.... we could play a 4-4-2 at times.... with a midfield line of......
--gourcuff--cigarini--flamini--abate--
all those players are under 25. Gourcuff, cigarini are 22, and abate is almost 22.
personally i'd rather bring cigarini into squad, dump emerson, loan out cardaccio. but i have a feeling we'll keep emo.
as for space in squad.... we could play a 4-4-2 at times.... with a midfield line of......
--gourcuff--cigarini--flamini--abate--
Would you really field this midfield? Ancelotti wouldnt ever consider it, not if we aim to compete for the scudetto. Our history has shown that the so called smaller teams cant be underestimated.
Milano84
06-11-2008, 13:51
Would you really field this midfield? Ancelotti wouldnt ever consider it, not if we aim to compete for the scudetto. Our history has shown that the so called smaller teams cant be underestimated.
--zambrotta--nesta--bonera--antonini--
--gourcuff--cigarini--flamini--abate--
----------kaka--------------------
--------------borriello-------------
i'd be completely comfy w/ that or 4-2-3-1 w/ r80 in center or whatever.
^ You're sure you're not mistaking Milan for Roma?
I don't see why Cigarini and Gourcuff will have problems for space in our squad, they're two very different players, a point you've made yourself. Pirlo, Emerson and possibly to a lesser degree Seedorf are the biggest opposition to Cigarini getting a spot in the deep lying playmaker/distributor role.
Pirlo is our main playmaker, a player that, if fit, misses out on every 8th game in Milan. There are Gattuso, Ambrosini, and Flamini.
If Emerson goes away, and Milan birngs Yoan back ANd Seedorf will for sure be here, we will have 6 players capable of playing central midfield, plus 2 players that are most likely to play all of the games Kaka' and Dinho. That is 8 players that would be in front of Cigarini.
For a player that is a main motor of italia U21 and, by my standards, a great palyer, this is not acceptable situation.
For Milan, its great to have so mayn midfielders, but aldough Yoan and Cigarini are not similar, thay would both fight for CM spot, with Pirlo ,ambro, Flamini, Rino...
to play 15 games a year for Cigarini is not enouigh. And he will not play more in our possible squad for next year.
Even if I really like this player, I have to say Milan dosnt need him right now, but in the future. He can play some great football in serie a one more year. Gourcuff, with his caracteristic, is a player that Milan needs more as he is capable of playing more forward then Cigarini.
--zambrotta--nesta--bonera--antonini--
--gourcuff--cigarini--flamini--abate--
----------kaka--------------------
--------------borriello-------------
i'd be completely comfy w/ that or 4-2-3-1 w/ r80 in center or whatever.
Well I respect your opinion, but cant say I agree. That looks like the midfield of a mid table seria A team.
ACMILAN1983
06-11-2008, 15:47
Pirlo is our main playmaker, a player that, if fit, misses out on every 8th game in Milan. There are Gattuso, Ambrosini, and Flamini.
If Emerson goes away, and Milan birngs Yoan back ANd Seedorf will for sure be here, we will have 6 players capable of playing central midfield, plus 2 players that are most likely to play all of the games Kaka' and Dinho. That is 8 players that would be in front of Cigarini.
For a player that is a main motor of italia U21 and, by my standards, a great palyer, this is not acceptable situation.
For Milan, its great to have so mayn midfielders, but aldough Yoan and Cigarini are not similar, thay would both fight for CM spot, with Pirlo ,ambro, Flamini, Rino...
to play 15 games a year for Cigarini is not enouigh. And he will not play more in our possible squad for next year.
Even if I really like this player, I have to say Milan dosnt need him right now, but in the future. He can play some great football in serie a one more year. Gourcuff, with his caracteristic, is a player that Milan needs more as he is capable of playing more forward then Cigarini.
I understand your point and to some degree I agree. Cigarini would struggle to find space as we have a packed midfield. However, that wasn't my point, my point was merely I don't see Gourcuff really affecting Cigarini's spot in the squad, because of their different roles, meaning they're not in direct competition for places.
On the other hand, whoever we buy for midfield has the same issue. We have a very strong, albeit slightly ageing midfield. Anyone we look to get for midfield is going to face a lot of competition. If Cigarini's ready then he should come and be prepared for some bench time. If he's good enough to play, he will do. Gourcuff has and will face the same situation, we just need to hope he's matured now. That's a problem when playing for a club like Milan, you need to be a great player.
I understand your point and to some degree I agree. Cigarini would struggle to find space as we have a packed midfield. However, that wasn't my point, my point was merely I don't see Gourcuff really affecting Cigarini's spot in the squad, because of their different roles, meaning they're not in direct competition for places.
On the other hand, whoever we buy for midfield has the same issue. We have a very strong, albeit slightly ageing midfield. Anyone we look to get for midfield is going to face a lot of competition. If Cigarini's ready then he should come and be prepared for some bench time. If he's good enough to play, he will do. Gourcuff has and will face the same situation, we just need to hope he's matured now. That's a problem when playing for a club like Milan, you need to be a great player.
Yep, just like Favalli :devf:
Milano84
06-11-2008, 19:13
Well I respect your opinion, but cant say I agree. That looks like the midfield of a mid table seria A team.
with all due respect, flamini could walk into an club in world and start. and he should start for milan accept carlo favors ambrosini. Now i love ambrosini, but flamini is more talented.
gourcuff is the centerpeice of the french national team. And i think cigarini can contribute to any midfield in serie A too... Perhaps its early to recall abate.
but eitherway when do we ever take all 11 starts out.... in a realistic sense, cigarini can replace emerson. gourcuff...seedorf.
Milano84
06-11-2008, 19:19
Pirlo is our main playmaker, a player that, if fit, misses out on every 8th game in Milan. There are Gattuso, Ambrosini, and Flamini.
If Emerson goes away, and Milan birngs Yoan back ANd Seedorf will for sure be here, we will have 6 players capable of playing central midfield, plus 2 players that are most likely to play all of the games Kaka' and Dinho. That is 8 players that would be in front of Cigarini.
For a player that is a main motor of italia U21 and, by my standards, a great palyer, this is not acceptable situation.
For Milan, its great to have so mayn midfielders, but aldough Yoan and Cigarini are not similar, thay would both fight for CM spot, with Pirlo ,ambro, Flamini, Rino...
to play 15 games a year for Cigarini is not enouigh. And he will not play more in our possible squad for next year.
Even if I really like this player, I have to say Milan dosnt need him right now, but in the future. He can play some great football in serie a one more year. Gourcuff, with his caracteristic, is a player that Milan needs more as he is capable of playing more forward then Cigarini.
if emerson leaves i think cigarini is a must. That would leave gattuso, ambrosini and flamini as only DM's..... carlo likes to play with 2. I dont necessaril mind it if 1 is more technical, which cigarini would be. Gourcuff is a player who could replace pirlo, kaka or R80. Both are too talented, and i dont want to see milan let go of gourcuff or pass on cigarini.
Originally posted by milano84
if emerson leaves i think cigarini is a must. That would leave gattuso, ambrosini and flamini as only DM's..... carlo likes to play with 2. I dont necessaril mind it if 1 is more technical, which cigarini would be. Gourcuff is a player who could replace pirlo, kaka or R80. Both are too talented, and i dont want to see milan let go of gourcuff or pass on cigarini.
Agree! We can use 2 skillful defensive midplayers more offen especially when facing teams like Lecce. Fabregas is too expensive, there is no emergency need for him,and I think gorky is almost(if not equally yet) the same level.
We can use that money on defence and power center department. 1 center back will come for centain.I think the next prority is a quality wingback;I'm not against Antonini,I like his tactic wisdom,work ethic,patience on the bench,all attributes make him a super team guy. but I think He should better be the 4th guy on wingbacks.Zhirkov is the name match that quality and I think for him mentality play for a big club and blend in another culture is the only concern.By the way, zambrotta and janku both make 32 next summer.
The other need is power center, everytime I watch games like last night force me thinking that way,unless we can play seamlessly on a regulr basis( remind me the fashion we play last time we won serieA,which means we definitely have that potential under carlo's system) like barcelona.
Milano84
06-11-2008, 22:33
Well I respect your opinion, but cant say I agree. That looks like the midfield of a mid table seria A team.
da court, stankovic, jimenez, muntari
pizzaro, brighi, cassetti, menez
marcisio, c. zanetti, marchionni, giovinco
almiron, jorgensen, santana,,,
these are the backup midfields for last years top 4.... i'd argue all 4 players i listed in my midfield r better than all these players....
If he's good enough to play, he will do. Gourcuff has and will face the same situation, we just need to hope he's matured now. That's a problem when playing for a club like Milan, you need to be a great player.
This part what the most important thing IMO. The difference between Cigarini and Fabregas is that Cigarini will find it very difficult to have chance to play especiall when Emerson still play for Milan next season. Cigarini is in my opinion is not yet a mature player (great player) who can step in and substitute Ambrosini.
Carlo, as someone mentioned, will always favor Ambrosini because he is very experienced player and has advantage with his physical condition plus his leadership (vice captain of Milan, next year should be our captain). We can look it now, it's still difficult for Flamini to find space regularly in Serie A even he is prepared to be Gattuso' successor but with his ability he should easily move Ambrosini to the bench.
The best option if we want to have Cigarini in the coming years is buying his contract and let him play in other Serie A club.
, my point was merely I don't see Gourcuff really affecting Cigarini's spot in the squad, because of their different roles, meaning they're not in direct competition for places.
I understood you from the beginning :) We just misunderstood ourselves.
gourcuff and Cigarini would not step in eachg outers way inMilan. But Ancelotti will not have 8 midfielders in oneseason: Cigarini, Gattuso, Ambrosini, Flamini, Seedorf, Gourcuff, Kaka', Ronaldinho.
Maybe Milan realised that Gourcuff will not come aback and Bordoux wiull use the contract and pay for him, so we went for Cigarini. somehow i dont find that a better solution for us as 4 DM's we have are enough.
If Emerson leaves Cigarini can come, no other way.
Gourcuff can come in any case.
da court, stankovic, jimenez, muntari
pizzaro, brighi, cassetti, menez
marcisio, c. zanetti, marchionni, giovinco
almiron, jorgensen, santana,,,
these are the backup midfields for last years top 4.... i'd argue all 4 players i listed in my midfield r better than all these players....
Yes, but you as you mentioned these are the backup midfielders, while the players you mentioned are supposed to be our starters.
As I said in my recent post -which you chose to ignore-, you are confusing Milan with Roma. The line-up you are suggesting would struggle to even clinch a Uefa Cup spot.
Also, it's of no use comparing us to Roma, Juventus, and Fiorentina. The only team we should be compared to is Inter, our title rivals.
da court, stankovic, jimenez, muntari
pizzaro, brighi, cassetti, menez
marcisio, c. zanetti, marchionni, giovinco
almiron, jorgensen, santana,,,
these are the backup midfields for last years top 4.... i'd argue all 4 players i listed in my midfield r better than all these players....
But we are not talking about backups, we are talking about a team that can start. How many of these backup combinations you give actually all started together?
Gourcuff by no means is the centre piece of France. Yes he has played well recently, but how many games has he actually played. We can call him a centre piece if he plays for the next year, plays well and play is centred around him.
Cigarini may well replace Emerson who until recently was limited to subsititue appearances. Ancelotti sees Emerson and he sees experience, reliability, closing a game. Cigarini doesnt offer the same attributes. Hence Cardacio not getting a chance despite good reports.
The fact is Milan is rich in the midfield department. We need a goalkeeper and a centreback or two desperately.
Also, it's of no use comparing us to Roma, Juventus, and Fiorentina. The only team we should be compared to is Inter, our title rivals.
This is so spot on. When Juve got relegated, I was upset because I knew the league and therefore our standard would go down. We then finished below Fiorentina which should never have happened.
I agree we shouldnt compare our selves to the majority of Italian teams, but I would go further and say any Italian teams. Afterall, they are awful in Europe. We should be competing with Barca, Real, Chelsea and Man United. We were already doing this, but we were forgetting the squad we needed for Seria A which is the ONLY reason inter won something after so many years.
Kalstroem6
07-11-2008, 08:01
Cigarini is someone you want in the squad,someone who can organize the midfield and makes the players better around him,a leader.you say Emerson?Emerson is not natural back up of Pirlo?he is just 3rd or 4th choice for DM,if he is Pirlo's back up,Where is Emerson?Pirlo is injured for a long time but since then Emerson featured little.sometimes we have to play with 3 hard DM's cuz we have not a player like Cigarini.
im so pessimistci on Gourcuff like i said before,as he will never give up fielding Ambrosini,we'll lose him once more,if we really have to stick with someone who can add physical strength and arial ability to midfield,why not we try for someone like Diaby or Rakitic?someone who can be an alternative to Ambrosini,at least more competitive LCM posiiton.
By the way,Honeess declared that us,inter and Juve wants Bastian Schweinsteiger who is free agent for next season.
What do you think about him?
ACMILAN1983
07-11-2008, 08:11
I understood you from the beginning :) We just misunderstood ourselves.
gourcuff and Cigarini would not step in eachg outers way inMilan. But Ancelotti will not have 8 midfielders in oneseason: Cigarini, Gattuso, Ambrosini, Flamini, Seedorf, Gourcuff, Kaka', Ronaldinho.
Maybe Milan realised that Gourcuff will not come aback and Bordoux wiull use the contract and pay for him, so we went for Cigarini. somehow i dont find that a better solution for us as 4 DM's we have are enough.
If Emerson leaves Cigarini can come, no other way.
Gourcuff can come in any case.
Agreed. Emerson is the difference for me as to us getting Cigarini, as Cigarini would essentially be looking to take Puma's place (which is as backup to Pirlo) in the squad.
We're in a strange and similar position to what we were in a few years ago with the defence. The midfield is strong (like the defence was), but it's ageing (Emo, Rino, Ambro, Seedorf all on the wrong side of 30) and although younger talents are available, it's hard to find space for them.
If there's space for Gourcuff and Cigarini (and they're mature enough to play for Milan), then I see no reason to bring them in to compete with Seeforf, Pirlo and Ambro. However, it doesn't seem like there is much space for this and possibly next season, so I'd probably consider a loan away (someone mentioned this idea already).
Milano84
07-11-2008, 12:40
Yes, but you as you mentioned these are the backup midfielders, while the players you mentioned are supposed to be our starters.
As I said in my recent post -which you chose to ignore-, you are confusing Milan with Roma. The line-up you are suggesting would struggle to even clinch a Uefa Cup spot.
Also, it's of no use comparing us to Roma, Juventus, and Fiorentina. The only team we should be compared to is Inter, our title rivals.
ah... i meant as backup midfield.... i might have been unclear. My point is any of those 4 players.... i'd be fairly comfortable subbing in... for example ambro sits a game... cigarini goes in..... gourcuff for pirlo etc etc. I'm not proposing a drastic drop of all our midfielders, lol
also K77SH C, valid point on starting together.... i guess i was just trying to say, i'd prefer to have cigarini, abate, gourcuff in midfield rotation than emerson, brocchi (RIP), even seedorf.
if you go back 7 or so years.... gattuso, pirlo, ambrosini were getting run outs at that same age. None were permanent starters, but all saw the field consistant enough. I think we could do same now, and benefit from it long term.
This is so spot on. When Juve got relegated, I was upset because I knew the league and therefore our standard would go down. We then finished below Fiorentina which should never have happened.
I agree we shouldnt compare our selves to the majority of Italian teams, but I would go further and say any Italian teams. Afterall, they are awful in Europe. We should be competing with Barca, Real, Chelsea and Man United. We were already doing this, but we were forgetting the squad we needed for Seria A which is the ONLY reason inter won something after so many years.
I totally agree. But we have deteriorated rapidly over the last couple of seasons, and lost our level. So now we have to try and catch up with Inter -which we'll hopefully do this season-, then we can speak about competing with Europe's best and beating them once again.
ah... i meant as backup midfield.... i might have been unclear. My point is any of those 4 players.... i'd be fairly comfortable subbing in... for example ambro sits a game... cigarini goes in..... gourcuff for pirlo etc etc. I'm not proposing a drastic drop of all our midfielders, lol
also K77SH C, valid point on starting together.... i guess i was just trying to say, i'd prefer to have cigarini, abate, gourcuff in midfield rotation than emerson, brocchi (RIP), even seedorf.
if you go back 7 or so years.... gattuso, pirlo, ambrosini were getting run outs at that same age. None were permanent starters, but all saw the field consistant enough. I think we could do same now, and benefit from it long term.
This definitely clears things up a bit. I think we all agree that Emerson has to go next season, but I rather give Caradicio a shot than re-call Abate, or sign Cigarini, who I haven't seen much of them both to judge them. But Caradicio is already a superstar in the making, who is expected to fill in Pirlo's boots, and become a hero for us for many years to come ala Kaka.
As for Gourcuff, I don't really know. I think none of us can say anything now. I believe no one wouldn't want him back, but it remains to be seen weather Bourdeux will pay the 15M for him or no. We all hope they won't, but it isn't in our hands now; so all we can do is wait till summer.
Though, I believe if Gourcuff comes Seedorf has to go. Gourcuff would have to get decent playing time, and with Kaka, Ronaldinho, and Seedorf, Gourcuff wouldn't touch the pitch. Either Gourcuff will return next season, and Seedorf to be sold to Ajax; or Bourdeux will splash the cash for Gourcuff, and we'll see Seedorf in red & black till he hangs up his boots.
Milano84
07-11-2008, 13:57
This definitely clears things up a bit. I think we all agree that Emerson has to go next season, but I rather give Caradicio a shot than re-call Abate, or sign Cigarini, who I haven't seen much of them both to judge them. But Caradicio is already a superstar in the making, who is expected to fill in Pirlo's boots, and become a hero for us for many years to come ala Kaka.
i dont really know that cardaccio is a star in the making.... i really havent seen him. he looks talented, but carlo wont give him a run in uefa or serie A so that cant be positive. Even gourcuff got more chances...he would probably benefit for a loan.
i also think its unfair to compare him to kaka.... kaka won bolo de oro in south america and was well known there. Cardaccio is still relatively unknown, not saying huge talents r all known but different situation...
The reason i say recall abate is because hes showing wat he can do at torino, and he gives us another element, he's kind of a winger like serginho (only on right) that could be a new element to use, as opposed to cardaccio who sits behind many players in pecking order
i dont really know that cardaccio is a star in the making.... i really havent seen him. he looks talented, but carlo wont give him a run in uefa or serie A so that cant be positive. Even gourcuff got more chances...he would probably benefit for a loan.
i also think its unfair to compare him to kaka.... kaka won bolo de oro in south america and was well known there. Cardaccio is still relatively unknown, not saying huge talents r all known but different situation...
There's a reason that Barcelona, Juventus, Roma, Lazio, Udinese, Valencia, and Atletico Madrid all wanted Cardacio. He is not played in the Uefa Cup because he's not registered. He's still 21, give him a break. Also, Carlo was the one that asked for us to sign him, so he definitely supports the kid.
I just want to comment on Rakitic, coz someone mentioned him for LMC position. He is very talented plaer, but by all means not ready for serie a and MILAN. he lacks phisical presence on the field and cannot play instead of Ambrosini as someone mentioned. Gourcuff is right now far more powerfull player then Rakitic, aldough Rakitic has a really bringh future, he is only 20.
And we all know Carlo will not bench Ambro to play Gourcuff, and that Seedorf will not leave so... who knows what will happen. Even if none in midfield arrives we would be ok. Our defence is the problem.
also K77SH C, valid point on starting together.... i guess i was just trying to say, i'd prefer to have cigarini, abate, gourcuff in midfield rotation than emerson, brocchi (RIP), even seedorf.
if you go back 7 or so years.... gattuso, pirlo, ambrosini were getting run outs at that same age. None were permanent starters, but all saw the field consistant enough. I think we could do same now, and benefit from it long term.
Surely you are not saying Seedorf shouldnt be playing for Milan?
Gatusso like any young player had to wait for his chance and he took it. The advantage he had was that Milan didnt have anywhere near the quality we do now and Albertini was being carried by the rest of the team.
Ambro has been a regular for years, he just never managed to stay fit.
Pirlo didnt give Carlo the option of keeping him as a sub for very long, but players like him dont come along everyday. He is just a pure winner and when he wins he is central to the success.
we all know what we want. We want players like emerson to go and players like Cardaccio and Gourcuff to be given chances.
At some point we are going to have to realise that Milan has its ways. We wont give up Emerson at the end of the season because he still provides guarantees for Carlo. And young players will have to be phenominal like Kaka, Pirlo and Pato were. Otherwise they are better off being sent on loan.
That leaves the question - When to bring them back???
One thing that concerns me is that Milan is in love with midfielders. In recent years we have signed more midfielders than some entire leagues when you consider players like Vogel, Dhorosoo etc. At the moment we have a rich midfield and yes some are geting older. But the answer isnt to spen 20 million on 5 mediocre players who will fail to be good backup. When the time comes we should spend that 20 million on a world class player if and only if our youh projects dont succeed.
How much has Milan spent on mdeicore players, just look at the defence - Favalli, Pancaro, Bonera, Senderos, Oddo. These 5 players have not solved any of our problems and surely all of their wages and fees added up would have given us a Zapatta (So what if we had to add some extra money).
So question, are we falling into the same trap as Galliani and worrying about signing midfielders when priority number 1 is the defence. Iv said it before and Il say it again, as a self respecting Milan fan who has grown up watching Baresi and Maldini I feel ashamed of the Milan defence I see now. Saccaronte (Spelling) was born to be an heir to Maldini!!
I understand what you are saying K77SH C.
But at the same time you are being unfare to some of the players you mentioned. Although I know what you mean and maybe you just put them there as an example.......but...
-Favalli and Pancaro came for free.
-Pancaro as a matter of fact was great on the left and people can say whatever they want......but his crosses were great, and a lot better then Janku's. He was a solid player and showed that age sometimes shouldn't be a factor.
-Favalli didn't exactly reach the same "hights" as Pancaro but he also came free and has filled in decently over the past few years. Yes there might have been better options at times to sign but I doubt Carlo would keep playing him if he thought he can't offer anything to the squad.
-Bonera came for a very low fee of something like 4.5/5 mil euro. And for that kind of money, if you ask me he has been fenomenal.
-We are yet to see Senderos.......but I think it was a rushed decision by the management but then again there isn't any huge risks as he is only loaned. I did read somewhere that we payed 2 mil to loan him but who knows, we might get our money worth. It's been a little unfortunate that he's been injured.
-Oddo is the only one that I would call a total miss. He just never was the same player that he was in Lazio. But if Bayern keeps him they might actually give up some good money. They seem to value him a lot.
we all know what we want. We want players like emerson to go and players like Cardaccio and Gourcuff to be given chances.
At some point we are going to have to realise that Milan has its ways. We wont give up Emerson at the end of the season because he still provides guarantees for Carlo. And young players will have to be phenominal like Kaka, Pirlo and Pato were. Otherwise they are better off being sent on loan.
That leaves the question - When to bring them back???
One thing that concerns me is that Milan is in love with midfielders. In recent years we have signed more midfielders than some entire leagues when you consider players like Vogel, Dhorosoo etc. At the moment we have a rich midfield and yes some are geting older. But the answer isnt to spen 20 million on 5 mediocre players who will fail to be good backup. When the time comes we should spend that 20 million on a world class player if and only if our youh projects dont succeed.
How much has Milan spent on mdeicore players, just look at the defence - Favalli, Pancaro, Bonera, Senderos, Oddo. These 5 players have not solved any of our problems and surely all of their wages and fees added up would have given us a Zapatta (So what if we had to add some extra money).
So question, are we falling into the same trap as Galliani and worrying about signing midfielders when priority number 1 is the defence. Iv said it before and Il say it again, as a self respecting Milan fan who has grown up watching Baresi and Maldini I feel ashamed of the Milan defence I see now. Saccaronte (Spelling) was born to be an heir to Maldini!!
I see what you are at, but if we don't replace our midfielders they will soon all retire at once. I agree that we have been buying a lot of midfielders recently, but none of them managed to break into the first team. Pirlo, Gattuso, Ambrosini, Seedorf, and Kaka have been our main midfielders for too long now. Players like Vogel, Dhorasoo, Brocchi, Emerson, and even Gourcuff have all been part-timers at Milanello. No midfielder that we have signed, except maybe Ronaldinho and Flamini now, has proved to be better than our existing midfield and that's why our starting midfield player haven't changed in more than 5 years.
But, we have to keep on buying midfielders. Because if we don't, probably in 2 or 3 years all of our midfield, except Kaka and 'Dinho, will be retired. So, what our management is trying to do, is to buy young talented midfielders, who can soon enough break into the first team in order to fill in Pirlo's or Rino's or Ambro's shoes. Flamini was a start, hopefully many will follow.
I understand what you are saying K77SH C.
But at the same time you are being unfare to some of the players you mentioned. Although I know what you mean and maybe you just put them there as an example.......but...
-Favalli and Pancaro came for free.
-Pancaro as a matter of fact was great on the left and people can say whatever they want......but his crosses were great, and a lot better then Janku's. He was a solid player and showed that age sometimes shouldn't be a factor.
-Favalli didn't exactly reach the same "hights" as Pancaro but he also came free and has filled in decently over the past few years. Yes there might have been better options at times to sign but I doubt Carlo would keep playing him if he thought he can't offer anything to the squad.
-Bonera came for a very low fee of something like 4.5/5 mil euro. And for that kind of money, if you ask me he has been fenomenal.
-We are yet to see Senderos.......but I think it was a rushed decision by the management but then again there isn't any huge risks as he is only loaned. I did read somewhere that we payed 2 mil to loan him but who knows, we might get our money worth. It's been a little unfortunate that he's been injured.
-Oddo is the only one that I would call a total miss. He just never was the same player that he was in Lazio. But if Bayern keeps him they might actually give up some good money. They seem to value him a lot.
Indeed you reminded me that Pancaro was great in his first season, but fell off after that and overall Janku has been a much better player.
Bonera was cheap and is very good backup, but then why sign Senderos who having watched British pundits slaughter him week in week out isnt good enough to be anything more than backup. Besides its fine having backup, but not if they dont have anyone to backup.
Lets just say they all came for free. Senderos is on lets say 3 million, so far Bonera has taken roughly 6 million for two season, as has Favalli and lets not even include Pancaro as he was earlier.
That is 15 million for players who are not good enough to relegate Kaladze to the bench despite his dreadful form. Surely this money give or take some more could have gotten us a defender we can count on as a regular. Like I said, Iv grown up watching the legends of Milan. We have replaced the Van Bastens with players like Pato, we have replaced the Dejans with players like Kaka and Pirlo, but when will we replace Baresi, Maldini, Costacurta and Nesta soon?
I see what you are at, but if we don't replace our midfielders they will soon all retire at once. I agree that we have been buying a lot of midfielders recently, but none of them managed to break into the first team. Pirlo, Gattuso, Ambrosini, Seedorf, and Kaka have been our main midfielders for too long now. Players like Vogel, Dhorasoo, Brocchi, Emerson, and even Gourcuff have all been part-timers at Milanello. No midfielder that we have signed, except maybe Ronaldinho and Flamini now, has proved to be better than our existing midfield and that's why our starting midfield player haven't changed in more than 5 years.
But, we have to keep on buying midfielders. Because if we don't, probably in 2 or 3 years all of our midfield, except Kaka and 'Dinho, will be retired. So, what our management is trying to do, is to buy young talented midfielders, who can soon enough break into the first team in order to fill in Pirlo's or Rino's or Ambro's shoes. Flamini was a start, hopefully many will follow.
I agree we cant be complacent, but the midfiled is covered for the next 2 seasons. One amazing midfielder in the summer would make all the difference.
The defence however needs a player yesterday.
Ancelotti: Milan aren't lucky
Saturday 8 November, 2008
Carlo Ancelotti insists Milan’s recent last-gasp victories have more to do with tactics than luck, while he deals with yet more injuries.
His side are top of the Serie A standings and leading their UEFA Cup group as well following late winners over Atalanta, Napoli and Sporting Braga.
“It is true we won those games thanks to a little bit of luck, but we certainly do not owe our position to good fortune,” explained the Coach.
“Don’t forget we beat Napoli at the end, but had the chances to easily do so earlier. I think as a team we are able to take control more towards the end of matches, when the opponent tends to loosen the marking a little and space opens up for us.”
Milan pay visit to Lecce’s Stadio Via del Mare on Sunday evening, an arena where they have not always thrived.
“Lecce are well-organised with a good defence and I think they will maintain their characteristics even though they are facing a side like Milan.
“We have always run into problems away to Lecce, but then again we said the same of Atalanta, so we hope to have similar good fortune here too.”
Last weekend the Rossoneri climbed to the top of the Serie A table for the first time since May 16, 2004.
“Clearly if we win every game now, then we will take the Scudetto, but we cannot make this kind of calculation now,” warned the tactician.
“We are not interested in being the ‘anti-Inter’ team. All we want is to play well and win the title, so Inter are merely one of several sides who will fight with us to the end.”
Massimo Ambrosini and Philippe Senderos have been added to the injury list along with Paolo Maldini, Alessandro Nesta and Andrea Pirlo.
“Senderos has not fully recovered yet, but he is fine. Ambrosini has a calf problem, though these two and Maldini will be back next week.
“Nesta is in America and when he is better, he will return. I hope he can recover, as that is the most important – the only important – thing.”
Nesta has been struggling with a recurring back problem for several years and flew to Miami for specialist treatment this week amid fears his career is over.
-----------------------
This backs up my fears for the defence. Senderos is 21, but at the moment seems as reliable as a 31 year old. Far worse, Nesta seems in big trouble.
Lebanese
08-11-2008, 15:14
How much has Milan spent on mdeicore players, just look at the defence - Favalli, Pancaro, Bonera, Senderos, Oddo. These 5 players have not solved any of our problems and surely all of their wages and fees added up would have given us a Zapatta (So what if we had to add some extra money).
Bonera Aint a medicore player and will never be. bonera is the reason u have a solid defence and 5 clean sheets. bonera was delivering more than expected and when bonera was at santacrocce's age he was considered a great talent, there were Gambrini, Bellini, Barzaghli and bonera that were considered as italy future defence and honestly i see bonera as the best of them as he did not get 7 matches in a raw. and now after he got that we all feel safer. he is not making the stupid mistakes because he got the confidence. on the other hand how come u judge on senderos from one match, this guy has not played in ages and come on he just need time to adapt to the team on the field not mentioning the league and the tactics .... etc. i know senderos was far from a good performance but we all saw a promise in this guy, he is a killer on 1 vs. 1 situation far more better than bonera, kalazde thats something we lack, with more matches and more confidence this player can be something more bigger than a medicore. so please buddy judge on this guy when he plays more matches and when he makes more mistakes.
I don't really know if we understand each other K77SH. As I agree with some of the points you make, but if we didn't buy Bonera, Favalli, Pancaro, Senderos...then who would we have as back ups?
As I said, Senderos was a rushed decision. We wanted Ivanovic but a deal couldn't be reached and time was running out. At the same time the club wasn't keen on spending 20 mil obviously. So I don't think Senderos was a guy that we were tracking or a front runner choice for that matter, but he was something like the last resort. At least that's the way I see it. Anyhow, let's give him a chance anyway and see how we feel about his case next June.
Bonera is a great player that would start in most Serie A defences, I would say he would be a starter for 80% of Serie A's teams right now. But sometimes us fans are a little spoiled and see the grass greener on the other side of the fence.
Also, I understand that we replaced Van Basten.....as a matter of fact he was the reason I started loving Milan. :3band: But it took a while don't you think. It didn't actually happen untill 99 when Sheva came as before that we had good forwards but they never really really did what we wanted them to for a consistent period of time.
As for replacing Baresi or Costacurta......Nesta is the prime example of that and also Maldini who was in that transition period moved to the hart of the defence. So I understand that you want Nesta replaced sooner rather then later........but the fact of the matter is that he doesn't need a replacement. When fit he is still the best CB in the world IMO. This injury is just unfortunate and quite honestly nobody could have predicted that the outcome would be what it is now. So I know that it would have been ideal to sign Zapata with the money that we spent on Senderos and Bonera.......but lets remember that when be bought Bonera he was a proven and better player then Zapata. At the same time, would YOU spend 20+ mil on a player that will only sit on the bench and wait for Nesta to retire so he can take the spotlight? Because lets face it........Carlo, Galliani, Berlu will not bench Maldini untill he has legs to walk. I think we've seen the proof of that already.
So like I said, I agree with most the stuff you are sayin.....and I would be angry if in the summer we don't sign a quality quality CB. Because Maldini won't be there anymore and neither will Favalli. Nesta will be yet another year older while we have seen that Kaladze is a big liability. At the moment Bonera is our best and consistently fit CB so we have to reward him I think.
Good discussion by the way. :pp20:
We need Santacroce. He is the ideal Maldini replacement. I believe next season if -hopefully- Maldini retires, we should buy Santacroce and another CD, and we'll be fine. Can't judge Senderos before he gets his chances. Bonera has been average, he definitely isn't a starting material, but a good back up. Kaladze? garbage, same for Favalli.
But as I said, if Maldini retires and we buy Santacroce and another decent CD, then Santacroce can start beside Nesta, and "New CD", Kaladze, Bonera, Favalli, and Senderos if we buy him would be just fine.
Bonera Aint a medicore player and will never be. bonera is the reason u have a solid defence and 5 clean sheets. bonera was delivering more than expected and when bonera was at santacrocce's age he was considered a great talent, there were Gambrini, Bellini, Barzaghli and bonera that were considered as italy future defence and honestly i see bonera as the best of them as he did not get 7 matches in a raw. and now after he got that we all feel safer. he is not making the stupid mistakes because he got the confidence. on the other hand how come u judge on senderos from one match, this guy has not played in ages and come on he just need time to adapt to the team on the field not mentioning the league and the tactics .... etc. i know senderos was far from a good performance but we all saw a promise in this guy, he is a killer on 1 vs. 1 situation far more better than bonera, kalazde thats something we lack, with more matches and more confidence this player can be something more bigger than a medicore. so please buddy judge on this guy when he plays more matches and when he makes more mistakes.
Bonera was hyped as the new Baresi when he was at Brescia. I used to watch him with great anticipation and he never imprssed me. He then went a few years and didnt progress anywhere near to what people expected. He used to get red cards left right and centre. I admit hes a better player now, but he does not have the quality to be one of the world's best defenders which is surely what Milan deserves. If you watch him closely, you will notice he relies heavily on fouling the opponent. He doesnt have the finesse of a Nesta.
As for Senderos, considering I live in England I have seen plenty of him before he came to Milan. Good luck to him if he succeeds, but lets not pretend we watched him for years. He was the kind of desperate last minute signing that Oliveira was. But you know what, Il agree to not say another word on him until hes played 10 matches for us.
I don't really know if we understand each other K77SH. As I agree with some of the points you make, but if we didn't buy Bonera, Favalli, Pancaro, Senderos...then who would we have as back ups?
Everything you say makes sense. I suppose Im trying to stress that Milan need to have some starters before we can concern our selves with backup.
We can agree to give Senderos time which is something that Wenger eventually stopped giving him. Wenger doesnt do this with young players, not ones that go on to succeed anyway.
Bonera is a great player that would start in most Serie A defences, I would say he would be a starter for 80% of Serie A's teams right now. But sometimes us fans are a little spoiled and see the grass greener on the other side of the fence.
Bonera would be a great choice to rotate with Nesta if we had another world class defender. As it is, I feel Milan is desperately short at the back. I keep saying Zapatta because his name is easier to spell than Santacroce, but the Napoli man will be the saviour of Itallian defenders. When I see him, I get the same feeling that Dani Alves gave me at Seville. He has pace, aggression, good ball control, passing and the timing of tackles that all great defenders have. He has it all. I will be absolutely disgusted if Barca get him(They are already sniffing around him).
Also, I understand that we replaced Van Basten.....as a matter of fact he was the reason I started loving Milan. :3band: But it took a while don't you think. It didn't actually happen untill 99 when Sheva came as before that we had good forwards but they never really really did what we wanted them to for a consistent period of time.
You could also include Big George Weah in that. Oh and Simoni in his white boots. He wasnt the same level I know.
At the same time, would YOU spend 20+ mil on a player that will only sit on the bench and wait for Nesta to retire so he can take the spotlight? Because lets face it........Carlo, Galliani, Berlu will not bench Maldini untill he has legs to walk. I think we've seen the proof of that already.
We dont need to bench him anymore. Between his injuries and tired legs the new man would get playing time. Playing Mr X would not be a problem at all.
Good discussion by the way. :pp20:
I know, its more fun talking about your club when you think you so obviously see the things that need to be done. Being champions is not as much fun as trying to be champions.
Agree......sometimes I wish we were 30 points up in front, but then again what excitement would that be.
About Santacroce...you are spot on. I think we need to make him a priority. He seems to be the chosen one to carry on the Italian legacy of great defenders......but I don't want to run ahead of myself just yet as there have been too many chosen ones over the years that didn't reach expectations with Bonera being one of them.
Anyhow, Santacroce seems to be worth the gamble and it would suck if we let him go anywhere else expecially because defence should be a priority in the summer.
hitmannq8
09-11-2008, 04:07
I kinda have a feeling that none of the Napoli players will be sold any time soon.... They are building a very promising project and aim to go for the young players with potential. However to be a great team they do need some sort of experience. I dont think that Santacroce will be leaving any time soon, however I do not know if their minds will change when Fabio Cannavaro joins them next summer..there could be a chance.
I really believe Napoli is going for the scudetto in next 3-4 years, they have the money and will not sell their players to Milan, Juve, Inter...
As soon as I saw Santacroce play I was extatic about his talent, same thing with players like Pato, Corluka and for example young Robben. Those players you recognise right away.
Milan will not pay 11 mln for Senderos unless he plays exceptional well this year. Now he is not injured any more and we can use him in time and without pressure. Our only problem is Nesta, even more then Pirlo in my oppinion.
But, for some of you that follow handball, and know who is Ivano Balic ( unquestionably the ronaldinho of handball)...he has the same injury as Nesta and WC in in Croatia in january. They also decided he will not undergo surgery and will be threated like Nesta is now. But not in Miami :) Operation would risk too much and recuperation would last too long.
About bonera: When he was y U21 player he was considered to be top class italian defender. With Lippi he played in first 11 of NT as a RB. This year Bonera plays his best football in AC Milan so far. Im very happy with his games, he onlyneeds to be less violent. And that is why Milan needs defenders like Maldini and Nesta, players who have muscles but even more brains. Which Bonera, Kaladze and Senderos dont have.
And dont forget, its MUCH easier to play next to Zambrotta then Oddo...
As soon as I saw Santacroce play I was extatic about his talent, same thing with players like Pato, Corluka and for example young Robben. Those players you recognise right away.
agree.
Next year we'll lose Maldini n I don't think I will see nesta on every game too coz of his injury,.. so we should really bring the best def around no matter it cost to immediately replace those 2 defense legends when they're not available. I just don't want to see Kaladze - Bonera pair as our best defense solution next year. Santacroce fits the bill.
or some palyer like Terry, Ferdinand :)
Gabriel489
09-11-2008, 09:05
Santacroce and Zapata, I think it can happen, just like we never would have thought we would sign Nesta.
or some palyer like Terry, Ferdinand :)
Probably for JT, absolutely not for Ferdinand and FORZA Santacroce :gonova:
But Lazio was in financial crisis then and had to sell their top players. Napoli has been building a very good team in past years and isn't in need of cash. Udinese is a different case, they have the knack of selling their best players if the price is right. That's why I believe we have more possibility signing Zapata than that Santaclaus-something.
About the idea of getting Terry or Ferdinand, just forget it. Terry to Chelsea is like Maldini to us. And if Rio doesn't date with some hot blond sophaholic celebrity and begins to pay more attention to how his hair looks than to football, there's no chance that SAF will sell him
The day when Nesta came was a blessing for us ^^ And I think it was also to save Lazio from bankruptcy. Zapata probably comes but I think we'd been linked with this Santa Claus also for few times. Still there is a chance for sign this player. Zapata or Santacroce should be bring to here ASAP. But personally I hope Santa Claus the one who is coming. Because he might brings a present for us :)
Peachtot
10-11-2008, 04:32
easy MLM.. santa definitely will come soon ! precisely this december in anywhere you are :D
If you only saw City-Tottenham and Corluka vs Robinho.... we are idiots! Im not even gonna watch Corluka again unless he plays for Croatia... I keep thinking about Oddo, and Senderos as our defenders then :(
Charli is a brilliant player.
kastriot
10-11-2008, 06:30
If you only saw City-Tottenham and Corluka vs Robinho.... we are idiots! Im not even gonna watch Corluka again unless he plays for Croatia... I keep thinking about Oddo, and Senderos as our defenders then :(
Charli is a brilliant player.
Never gonna happen Mrki, just give it a rest.......Never would galliani spend the amount that City did last year. Thats the reality. They splashed that kind of money only on Dinho,cuz they knew it was a great deal.Thats it.
not only charlie,but Eduardo and Modric wuold have made it in milan, but not for that amount of money.
But Charlie went to Tottenham for 9mln!! NINE mln... Senderos's buy-price is 8mln + 2.5 the loan!
kastriot
10-11-2008, 09:22
But Charlie went to Tottenham for 9mln!! NINE mln... Senderos's buy-price is 8mln + 2.5 the loan!
I was thinking the same thing while writing the post, and I knew that u will mention this.
Its true, but I think the only team who was involved in Charlies transfers was Totnham, once they almost closed the deal to be blocked by MAn City old owner.
AT that time everybody thought that Charlie was indispensable for Man City.they were never gonna sell him
The transfer came through in the last day, after the owners were changed in Man city. Frankly, Abu DABi(a family with wealth around 600 bilion euros) couldnt care less about the transfer fee, they just wanted to offload Corluka to open up space for some star player like Canna, Nesta, Alex...corluka doesnt still fit that profile of players.
A transfer in the last minute was agreed with Totnham cuz they already had a deal with Charlie.
Mrki, earlier you mentioned that Naletic talked to our management about Charlie, and the sad thing is not they are cheap,but they were never interested.
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