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Uncle Fester said that we won't buy anyone in winter transfer since our team is complete. But he didn't close the door yet for Ronnie.
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1708/ac-milan/2008/12/08/1001906/galliani-hints-at-ronaldo-return
LOLL, who's next? Salas?
These statement's from Galliani shouldn't be taken serious.
Maybe we'll buy 2-3 other players maybe not.
I only belive him after the transferwindow closes ;)
Once again there are direct quotes attributed (to someone like Galliani) and they are not true? It's even on soccernet, not only that but the article is by 'soccernet staff'
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=601037&sec=europe&cc=5901
kastriot
10-12-2008, 17:34
I heard that the perfect for RINO is:
LORIK CANNA!
What do you think???
i would be the happiest person on earth if Cana could join us, not just for his abilities but also his Albanian too, :d but we dont need a cover for Rinho, we have Flamini thats enough. and Cardacio barely has set a foot in the field yet
Lebanese
10-12-2008, 17:56
according to reports coming from brasil milan has agreed personal terms with thiago silva who will stay with fluminese until june!
ginoformaggino
10-12-2008, 17:57
according to Sport Tv Brazil and SportItalia
Thiago Silva is a Milan player. He would play on loan 'til next june.
It would be fantastic.
Milan could loan the fullback for six months of the next year
http://globoesporte.globo.com/Esportes/Noticias/Times/Fluminense/0,,MUL918028-9866,00-IDOLO+DA+TORCIDA+THIAGO+SILVA+DEVE+FICAR+MAIS+SEIS+MESES+NO+FLU.html
http://video.globo.com/Videos/Player/Esportes/0,,GIM924790-7824-VICTORINO+CHERMONT+CONFIRMA+ACERTO+DE+THIAGO+SILVA+COM+O+MILAN,00.html
Yap, just read that from goal.com too
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1708/ac-milan/2008/12/10/1006463/breaking-news-milan-sign-thiago-silva-reports
If this is true (Milan sign Thiago Silva), this will be a great present for our 'Brasilian Scout', Brasileiro (sorry for the misspelling), who rates Silva very highly. :D
Brasileiro, where are you mate? Long time no see. :D
Hasan Rossonero
10-12-2008, 22:04
Apparently he will play for Fiorentina until June (I will confirm source later).
I found it on wikipedia. I still can't find reliable source.
remote2book
10-12-2008, 22:16
just read this on goal.com
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1711/chelsea/2008/12/11/1006712/alex-ready-to-quit-chelsea
what you guys think?
What I read from some members here, he was/is rated pretty well but I dont know, I am still not convinced about his ability (maybe because I don't watch many games of him).
Does Alex have EU-Pass?
Sigh....and we can't bring Thiago Silva directly because of the almighty $have. What a signing lol. I haven't seen Thiago Silva play too many times but from what I've heard he's good and we desperately need a good CD. Maybe we'll actually go back to the days when we only needed 1 DM :o
Actually it's because of Viudez. Why did Milan actually give a non EU sport for a player who won't play for first team?
hitmannq8
10-12-2008, 23:33
I havent seen Thiago Silva play, but after recent reports of ALex saying that he wants out of Chelsea, I seriously think we should look there. Alex has been a favourite of Carlo's, and he really is class. I would love to have him here over any other defender out there, his age and his price would make him the perfect candidate. However, I do think he does not have an EU passport, so maybe we should loan out Viudez or something, but we must not pass on the chance to sign Alex. I don't think Thiago Silva could be much better than Alex, Alex has been playing in the CL for at least 5 years now. He has alot of experience (he captained PSV for a season too and has played under Mourinho at Chelsea).
Actually it's because of Viudez. Why did Milan actually give a non EU sport for a player who won't play for first team?
I know but I couldnt resist a swipe at Sheva :D lol Really strange transfers indeed...both taking up Non-EU spots.
I know but I couldnt resist a swipe at Sheva :D lol Really strange transfers indeed...both taking up Non-EU spots.
I love watching Sheva's face and gesture when complaining at the ref last week. He sure has remaster his Italian :devs:
And btw, I never see Thiago, but I'll welcome any, well, almost any, CB now though I like Alex better than Thiago since I've watched him many times
ACMILAN1983
11-12-2008, 04:32
According to Sky Italia, we've apparently got Thiago Silva and Alex is on the books after his apparent transfer request.
another gossip:
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1708/ac-milan/2008/12/11/1007165/dessena-to-replace-gattuso-at-milan
seems like we're now linked with dessena.
According to Sky Italia, we've apparently got Thiago Silva and Alex is on the books after his apparent transfer request.
Excellent if we can get both. But that means we're not getting Agger. I like Agger but Alex is pretty damn good too. He's better than Terry atleast.
I don't think we need another DM as we already have Flamini and Ambrosini as pure DM and Emerson plus Cardaccio who also can play as DM. What we need in the middle is an attacking midfielder. But first of course a very good DC (plus a WC striker :D).
OCmilano
11-12-2008, 10:16
BREAKING NEWS: Milan Sign Thiago Silva - Reports
Milan have signed Brazilian defender Thiago Silva from Fluminense, according to SKY Sport Italia...
HO-YOUNG
11-12-2008, 11:46
it would be good if we could get Agger and Alex this winter...because more injuries are due now for Maldini and Favalli... if we hav indeed sign Silva for next year it is great... what we need now is Etoo...
but we dont need a cover for Rinho, we have Flamini thats enough
It's not enough. Look at how much work Flamini & Gattuso had to do when they were on the pitch and yet we were still being over run at times due to the lack of work rate from everyone else. Now Flamini is on his own, what do you think is going to happen? The rest of the team need to step up and i can't see that happening.
If we do have Thiago Silva, how much did we end up paying for him? Villareal supposedly had a Ģ4.5 million bid turned down for him so we must have gone in excess of that. Just how much did we spend for a player who would cost us nothing in 6 months time?
As for Alex, well i guess we could loan out Viudez but i'd be very surprised if the Brazilian came here in January. My hope for Milan signing Zhirkov looks less promising if we get both of these non-eu defenders :sigh:
I do think that Milan won't pay a penny for Fluminense as Thiago is free in this month. It depends on Thiago, not Fluminense.
HO-YOUNG
11-12-2008, 12:55
I do think that Milan won't pay a penny for Fluminense as Thiago is free in this month. It depends on Thiago, not Fluminense.
We might not have paid any thing "officially".... but as you know a little "tapping Up" have to take place...
I do think that Milan won't pay a penny for Fluminense as Thiago is free in this month. It depends on Thiago, not Fluminense.
If he was free then how come Villareal had a Ģ4.5 million bid turned down by Fluminese?
If he was free then how come Villareal had a Ģ4.5 million bid turned down by Fluminese?
Villareal can immediatly have Thiago Silva when Fluminence accept their offer (with assumsion Thiago Silva also accept Villareal's offer). I dont know when exactly he will be free (the date) but what I know that he will be free in this month.
Edit : If I am not mistaken, Milan paid some money for Rennes when Milan took Gourcuff even Gourcuff actually was already free to discuss his future with other club (but stil have contract for a couple of months with Rennes).
Bosniaco
11-12-2008, 14:20
Here it is Thiago Silva.
http://www.tuttomercatoweb.com/?action=read&id=132257
so if that report on tuttomercatoweb is to be believed (and if i'm reading it right), then we paid 10 million euros for him, offered him a 4 year deal and will pay him 2.5 million euros a season. Is that correct?
10 mil to Fluminense, 2,5 mil for Silva
Tomorrow he will land in Milano
he will play only friendly matches 'till june
I hope he is as good as everyone sais
Thiago Silva that i saw at the olympic games wasn't very impressive
10 mil to Fluminense, 2,5 mil for Silva
Tomorrow he will land in Milano
he will play only friendly matches 'till june
I hope he is as good as everyone sais
Thiago Silva that i saw at the olympic games wasn't very impressive
I am still confued about Thiago Silva's situation. If he is free, why Milan pay so much money? I also want to ask about Bosman's rule. Does this rule exist in other continents (except Europe)? In Europe a player can discuss his future with other club 6 months before his contract ends. What about in other continent?
In the Olympic, Thiago Silva was not a starter. If I am not mistaken, he played only 2 or 3 matches and only played from the fist minute in the last group's match when Brazil have already qualified for next round. So, I think we can not rate him from this competition as he didn't play regularly here.
In the Olympic Dunga played the other Silva as starter (Alex Silva) and this still confuses me because from the information I got, Thiago Silva is much better than Alex Silva. I still wonder, why Dunga prefered Alex Silva to Thiago Silva. Had Thiago Silva been injured before the Olympic took place?
hitmannq8
11-12-2008, 15:17
10 mil to Fluminense, 2,5 mil for Silva
Tomorrow he will land in Milano
he will play only friendly matches 'till june
I hope he is as good as everyone sais
Thiago Silva that i saw at the olympic games wasn't very impressive
Pato wasn't good at all at the U-20 World Cup before we got him either, but played much better at Milan. I agree with you, Thiago Silva was pretty average at best at the Olympics, maybe he will turn it to be good. Milan don't usually pay 10m euro's for very young, inexperienced, soon-to-be-FREE players..they must really believe in him.
However I'll keep my fingers crossed, I'd like Alex in the new year as my birthday present! and no, I dont want Agger, I dont any more of those overrated premiership defenders (SENDEROS). Alex is not a premiership defender, he was always destined for a great club.
HO-YOUNG
11-12-2008, 15:50
Alex is not a premiership defender, he was always destined for a great club.
i like how u put it "great club"... i hav a bag of frenz who are Premiership fans and i keep telling them that there are only one and a half gtreat clubs in england...Pool and ManU.... but they are willing to put there necks on the line that Arsenal and Chelski are great.... they are like holland at the world cup... only there to make up numbers and to provide a worthy opponent for the champions....
FORZAMILAN
hitmannq8
11-12-2008, 16:07
MILAN - A.C. Milan communicate that Daniele Bonera was subjected to a surgical operation today at the "La Madonnina" clinic in Milan. The operation, which was necessary due to a hernia, was perfectly executed and the footballer must now observe a period without activities of at least three weeks.
Bonera out for a few weeks. Uh oh........ probably explains why Milan's been linked with alotta defenders in the last 5 days. Mexas, Zapata, Santacroce, Alex, Ivanovic, Thiago Silva, Agger, Ramos and I'm we'll see some more..
Originally posted by Siregar I am still confued about Thiago Silva's situation. If he is free, why Milan pay so much money? I also want to ask about Bosman's rule. Does this rule exist in other continents (except Europe)? In Europe a player can discuss his future with other club 6 months before his contract ends. What about in other continent?
In the Olympic, Thiago Silva was not a starter. If I am not mistaken, he played only 2 or 3 matches and only played from the fist minute in the last group's match when Brazil have already qualified for next round. So, I think we can not rate him from this competition as he didn't play regularly here.
In the Olympic Dunga played the other Silva as starter (Alex Silva) and this still confuses me because from the information I got, Thiago Silva is much better than Alex Silva. I still wonder, why Dunga prefered Alex Silva to Thiago Silva. Had Thiago Silva been injured before the Olympic took place?
i hope brasileiro can give some of his views about this. Anyway, there's none official news. Thiago could still overtook by the black and blue side of milan
Lebanese
11-12-2008, 18:14
if the player is under 25, a basic fee is required even if its a free transfer.
dont ask me how i know but i noticed it in football manager :D LOL
kastriot
11-12-2008, 18:16
If we rushed to buy Silva now, that only means that our management believes firmly that his worth it...and didnt want to take chances with Inter, Chelsea geting involved...
If I recall right, neither kaka nor Pato were to come the season the came...but Milan was forced to take them earlier due to fierce competition. and it turned out just fine, so hope we did the right thing with Silva too
http://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/SerieA/Squadre/Milan/Primo_Piano/2008/12/11/Thiago.shtml
MILANO, 11 dicembre 2008 - Thiago Silva č del Milan. Il difensore della Fluminense sbarcherā domenica a Milano e lunedė si sottoporrā alle visite mediche. Al club brasiliano vanno 10 milioni di euro; il giocatore, che firmerā un quadriennale, percepirā 2,5 milioni di euro a stagione. Ma Thiago Silva non potrā giocare con il Milan giā a gennaio visto che la societā rossonera non puō schierare altri extracomunitari. Il forte difensore si aggregherā comunque subito al gruppo dei suoi nuovi compagni di squadra per restare in Italia e allenarsi, cosė come ha fatto Pato nella scorsa stagione. Il difensore va a cosė a ingrossare la comunitā brasiliana di Milanello, giā forte di Kakā, Ronaldinho (tra i suoi grandi sostenitori), Pato, Dida ed Emerson.
if the player is under 25, a basic fee is required even if its a free transfer.
dont ask me how i know but i noticed it in football manager :D LOL
Aha. That's it. :D
But i think 10 mil is sill too much for basic fee. Maybe his real price (when he is under contract) is about 10-15 mil euros.
Bosniaco
11-12-2008, 21:44
Well if Gazzetta reports this then it is 99% true
Bosniaco
11-12-2008, 22:19
Kameni a goalkeeper for Espanol will be out of contract in Summer, he will be able to talk to other clubs in January. Defintly go after him. He is 24 years old a very good goal keeper.
and no, I dont want Agger, I dont any more of those overrated premiership defenders (SENDEROS). Alex is not a premiership defender, he was always destined for a great club.
More of your usual rubbish about England and the premiership. Alex is a premiership defender because that's the league he plays in, end of discussion. You can't make an argument against that just because he's one of your favourite players. Besides, Agger is better than him anyway and he (along with some other defenders in England) are far from overrated :rollani:
Lebanese
12-12-2008, 07:04
More of your usual rubbish about England and the premiership. Alex is a premiership defender because that's the league he plays in, end of discussion. You can't make an argument against that just because he's one of your favourite players. Besides, Agger is better than him anyway and he (along with some other defenders in England) are far from overrated :rollani:
Jim, Agger is good but alex is what we need, they are both good defenders but alex fits more in our system and formation, i cant see difference between senderos and Agger and the only good thing agger did was sending liverpool through the final, anything else nothing to mention, and honestly if you have watched Man U. Vs. liverpool 3-0. you will want him to stay at anfield.
There are plenty of good defenders in England. Im not sure Alex or Agger are better than them. Agger seems to have problems with injuries and Alex isnt the paciest. We can do better, much better. Ironically, the better options are in Seria A which we seem to ignore. Zappatta or Santacocce are familiar with what is required of them from Milan.
Hasan Rossonero
12-12-2008, 08:11
Alex reminds me of Stam.
There are plenty of good defenders in England. Im not sure Alex or Agger are better than them. Agger seems to have problems with injuries and Alex isnt the paciest. We can do better, much better. Ironically, the better options are in Seria A which we seem to ignore. Zappatta or Santacocce are familiar with what is required of them from Milan.
its simply not possible to get santacroce at the moment..there is no way napoli will sell him anysoon..they aren't broke,they are building a project..we might thou have a chance a few years later..maybe when he is 25 somethin..
Lebanese
12-12-2008, 09:55
There are plenty of good defenders in England. Im not sure Alex or Agger are better than them. Agger seems to have problems with injuries and Alex isnt the paciest. We can do better, much better. Ironically, the better options are in Seria A which we seem to ignore. Zappatta or Santacocce are familiar with what is required of them from Milan.
You are right about that K77SH but to be honest, this season zapata aint doing this good and Santacroce only god knows how much will he cost. if its to me i would take chellini over any defender in serie A. this guy is the best CB out there. but once again let us try to be realistic in our targets. Santacroce will at least cost 25 mil, which is a normal price for a player like him but dont forget that napoli will only sell when the see their selves with no silverware and out of europe. this year i think lavezzi will leave. maybe in 2 or 3 years we will see santacroce is transfered, all europe wants him let wish we do the nesta scenario.
in an interview Chellini said that he would love to play next to kaka.
rosoneri_11
12-12-2008, 10:16
After signing T.Silva is any thinking that we will sign another DC in January?(Silva will start playing with us from 2009-10 season)
Jim, Agger is good but alex is what we need, they are both good defenders but alex fits more in our system and formation, i cant see difference between senderos and Agger and the only good thing agger did was sending liverpool through the final, anything else nothing to mention, and honestly if you have watched Man U. Vs. liverpool 3-0. you will want him to stay at anfield.
Clearly you don't watch Agger alot if you think he's had nothing else to mention apart from a 3-0 defeat to Man Utd. If you want to use this logic then we shouldn't go for Alex either as he got ripped apart when PSV played Arsenal in the CL a few years ago.
As both of these players are centre-backs, i can't see how one would fit our 'system' and one wouldn't. Agger reads the game well, can bring the ball out from defence with confidence and has a great shot on him just like Alex. He doesn't have Alex's bulk, but he has better pace. He also doesn't lose his head like Senderos, if anything he's noted for his calmness on the ball. I think he's a better defender than given credit for. Maybe Alex is as well, but he's yet to convince me while Agger already has.
You also mentioned Zapata isn't doing so good this season, well considering he's recovering from a serious injury this is no surprise so really you can't make any kind of judgement on his form as this season isn't a true representation of what he can do.
Why did Ager play only 5 games in EPL last season? Did he had long injury? Or he was just benched by Benitez?
About Alex, does anyone know if he has EU pass?
Why did Ager play only 5 games in EPL last season? Did he had long injury? Or he was just benched by Benitez?
About Alex, does anyone know if he has EU pass?
Yes Agger had injury problems last year and has just recently returned. Zapatta is injured also.
Two ways to look at Zapatta, either he is injury prone and we should stay clear or he is not the current flavour of the month and we should take advantage now and maybe get him a little cheaper. Also its easy to forget not too long ago Liverpool were interested in Zapata.
Lebanese, you are right about Napoli not wanting to sell, but lets at least start sniffing.
How about Alex's pass? Does he have EU pass? If I am not mistaken, people can look at player's situation pass in a certain web but I forget which website it is. :D
www.footballdatabase.com usually has a players EU status
Thanks, mate. That website says Alex doesn't have EU pass. :( (http://www.footballdatabase.com/index.php?page=player&Id=1176&b=true&pn=Alex_Rodrigo_Dias_da_Costa)
Iif Alex doesn't have an EU passport, it would be why it was so long for him to go to Chelsea ... because he has been owned for 2-3 years by Chelsea before going there if I remember but he wasn't allowed to play in England (there are some conditions I think).
Anyway, I just saw something we could probably call "fantasy-mercato" on Calciomercato: the Spurs would have asked for Iaquinta to Juventus and would have asked for the following deal ... Modric vs Iaquinta+5M !! If it's real, I'd like to know why they didn't ask for that to Milan, for example: Shevchenko+10M vs Modric ?? :dontkn:
I havent commented on mercato issues lately, so:
Thiago Silva: our friend from Brasil Brasiliero has talked greatly about him, and he rarely misses about those kind of players ( Marcelo, Pato, Silva, Henranes etc.). I've watched him few times, maybe 5, so its hard to tell. Specially coz when you play in Brasilian league the "defence" issue becomes more complicated to explain to people that understand serie a :)
But Thiago Silva is an EXTREMLY string phisically and is able to play with full ball controll in any moment. His headers and the way of going out with the ball are impressive. He has run outs like Lucio for example, but with more technique. Actually the good thing, in my oppinion, is that he will be in Milanello for 6 months before he plays serie a. He will need some tactical discipline and so on. But I expect him to be a very good if not a great defender. I dont see any real problems in his game once he hets used to play in Milan sistem. 10mln for a player that is free in one month and nas no EU assort means Leonardo said "yes!".
Now, there are news that Juve will sign Gallas. Which I dont like. Even dough Gallas is 31, Milan NEEDS another CB in winter, not in the summer. And if we can sign Gallas then next year our defence can finnally consist of 4 class players again: Gallas-Silva-Nesta-Zambro. We all know Gallas can play at the same level as a LB too. ( but he hates it :) )
In reality, Milan will now most likely look for a midfielder ( apart from Beckham who is...I dont know what to say. Its like pretty girl that is a lot offun but you dont like it and you miss Gattuso! hahaha! ). Reports of Dessena, Ilner and so on are incuraging, as we will really need one more midfielder nowq when Rino is gone. He cant be replaced but we just need one more now. That is why maybe Milan will not spend on Gallas as it seemed like. Having Dessena would be good, alčdough he wasnt brilliant this 6 months with Doria. Still he is one of the brighest italian talents. His natural position is Rinho's right-midfield place, no he doesnt need to change anything.
Now if off to place a bet on Barcelona tonight and to frame my Milan shirt that I got signed by Franco Baresi and put it on the wall. That one will never be carryed again :):v408:
Anyway, I just saw something we could probably call "fantasy-mercato" on Calciomercato: the Spurs would have asked for Iaquinta to Juventus and would have asked for the following deal ... Modric vs Iaquinta+5M !! If it's real, I'd like to know why they didn't ask for that to Milan, for example: Shevchenko+10M vs Modric ?? :dontkn:
I dnt think that this deal ispossible since Rednapp adores Modric and this is imsply stupid thing to do. Fantamercato...
Emerson+Favalinho+Dida for Corluka :)
I dnt think that this deal ispossible since Rednapp adores Modric and this is imsply stupid thing to do. Fantamercato...
Emerson+Favalinho+Dida for Corluka :)
If this kind of deals was possible, it would be amazingly magnificient for us right now with all these useless players we have on the bench (from Emerson to Schevchenko, without forgetting Favalli, Dida, Kalac and also Seedorf who can't play 2 good games in a row).
Actually the good thing, in my oppinion, is that he will be in Milanello for 6 months before he plays serie a. He will need some tactical discipline and so on
Now, there are news that Juve will sign Gallas. Which I dont like. Even dough Gallas is 31, Milan NEEDS another CB in winter, not in the summer. And if we can sign Gallas then next year our defence can finnally consist of 4 class players again: Gallas-Silva-Nesta-Zambro. We all know Gallas can play at the same level as a LB too. ( but he hates it :) )
In reality, Milan will now most likely look for a midfielder ( apart from Beckham who is...I dont know what to say. Its like pretty girl that is a lot offun but you dont like it and you miss Gattuso! hahaha! ). Reports of Dessena, Ilner and so on are incuraging, as we will really need one more midfielder nowq when Rino is gone. He cant be replaced but we just need one more now. That is why maybe Milan will not spend on Gallas as it seemed like. Having Dessena would be good, alčdough he wasnt brilliant this 6 months with Doria. Still he is one of the brighest italian talents. His natural position is Rinho's right-midfield place, no he doesnt need to change anything.
It's good news for Thiago Silva but we need to wait for the official statement, he has to sign Monday ... anyway, I disagree with these 6 months without playing any official game for Thiago Silva: why don't we loan him to another Seria A club, not one of our rivals ...
I also saw two reports that could be linked actually (even if no mention about any link between both): Donadel from Fiorentina would come to Milan, and Thiago Silva would be loaned to Fiorentina ... anyway, if Thiago Silva is really as strong as everybody says, it's not a good idea to loan him to this club as it is one of our direct rivals !!
For Gallas, Wenger clearly said he won't sell him and that he will stay in Arsenal until June, at least.
I like all these declarations of love from Galliani for Roma ... is he in love with Rosella Sensi ?? :heart:
Lebanese
13-12-2008, 10:16
It's good news for Thiago Silva but we need to wait for the official statement, he has to sign Monday ... anyway, I disagree with these 6 months without playing any official game for Thiago Silva: why don't we loan him to another Seria A club, not one of our rivals ...
I also saw two reports that could be linked actually (even if no mention about any link between both): Donadel from Fiorentina would come to Milan, and Thiago Silva would be loaned to Fiorentina ... anyway, if Thiago Silva is really as strong as everybody says, it's not a good idea to loan him to this club as it is one of our direct rivals !!
For Gallas, Wenger clearly said he won't sell him and that he will stay in Arsenal until June, at least.
I like all these declarations of love from Galliani for Roma ... is he in love with Rosella Sensi ?? :heart:
Anchelotti said in press conference that thiago silva is an excellent defender and he will be trained like pato. that means it official. plus an Italian writer said that thiago silva deal is truly golden and milan just got a player like Marcel Desailly and Frank Rijkard who can be a midfielder and a central defender ...
oh about Galliani Falling for sensi, i think he is falling for mexes, as for mexes agent mentioned that philip will be meeting Galliani on January 11 :D
Brasileiro
13-12-2008, 10:40
I havent commented on mercato issues lately, so:
Thiago Silva: our friend from Brasil Brasiliero has talked greatly about him, and he rarely misses about those kind of players ( Marcelo, Pato, Silva, Henranes etc.). I've watched him few times, maybe 5, so its hard to tell. Specially coz when you play in Brasilian league the "defence" issue becomes more complicated to explain to people that understand serie a :)
But Thiago Silva is an EXTREMLY string phisically and is able to play with full ball controll in any moment. His headers and the way of going out with the ball are impressive. He has run outs like Lucio for example, but with more technique. Actually the good thing, in my oppinion, is that he will be in Milanello for 6 months before he plays serie a. He will need some tactical discipline and so on. But I expect him to be a very good if not a great defender. I dont see any real problems in his game once he hets used to play in Milan sistem. 10mln for a player that is free in one month and nas no EU assort means Leonardo said "yes!".
Whatīs up, Milanistas!!! :3band:
Long time without post here...I miss this place...I really like the mood of MM.
As usual, I couldnīt said it better than mrki:smileani:
Despite the fact that the Silvaīs hype in Brazil is a little crazy(they call him the best CB in the world), this guy is a amazing defender. Heīs strong, but not that strong...To be straight, T. Silva reminds me of a young Nesta. Same style and elegance, can bring the ball easily to the attack, and isnīt violent...But, in one thing Thiago is better than the young nesta...SPEED!! I used to think that thereīs no one(central defender) faster than Cordoba, but you guys will see how amazing fast is T. Silva...and heīs bigger than Ivan Cordoba.
Another thing I agree 100% with you, mrki, is the fact it would be really good for Thiago to be in Milanello for 6 months before he plays serie A. Despite the talent, Silva fails the 2 time he cames to Europe. One in Porto, and other(and that you canīt blame him since he had big illness) in Russia(or Ucrain).
Ok, he was young, but at the same time, the youngs Alex in PSV, and David Silva in Benfica had been instantaneous successes in Europe. So, i have no doubt this 6 months at Milanello will be great for Thiago Silva, since this "failure in Europe" thing can get into your skin, like it did with Luis Fabiano in
the past.
Bottom line, great buy by our club, the talent is there, and this 10M will be label cheap in the future...one more thing: Typical Milan player(behavior side)...humble, professional, hard-worker and well liked by his teammates.
Nice.....good to hear from you, Brasileiro. Any news about Milan eyeing Hernanes?? :)
Brasileiro
13-12-2008, 11:18
Of course, I canīt come here, with all this rumors about him, and not to talk about Alex :)
Unhappyly, I canīt see Chelsea selling Alex in January...in the last 2 years, he was the CB that more played in the club. The club was always a Top 1 or 2 defence in Europe. So, with Carvalho injured, I canīt see Chelsea letting Alex go now(despite I īm praying for that) in January...
Btw, canīt people stop this complaining about Alex pace...Alex has amazing speed...AMAZING! His problem is the first step, period.
In a Chelsea forum, I read a post by someone for Holland, and the guy said Alex was the second best in PSV in sprinters tests(the first was D. Beasley, that american winger), bad for a 1.89m 92 kg defender...
Just to finish, Itīs fair enough people likes more others names for our defence than Alex, but to see people saying the guys isnīt good is crazy, and almost irrational. To be straight:
2 years as professional in Brazil: 2 times the best CB
3 years in Eredivisie: 3 times the best CB, and in C.L. top 5 defenders pools.
2 years in EPL, and Iīm still waiting for the "he doesnīt have the pace to play in EPL, and will fail" day...
Wanted for 2 of the best Italian coaches for the teams they coach(ed):Capello at Real, and Carlo at any day. Another Milan legend(M. Van Basten) chose him for his best-11...and people still bashes this guy:wallbang:
Btw, Iīm not bashing the guy(far from that), but I really want to see what people would be saying if Santacrocce(sp?) wasnīt a Italian NT player... The lad is the luckiest brazilian defender ever, since he can scape from the "brazilian defender" BS...:depress:
Lebanese
13-12-2008, 11:37
Of course, I canīt come here, with all this rumors about him, and not to talk about Alex :)
Unhappyly, I canīt see Chelsea selling Alex in January...in the last 2 years, he was the CB that more played in the club. The club was always a Top 1 or 2 defence in Europe. So, with Carvalho injured, I canīt see Chelsea letting Alex go now(despite I īm praying for that) in January...
Btw, canīt people stop this complaining about Alex pace...Alex has amazing speed...AMAZING! His problem is the first step, period.
In a Chelsea forum, I read a post by someone for Holland, and the guy said Alex was the second best in PSV in sprinters tests(the first was D. Beasley, that american winger), bad for a 1.89m 92 kg defender...
Just to finish, Itīs fair enough people likes more others names for our defence than Alex, but to see people saying the guys isnīt good is crazy, and almost irrational. To be straight:
2 years as professional in Brazil: 2 times the best CB
3 years in Eredivisie: 3 times the best CB, and in C.L. top 5 defenders pools.
2 years in EPL, and Iīm still waiting for the "he doesnīt have the pace to play in EPL, and will fail" day...
Wanted for 2 of the best Italian coaches for the teams they coach(ed):Capello at Real, and Carlo at any day. Another Milan legend(M. Van Basten) chose him for his best-11...and people still bashes this guy:wallbang:
Btw, Iīm not bashing the guy(far from that), but I really want to see what people would be saying if Santacrocce(sp?) wasnīt a Italian NT player... The lad is the luckiest brazilian defender ever, since he can scape from the "brazilian defender" BS...:depress:
LOL forgot to mention that santacroce is originally brasilian. But still AGGER is better than the 3 of them :D :kap:
haha, Agger. Alex and Santacroce are 3 times plaers of Agger. But now when we have signed Silva I dont see Milan signing Alex, which was my first choice for Nesta's partner in ANY case. Maybe in the summer, but looks like Silva-Nesta is about to be our CB pair next year. This could mean we have found Maldini's replacement in Silva? Or Milan will just use Silva as a thirt CB and buy one more? Which leaves us with Boner and Kaladze doing what??
Btw, Iīm not bashing the guy(far from that), but I really want to see what people would be saying if Santacrocce(sp?) wasnīt a Italian NT player... The lad is the luckiest brazilian defender ever, since he can scape from the "brazilian defender" BS...:depress:
Good point. As for those who say that Alex and Santacroce are three times as good as Agger, and that they can't see the difference between Agger and Senderos - this smiley says it all: :stupid:
Agger links up attack better than Santacroce (who doesn't t all) and Alex (who isn't bad either). Let Kaladze go and get Santacroce or Agger or even Alex.
Good point. As for those who say that Alex and Santacroce are three times as good as Agger, and that they can't see the difference between Agger and Senderos - this smiley says it all: :stupid:
I say Alex and Santacroce are 3 times players Agger is. But I say Agger is a better player then Senderos. I dont know for who your post is...
I cant find anything on youtube showing Agger's defending. All I can find is his shooting and how cute he is apparently.
This is the only video
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uk6Vsv-wgmQ
I've seen Agger milion times, he is a good defender. But after Maldini and Nesta, Stam...he is not the man to continue down that class line.
Lebanese
13-12-2008, 15:07
I cant find anything on youtube showing Agger's defending. All I can find is his shooting and how cute he is apparently.
This is the only video
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uk6Vsv-wgmQ
This guy is a dribbling Genius and a tattoo artist. we cant judge on one error but the last thing we need is something like this. let us hope we bring a decent CD in the winter mercato .
Lebanese
13-12-2008, 15:15
Good point. As for those who say that Alex and Santacroce are three times as good as Agger, and that they can't see the difference between Agger and Senderos - this smiley says it all: :stupid:
Ceceves the difference between them is that sanderos is swiss and skin head. agger is danish and has hair on his head but they are both stupid. Benitez aint this stupid to let 3 times best Superleague talent of the year and best defender go like this. i am just curious agger is unsettled in liverpool and he has probelms with his coach, who is interested in his service. other than milan who is interested in 100000000 player?
about this smiley i hope it make you feel better!
Liverpool made it to the final of Champions League with Agger as the starter in Quarters and Semis (though he finally hit a wall in the final).
Lebanese
13-12-2008, 16:08
And the professor favalinho made a Central defender and he was awesome!
And the professor favalinho made a Central defender and he was awesome!
So? What's your point? Comparing Favallinho's some good matches in Serie A (as central defender) this season to Agger's performance till Champions League Final?
The fact is that Agger was awsome in 2006/07 just like Santracoce in this season and half of last season. Both of these players are still unexperienced with respect of their numbers in games. Which one is better? No one can answer as they are only having 1-season games (30-40 games) at most (too little data to answer the question).
Brasileiro
13-12-2008, 18:51
LOL forgot to mention that santacroce is originally brasilian. But still AGGER is better than the 3 of them :D :kap:
Nah...thats Ok, Lebanese...itīs your opinion:)
I think Agger is a very good defender too, but not at the level of Alex...no way.
Btw, Iīm really glad T. Silva will only play next season, and will have time to adapt itself...I will not support another brazilian CB bust(R. Junior) in a Milan forum:D
Hai Brasileiro, long time no see mate. :D I hope you are fine.
Ah tja, congrats for the Thiago Silva's signing (if it happens) as I know you are a big 'fan' of him. :D
I have asked here about Thiago Silva's olympic games. Do you know why Thiago Silva played very rarely (as starter) in the last Olympic games? Dunga prefered Alex Silva to Thiago Silva. Thiago only played one game in the group phase as starter when Brazil have already qualified. Did Thiago have injury before the Olympic games?
By the way, how is David Luiz now? I read your post on a certain thread (Kaka's thread) and you said that the best defender produced by Brazil after Alex is David Luiz. Did he have great games and developing in his current club (still Benfica?)?
The last question is (since you still have time :D) : how is Apodi now? Is he having good season this year? Is he getting much better now (defensive and offensive abilities)?
Arildonardo
13-12-2008, 19:49
I've seen Agger milion times, he is a good defender. But after Maldini and Nesta, Stam...he is not the man to continue down that class line.
I'd like to know the names of the defenders that can replace Maldini, Nesta and Stam... So far I haven't seen any.
We need to get the best we possibly can and stop comparing them to our legendary defenders who are the best ever, if not we will always continue to be disappointed.
I'd like to know the names of the defenders that can replace Maldini, Nesta and Stam... So far I haven't seen any.
We need to get the best we possibly can and stop comparing them to our legendary defenders who are the best ever, if not we will always continue to be disappointed.
That's very true. It's better to think how to make our defence great and stop comparing every single defender with our past great defenders (Nesta, Maldini, Stam etc.) as we won't find players like them in this time, it's only make us never satisfied with whoever Milan sign.
If other teams can make a good defence with 'normal' players, why can't we?
I'd like to know the names of the defenders that can replace Maldini, Nesta and Stam... So far I haven't seen any.
We need to get the best we possibly can and stop comparing them to our legendary defenders who are the best ever, if not we will always continue to be disappointed.
Santacroce is the first on that list, a player that can definetively become a world class defender like Cannavaro and Nesta. Mexes is a great defender also, that has brains and knows how to control the back 4. those are two players I can see as good enough to continue the big CB's line in Milan. Chiellini is of course untransferable but he is one of those big italian names for the future. Thiago Silva I dont know so well, I've seen him 5 times so far. But his phisical and technical possibilities are very good. A player of Lucio's calibre is always welcomed.
Skrtel, Agger, Senderos, Bonera, Kaladze etc. are not the players Milan needs for first pairing of CB's.
P.S.
I would like to add that I havent mention S.Ramos. I see him as a player that is absolutely not worth that money and in not capable of playing in serie a defensive wise. I hope you all saw that yesterday in El Classico when in first 45min ball was passed through his legs 3 times, he made one penalty that wasnt given in 2nd half and Puyol jumped over him for 1:0 goal of Eto'o. Its not just that game, I dont see him as a CB that can be relied upon. As an attacking right back yes, but not as an CB in serie a.
I think silva will be palying most of our games next season,i dont think were getting another cb(except if senedros will leave),althougj im sure we need one more,cause i m not sure at all about silva's quality..i ve seen him playing for brazils olympic team,and the only think that i can say is that he was better than alex silva(we were interested in too)..
ps inter are going for ivanovic,and i think its because we wanted him too,and we got silva who they wanted too..haha loosers
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1708/ac-milan/2008/12/14/1011754/christmas-shopping-who-should-milan-buy
says it all, disagree on the Gallas bit tho
Ceceves the difference between them is that sanderos is swiss and skin head. agger is danish and has hair on his head but they are both stupid. Benitez aint this stupid to let 3 times best Superleague talent of the year and best defender go like this. i am just curious agger is unsettled in liverpool and he has probelms with his coach, who is interested in his service. other than milan who is interested in 100000000 player?
about this smiley i hope it make you feel better!
It did back then, although it was a too harsh on my part. It's just that saying that Agger is stupid is unfair, and it's too easy too look at that youtube video and conclude that he's like that. Agger is technically one of the best, if not the best, central defender in England. He doesn't have the same aggresive style as John Terry or Skrtel, which is what the average fan of English football loves, but this is what I think would make him more adaptable to Italian or Spanish football (Madrid have stated their interest in him about month ago).
The thing is he was out injured all but the first one or two months of last season, and he hasn't regained his form yet (not helped by Benítez playing Hyypiä instead of him), it's a question of confidence and playing enough matches to get into his old rhythm.
I'm not saying he's as good as Nesta, or that he ever will be (logically as I consider Nesta the best CB since Baresi) - but of the current CBs in the world of football who will? Although time with tell, I don't see anyone.
Like Brasileiro, I've always liked Alex - he's got so many qualities and is both young(-ish) and experienced. Santacroce would be a dream signing. Both due to his qualities and his potential, but also because he's Italian. Both these players would be hard to get, Chelsea doesn't need the money (credit crunch or no credit crunch) and Napoli have their project going on. But if Alex wants to be a starter (Terry's always there and Carvalho will be back), he might demand a transfer (perhaps he already has?) and Santacroce's availability could depend on how Napoli finish in the table.
P.S.
I would like to add that I havent mention S.Ramos. I see him as a player that is absolutely not worth that money and in not capable of playing in serie a defensive wise. I hope you all saw that yesterday in El Classico when in first 45min ball was passed through his legs 3 times, he made one penalty that wasnt given in 2nd half and Puyol jumped over him for 1:0 goal of Eto'o. Its not just that game, I dont see him as a CB that can be relied upon. As an attacking right back yes, but not as an CB in serie a.
He was playing as LB!! He's not been happy at all this year and it has shown on the field. He's often been found too up high attacking since he has to do it on his own (they have no RW) unlike Drenthe on the left who tracks back.
One can have the same complain with Daniel Alves who also goes forward a lot but has Puyol to back him up not to mention Messi (who has started defending a little under Guardiola) and we know Alves is great and is accused of being a bad defender only because he gets too absorbed in attack.
As a CB, I remember watching him in the 2006-07 season, only his second at Madrid and he was asked to partner Cannavaro (who was crap by then) since their first choice CB was injured (cant recall who). He played more than half the season and was their best defender that season (they won the league, their first in the Deco-Ronaldinho-Rijkaard era). There were many occasions where they conceded 3-4 goals but Ramos could still keep his head high. He's won the Euros, Under-19 WC, Leagues, Cups.. one can't just ignore that.
There are just two problems with this guy
1. His discipline (the most red cards in the history of Real Madrid despite just being in his 4th year at the club) and has recently surpassed Hierro (who spent 14 years at the club). he's not a thug like Rooney but has a questionable temperament.
2. He gets too involved in attack. This problem has become one only this season since Robinho is gone and they lack a natural RW. This leaves all their right-sided attacking onus on him.
He's been the no. 4 shirt previously worn by Fernando Hierro. The only reason to not buy him is because of his temperament. Otherwise he's worthy candidate for any team in the world.
Lebanese
14-12-2008, 10:48
It did back then, although it was a too harsh on my part. It's just that saying that Agger is stupid is unfair, and it's too easy too look at that youtube video and conclude that he's like that. Agger is technically one of the best, if not the best, central defender in England. He doesn't have the same aggresive style as John Terry or Skrtel, which is what the average fan of English football loves, but this is what I think would make him more adaptable to Italian or Spanish football (Madrid have stated their interest in him about month ago).
The thing is he was out injured all but the first one or two months of last season, and he hasn't regained his form yet (not helped by Benítez playing Hyypiä instead of him), it's a question of confidence and playing enough matches to get into his old rhythm.
I'm not saying he's as good as Nesta, or that he ever will be (logically as I consider Nesta the best CB since Baresi) - but of the current CBs in the world of football who will? Although time with tell, I don't see anyone.
Like Brasileiro, I've always liked Alex - he's got so many qualities and is both young(-ish) and experienced. Santacroce would be a dream signing. Both due to his qualities and his potential, but also because he's Italian. Both these players would be hard to get, Chelsea doesn't need the money (credit crunch or no credit crunch) and Napoli have their project going on. But if Alex wants to be a starter (Terry's always there and Carvalho will be back), he might demand a transfer (perhaps he already has?) and Santacroce's availability could depend on how Napoli finish in the table.
LOL peace out
Originally posted by mrki
Santacroce is the first on that list, a player that can definetively become a world class defender like Cannavaro and Nesta. Mexes is a great defender also, that has brains and knows how to control the back 4. those are two players I can see as good enough to continue the big CB's line in Milan. Chiellini is of course untransferable but he is one of those big italian names for the future. Thiago Silva I dont know so well, I've seen him 5 times so far. But his phisical and technical possibilities are very good. A player of Lucio's calibre is always welcomed.
Skrtel, Agger, Senderos, Bonera, Kaladze etc. are not the players Milan needs for first pairing of CB's.
I would like to add that I havent mention S.Ramos. I see him as a player that is absolutely not worth that money and in not capable of playing in serie a defensive wise. I hope you all saw that yesterday in El Classico when in first 45min ball was passed through his legs 3 times, he made one penalty that wasnt given in 2nd half and Puyol jumped over him for 1:0 goal of Eto'o. Its not just that game, I dont see him as a CB that can be relied upon. As an attacking right back yes, but not as an CB in seriea.
Great analysis,agree every word of what you said in this post based on the combination of best possibility and milan's current limited buget.
Gabriel489
15-12-2008, 02:35
After last night, I just want to know, do all your K4 fans out there still think he is good enough to play for us?
I think most likely, one of Mexes, Agger, Zapata, or Santacroce will come to Milan in the summer, given we get into CL. IF Zapata does not come in Jan, which I think he will given we got trashed last night.
K4 will be gone, Favalli will be gone, Kalac won;t be renew, Sanderous will be gone, Maldini will reitre, and if Emerson and DIda have any dignity in them, they should ask to leave Milan.
Thus our backline will be Zambro, Nesta, Zapata, Janku-with Thiago Silva, Bonera, Canini(since I read that we have first option on him), Darmian, and Antonini
With Gourcuff and Abate coming back, Milan does not need to buy any midfielder, as Thiago Silva and Antonini can both play as DM if needed.
All Milan need is another striker that can actually score goals.
Darmian will never get a chance, and isn't good enough either. Janku should be sub too, but not for def, for mid. Kaladze wasn't any worse then Zambro or Janku. Management are needed too.
'The Bulldog'
15-12-2008, 05:15
Last nights performance was so embarrassing, to say the least!, and Galliani and Co have themselves to blame!
Where do I start? Defence is the weakest link...by far!!
Defensively, we are seriously in a shambles! and juve totally exposed this weakness to the max last night. How long does management need to persist with
Kaladze! He is an absolute joke! He was running around last night like a headless chook! Some of you are saying we should keep him as back-up, are you
kidding yourselves!
He needs to be GONE A.S.A.P
I will always love Maldini, he is absolute legend of the club! But sorry to say at the age of 40! He should of retired after our last champions league
victory and ended his career on a good note. He is getting exposed by quality young speedy players, especially last night with the likes of Marchisio,
De Ceglie and thank goodness Ranieri didn't decide to put on giovinco!! It would of been an absolute disaster!!
Janku had a average game, but all players have good and bad days!! Unfortunately last night was ones of those nights for Janku....he should be kept. Was
very disappointed in Zambro. Such a quality and extremely professional player, should of known better not to of tackled like he did. And Antonini should
be played alot more....he is quality young player and the future of our club.
Thank goodness we signed thiago silva, I'm all for getting Alex as well....put the money on the table and stop wasting time! COME ON....this is AC
MILAN, the most successful club in history, Berlusconi and Galliani should not be patching things up with mediocre players like Senderos, favalli,
Emerson, Kaladze etc, instead should be signing the best quality players from around the world! Also, why are management afraid to sign quality young
players, look at Juve!!! Marchisio, De Ceglie, Chiellini and Giovinco is the future for their club! We should grab Cigarini for example A.S.A.P before
inter and juve do!!
Up front, we lack a tall centre forward! I'm a big fan of Borriello, but he is too injury prone! Two huge mistakes was not signing either Adeboyor or
more so Luca Toni (money shouldn't of been problem for Berlusconi)! Just imagine having up front Roni, Toni and Kaka (with Pato and Borriello mixing
things up).....unbeatable!
Finally, Galliani and Co (including Berlusconi) need to stop making emotional decisions like bringing back sheva and start making some practical,
logical decisions in the transfer markets to solve our problems with defence and age! They should also listen to Carlo, on who he wants in the team!
All I want, obviously like most of you is success to come back to our club...we should be winning scudetto's (not struggling to make the top 4), we
belong in the champions league and winning it on a consistent basis.
slifersd
15-12-2008, 07:11
I think we all have to face the cruel reality that the rebuilding of this milan team will be a very long term project. There are currently two obstacle too big for this team to overcome, the managemet and the coach.
The problem with our management is simply that they no longer value winning over money. Once upon a time, they were willing to do anything, including run a deficit on the books if it meant that the team would win trophies. Looking at them now, I can hardly believe this is still the same management. They always go for the cheapest thing on the market despite any potential problems (emerson, shevchenko, senderoes, favalli and many more); they have possibly the worst scouting department in the world (who did they discover?); and they manipulates the coach into doing whatever makes them happy (why is shevchenko playing?). Every year, we hear the same story that we are world champions, we have a great squad capable of anything, and we don't need new players because we are too good. And then what? We have a tranfer budget that would make a serie b team owner laugh his ass off. And instead of focusing the limited amount of cash we have on finding some diamonds in the rough, we piss them all away on aging former superstars as if we are trying to play FIFA 1998. If this management does not change their ways and start injecting some serious cash into this team, we will only be able to add at most one piece every summer. Anyone care to take a guess at how long the rebuilding of this team would take at that rate?
And then we move onto the coach. I know a lot of you love Ancelotti because he won us a lot of trophies, but I just don't think he is right for this team any more for one reason. Ancelotti is notoriously bad for mentoring young players. Look at the youngsters we brought in over the course of the last few years, Gourcuff, Pato, Cardacio and Darmian. None of those guys have even secured a spot in the starting 11 yet. Does that mean all of them have no talent? Gourcuff is dominating Ligue 1; Pato was the best younsgers came out of Brazil since Kaka; Cardacio is playing for the international team despite being so young and Darmian is labeled by many as a promising young star. And yet, Ancelotti chooses guys like Emerson and Favalli over them. A rebuilding team needs a coach who can turn young players into stars, such as Wenger. Ancelotti on the other hand always chooss the over 35 year olds over the youngsters. I mean, the last time he promoted a youngster was Hernann Crespo, a guy who is on the verge of retirement. Our team cannot move forward with all of our younsters sitting on the bench day after day. They need to play and improve. Given Ancelotti's trackrecord, he simply will not do that. How would young players improve while sitting on the bench? Ask Ancelotti that.
The situation here is simple, we have a coach who will play his grandmother ahead our young stars and a management who is tighter than the skin on Joan Rivers' face. Since the management insist on valuing the books over records and the coach is here for life, we will not be able to rebuild. The rebuilding project that has taken 5 years will last a long time. So, to all the loyal milan fans out there, let's just lay back and face the reality. Until drastic changes are made to the club, we will not be able to get back to the top of the world.
Why do i kep reading Wengers name. Anyone can go out with a team of dirty nappies and win nothing. Since Wenger has started his policy of youth only, he has won jack all. What would change if Milan bought him in? Nothing, because hes a wimp who prefers to play kids and not have the pressure of competing with United and Chelsea. His board has offered him money which he refuses to use for someone older. End result, bunch of talented kids without a leader outside the top 4.
Ancelotti needs to be given a defence and a slap in the face for consistently relying on Emerson (How many DMs do we need playing at once).
Why do i kep reading Wengers name. Anyone can go out with a team of dirty nappies and win nothing. Since Wenger has started his policy of youth only, he has won jack all. What would change if Milan bought him in? Nothing, because hes a wimp who prefers to play kids and not have the pressure of competing with United and Chelsea. His board has offered him money which he refuses to use for someone older. End result, bunch of talented kids without a leader outside the top 4.
Ancelotti needs to be given a defence and a slap in the face for consistently relying on Emerson (How many DMs do we need playing at once).
The key is on Berlusconi. If he is still like he is now (very quiet even Milan play poorly), we still will be like this except a new coach come (trial and error). In the past, Berlusconi used to criticise Carlo for using 1 striker but now he seems to be having no time for Milan.
The most hilarious thing about Abbiati is that Atletico didn't think he was good enough to start for them and we have his as our No. 1.
It's only fair that Atletico is the Champions League and we're in the UEFA Cup.
We need to let Dida go and get a new No. 1. Keep Abbiati as a back up or he can leave.
I say Alex and Santacroce are 3 times players Agger is...
hahaha, what a joke. If you say you've watched Agger a million times and formed this opinion then you clearly need some new glasses. I take it that this mistake on the youtube video is the one against Wigan (where he's just returning from injury), did they show the effort he put into getting a goal back? He played like a man possessed to atone for his error and had a big hand in getting a goal back for Liverpool. Even Nesta has bad games!
If anything these players are all on the same level. I've seen as many bad games by Alex as good games and i'd like to know where were all these Santacroce fans last season? They weren't in here that's for sure, no one was even talking about him a year ago and yet now he's the new defensive messiah that'll cure all ills. What a joke. The guy has had a solid season last time round, a good half a season so far, hasn't been tested in the CL or Internationally and yet people are bleating about how great he is. A bit of balance is called for i think. Now before people moan, i'm not saying he's not a great player but to say he's 3 times better than someone who's playing at a higher level than him (Agger) is a bit much.
Agger is a great player, people who say otherwise need their heads reading or clearly don't watch football. Alex is a very good defender (though i personally have my doubts, but alot of people see something in him) and Santacroce is another good defender. All 3 would make a positive impact on our side.
I also don't understand why some people in here say we shouldn't be playing so many defensive midfielders. As about half of our side can't be bothered to run, track back or defend, we need these hard working players to have any hope of winning games. It's just unfortunate that Emerson & Ambrosini don't seem to be able to do the work loads they used to be able to.
Which is why i think we should get rid of them both and buy either Diaby or Blaise Matuidi from St. Etienne. I think the latter might be the better option as he's been putting in some great performances for St. Etienne this season. He's quick to break up attacks and is very good at distributing the ball, plus he's only 21 and French (no need for a non-eu spot). Buying him & Hamsik and bringing back Gourcuff & Abate to replace Ambrosini, Emerson & Seedorf would re-energise our midfield without spending a huge amount of money.
Jim about the defensive midfielders thing. We've played 2 DM's for the majority of this and last season (3 if you count Pirlo who does so little attacking he might as well have been a DM)) and besides weakening our attack, we STILL don't control the midfield. So then what's the point ? Should we play 3 instead? 4 ? Why can other teams play 1 or NO DM's and still control the midfield? Teams with even worse defenses than ours ? Because it's not about how many DM's but all about workrate...and our players have a poor workrate and no ideas in ball possession.
We've needed a box to box creative CM for a couple years now to do Seedorf's old job but we didn't get it. I'm sure Gourcuff could play that role but we all know about Gourcuff and Carlo's relationship. If Pirlo keeps stinking it up we'll also need a Fabregas/Cigarini type of player (who actually bothers to support the team in attack and defense). AM is solid with Kaka and in case he decides to leave at some point, Gourcuff can always take over AM. We've also needed a LB who can actually defend because we've known for some time now than Janku is a horrible defender. Maybe the plan is to bring Oddo back and play Zambro as LB ? We also may need a striker since Sheva doesn't count and Pippo is getting on in years.
Why do i kep reading Wengers name. Anyone can go out with a team of dirty nappies and win nothing. Since Wenger has started his policy of youth only, he has won jack all. What would change if Milan bought him in? Nothing, because hes a wimp who prefers to play kids and not have the pressure of competing with United and Chelsea. His board has offered him money which he refuses to use for someone older. End result, bunch of talented kids without a leader outside the top 4.
Ancelotti needs to be given a defence and a slap in the face for consistently relying on Emerson (How many DMs do we need playing at once).
Ancelkotti needs to be fired, and then he can slap who he wqants and I will not care.
Wenger broke all redords in EPl when he FOR ONCE had a normal team with Arsenal. But players choose to leave a club like Arsenal and he plays with KIDS! How do you expact a team with average year rating of like...21 I think to win EPL??? Between Chelsea, unied and L'pool? That is simply not possible.
Wenger also did great job in Monaco and does it now in Arsenal. Managment is selling players and earning money and he somehow manages to fight relatively well with bunch of children.
Wenger has won it all except CL, and with Arsenal that is more then enough.
Jim, I never watch youtube clips of defenders, its a moronic thing to do. We'll see how the careers of Agger and Santacroce develop, Im 100% sure Santacroce is 3 times a defender Agger is. No need to make fun of me in a childish way. Ciao.
Mystik: its not a question of 2DM's, 3DM's, 4DM's or none! Its a question of training and tactical sistem that doesnt work in Milan at all. I hope you all realised that already.
Lebanese
15-12-2008, 14:29
Ancelkotti needs to be fired, and then he can slap who he wqants and I will not care.
Wenger broke all redords in EPl when he FOR ONCE had a normal team with Arsenal. But players choose to leave a club like Arsenal and he plays with KIDS! How do you expact a team with average year rating of like...21 I think to win EPL??? Between Chelsea, unied and L'pool? That is simply not possible.
Wenger also did great job in Monaco and does it now in Arsenal. Managment is selling players and earning money and he somehow manages to fight relatively well with bunch of children.
Wenger has won it all except CL, and with Arsenal that is more then enough.
Jim, I never watch youtube clips of defenders, its a moronic thing to do. We'll see how the careers of Agger and Santacroce develop, Im 100% sure Santacroce is 3 times a defender Agger is. No need to make fun of me in a childish way. Ciao.
Mystik: its not a question of 2DM's, 3DM's, 4DM's or none! Its a question of training and tactical sistem that doesnt work in Milan at all. I hope you all realised that already.
:3band: THANKS MRKI
Originally posted by jim uk
If anything these players are all on the same level. I've seen as many bad games by Alex as good games and i'd like to know where were all these Santacroce fans last season? They weren't in here that's for sure, no one was even talking about him a year ago and yet now he's the new defensive messiah that'll cure all ills. What a joke. The guy has had a solid season last time round, a good half a season so far, hasn't been tested in the CL or Internationally and yet people are bleating about how great he is. A bit of balance is called for i think. Now before people moan, i'm not saying he's not a great player but to say he's 3 times better than someone who's playing at a higher level than him (Agger) is a bit much.
I read lots of nba draft analysis articles,They value players in numbers from different perspectives,such as physical attributes,basketball IQ,skills,stamina,court vision,work ethics....... and they do lots of statistics.evey draft is a gamble, we just choose the one whose odds higher.
If there is a draft report for defenders on this planet suit our limited budget. I agree with what mrki choose,even his players' sequence(I would add zapata before mexes).
though that 3time thing is too much,people sometimes do overspeak,haha.
Gabriel489
16-12-2008, 04:53
Maybe someone could list a coaching list that is currently available and good enough to coach Milan.
Is Hidduik avaible?
sheva-gila
16-12-2008, 05:12
Maybe someone could list a coaching list that is currently available and good enough to coach Milan.
Is Hidduik avaible?
there is some speculation about Leonardo taking over Ancelotti as a coach
sheva-gila
16-12-2008, 05:25
and its on channel4 , he just confessed a desire that one day he would like te be a milan coach
Ancelkotti needs to be fired, and then he can slap who he wqants and I will not care.
Wenger broke all redords in EPl when he FOR ONCE had a normal team with Arsenal. But players choose to leave a club like Arsenal and he plays with KIDS! How do you expact a team with average year rating of like...21 I think to win EPL??? Between Chelsea, unied and L'pool? That is simply not possible.
Wenger also did great job in Monaco and does it now in Arsenal. Managment is selling players and earning money and he somehow manages to fight relatively well with bunch of children.
Wenger has won it all except CL, and with Arsenal that is more then enough.
Jim, I never watch youtube clips of defenders, its a moronic thing to do. We'll see how the careers of Agger and Santacroce develop, Im 100% sure Santacroce is 3 times a defender Agger is. No need to make fun of me in a childish way. Ciao.
Mystik: its not a question of 2DM's, 3DM's, 4DM's or none! Its a question of training and tactical sistem that doesnt work in Milan at all. I hope you all realised that already.
You dont get my point. Wenger is not forced to play kids. It has become common knowledge here in England this year that Wenger has the money to go out and buy some players. He chooses not to and as a result he has a team full of headless chickens without a leader. Kind of the same situation we find our selves in now that Maldini can no longer lead by example. The only difference is they are a more energetic bunch of headless chickens.
And to say he has won everything is plain wrong. You quite rightly corrected yourself saying he hadnt won the CL. I will give him credit in that he competed with United when no one else did, but since United and Chelsea have upped their games he doesnt even challenge for the league anymore. Dont let your desperation to boot out Ancelotti allow you to start seeing mirages of wonder and light in people like Wenger who just wouldnt cut it at Milan. The whole reason people are on Ancelottis case is because we want success and we want it now. With Wenger you will have to wait and even then he wont make the final push.
Also one of the major gripes people here have about Ancelotti is his lack of forcefulness. Wenger is spineless so what would change there?
If someone suggests a realistic manager who will play entertaining football then we can think about getting rid of Ancelotti. At the moment I dont see one. What I do see is a yellow tie wearing scruge who has been raised in used good shops.
and its on channel4 , he just confessed a desire that one day he would like te be a milan coach
Probably he cant stand anymore with the way Ancelotti taking the team to infinity and beyond (joking.. I need them everytime we lost the match specially with one of our biggest enemy :D )
4-2.... yeah whatever :rollani:
Jim, I never watch youtube clips of defenders, its a moronic thing to do. We'll see how the careers of Agger and Santacroce develop, Im 100% sure Santacroce is 3 times a defender Agger is. No need to make fun of me in a childish way. Ciao.
I never said you watched youtube videos to see players, that was merely a general comment aimed at anyone judging Agger by the posted youtube video.
It's not about how their careers develop, it's about what level they are at present and currently there is no way that Santacroce is 3 times better than Agger.
If you make outlandish statements like this then you must expect some kind of response.
People say noone talked about Santacroce last season, but I did. Just watch him carefully and follow him through few games and you'll see. Plus, Napoli plays 3-5-2, and that means much when you evaluate a central defender.
Wenger is not a chicken who sells players coz he wants, and doesnt want to buy new ones. That is a crap written by media. Arsenal is not lead by Wenger but by people who invest money into the club. Wenger was furious when Flamini went, and he simple needed to let go of Vieira, Henry, Hleb etc. Coz Arsenal is smaller club then Juve, Milan, Barca etc. People want to play for legendary sides and they leave Arsenal.
Wenger won it all in England. And ONE he had a normal team he dominated EPL like noone did it before. I didnt say he was messiah, I said he is a great coach that could play brilliant football once managment stiops selling his best players like Arsenal does.
To thing Wenger doesnt wantnew players so he can play with childer and so be 4th and everything is ok is, in my oppinion, naive. There are no such things in modern football, only money is in quastion. If Arsenal keept Flamini, Hleb, and bought Nasri like they did they would go for 1st place 100%. Its not certain they would get it, but they would be in the fight for sure.
A manager better then Ancelotti is not RIGHT now available as NO managers are available. In the summer Cappello, Lippi, Mourinho were all free...
Managers can be bought, like every player. But managers have certain demands before they come to the club, and in Milansuch thing is not welcomed since Berlusconi has decided not to pay as he used to.
Beckham now, defender in the summer? Its a joke, dont you think so?
Santacroce - 3 times of Agger was a hiperbol I think that word is close to the english expression ). But I am convinced Santacroce is a much better defender then Agger. Let him play with Carragher and behind Alonso, MAscherano,m Gerrard and you'll see.
Remember, its just an example, Milan-Napoli and Santacroce untill he got injured? I hope you remember what he did to Seedorf and Dinho.
Im just saying, no hard feelings, that this manager canbt lead Milan anymore and that Milan needs to PAY for manager and for defender like Santacroce, Mexes and not fool ourselves by players like Beckham and coaches like Ancelotti.
P.S.
no matter that people liskile Moggi, I conside him maybe the best manager in footbalkl world. Just read his comments of milan "poor Ancelotti, they couldnt built more irrational team." I know you dont like that, but its a truth.
since we bought a defender for 10mE(if its true..),then i dont see galliani and braida getting either mexes or santacrocce,personally my favourites..and im 100% sure of their quality..
i think carlo has tottally lost his way,he has lost control..i mean i dont think that anyone belives that carlo can get us out of any situation anymore,maybe some players can(nesta eg)..but not carlo..even if we win the championship,i m not sure if he s the right man..
if i had to choose between a million of managers,id choose wenger,and whoever says that hes not a winner(in which i dont agree at all),he ll be under silvio..milans fans are not like arsenals..
wengers tactics will be played in 20 years from all the others..he just doesnt have the risht palyers..i can write a lot more but i dont have much time..
People say noone talked about Santacroce last season, but I did. Just watch him carefully and follow him through few games and you'll see. Plus, Napoli plays 3-5-2, and that means much when you evaluate a central defender.
Wenger is not a chicken who sells players coz he wants, and doesnt want to buy new ones. That is a crap written by media. Arsenal is not lead by Wenger but by people who invest money into the club. Wenger was furious when Flamini went, and he simple needed to let go of Vieira, Henry, Hleb etc. Coz Arsenal is smaller club then Juve, Milan, Barca etc. People want to play for legendary sides and they leave Arsenal.
Wenger won it all in England. And ONE he had a normal team he dominated EPL like noone did it before. I didnt say he was messiah, I said he is a great coach that could play brilliant football once managment stiops selling his best players like Arsenal does.
To thing Wenger doesnt wantnew players so he can play with childer and so be 4th and everything is ok is, in my oppinion, naive. There are no such things in modern football, only money is in quastion. If Arsenal keept Flamini, Hleb, and bought Nasri like they did they would go for 1st place 100%. Its not certain they would get it, but they would be in the fight for sure.
A manager better then Ancelotti is not RIGHT now available as NO managers are available. In the summer Cappello, Lippi, Mourinho were all free...
Managers can be bought, like every player. But managers have certain demands before they come to the club, and in Milansuch thing is not welcomed since Berlusconi has decided not to pay as he used to.
Beckham now, defender in the summer? Its a joke, dont you think so?
Santacroce - 3 times of Agger was a hiperbol I think that word is close to the english expression ). But I am convinced Santacroce is a much better defender then Agger. Let him play with Carragher and behind Alonso, MAscherano,m Gerrard and you'll see.
Remember, its just an example, Milan-Napoli and Santacroce untill he got injured? I hope you remember what he did to Seedorf and Dinho.
Im just saying, no hard feelings, that this manager canbt lead Milan anymore and that Milan needs to PAY for manager and for defender like Santacroce, Mexes and not fool ourselves by players like Beckham and coaches like Ancelotti.
P.S.
no matter that people liskile Moggi, I conside him maybe the best manager in footbalkl world. Just read his comments of milan "poor Ancelotti, they couldnt built more irrational team." I know you dont like that, but its a truth.
nice post mate,once again we totally agree..
People say noone talked about Santacroce last season, but I did. Just watch him carefully and follow him through few games and you'll see. Plus, Napoli plays 3-5-2, and that means much when you evaluate a central defender.
Wenger is not a chicken who sells players coz he wants, and doesnt want to buy new ones. That is a crap written by media. Arsenal is not lead by Wenger but by people who invest money into the club. Wenger was furious when Flamini went, and he simple needed to let go of Vieira, Henry, Hleb etc. Coz Arsenal is smaller club then Juve, Milan, Barca etc. People want to play for legendary sides and they leave Arsenal.
Wenger won it all in England. And ONE he had a normal team he dominated EPL like noone did it before. I didnt say he was messiah, I said he is a great coach that could play brilliant football once managment stiops selling his best players like Arsenal does.
To thing Wenger doesnt wantnew players so he can play with childer and so be 4th and everything is ok is, in my oppinion, naive. There are no such things in modern football, only money is in quastion. If Arsenal keept Flamini, Hleb, and bought Nasri like they did they would go for 1st place 100%. Its not certain they would get it, but they would be in the fight for sure.
A manager better then Ancelotti is not RIGHT now available as NO managers are available. In the summer Cappello, Lippi, Mourinho were all free...
Managers can be bought, like every player. But managers have certain demands before they come to the club, and in Milansuch thing is not welcomed since Berlusconi has decided not to pay as he used to.
Beckham now, defender in the summer? Its a joke, dont you think so?
Santacroce - 3 times of Agger was a hiperbol I think that word is close to the english expression ). But I am convinced Santacroce is a much better defender then Agger. Let him play with Carragher and behind Alonso, MAscherano,m Gerrard and you'll see.
Remember, its just an example, Milan-Napoli and Santacroce untill he got injured? I hope you remember what he did to Seedorf and Dinho.
Im just saying, no hard feelings, that this manager canbt lead Milan anymore and that Milan needs to PAY for manager and for defender like Santacroce, Mexes and not fool ourselves by players like Beckham and coaches like Ancelotti.
P.S.
no matter that people liskile Moggi, I conside him maybe the best manager in footbalkl world. Just read his comments of milan "poor Ancelotti, they couldnt built more irrational team." I know you dont like that, but its a truth.
You are so obviously taking Moggi's quote out of context. It is clear he is directing his attack at 'they' who happen to be Berlusconi and Galliani. He is sympathising with Ancelotti.
About Wenger:
Firstly he didnt dominate the EPL. How many league titles did he succesfully defend? A big fat 0. That is not domination. Wenger won 3 titles and since he won his first Fergy has won 6 and Chelsea 2. United and Chelsea have both succesfully defended their titles.
What else has he won IN ENGLAND? FA cups and Carling cups. How desperate are you for Milan to win the Copa Italia?---Exactly!
What else has he won, nothing in Europe, not a french league title. Nothing why do you persist on saying he has wont everything. 3 Premiership titles before Abromvich's Chelsea is a good achievement, but doesnt make him the saviour of Milan.
Then you insist on exaggerating again by saying he won the title with a "normal team". Lets just name some of these "Normal players" - Henry, Viera, Petit, Bergkamp, Overmars, Anelka, Pires. Far from normal.
And I never said he didnt want to lose his players, what I DID say is that he doesnt want to go out and buy experienced world class players. His management have said that he has money to spend. He has said he is more interested in developing youth.
About this season and not being able to challenge. Ok he has lost some players, but what about the last 3 seasons before this. No where near challenging. If Carlo is a weak, then Wenger certainly is, do you even know what Gallas has been doing over the past 12 months, yet he still has a place at Arsenal.
I find it amazing how you blame the board for Arsenal's lack of success or 'fight' and say Wenger is a good manager because they play good football and win nothing despite lack of spending
But when it comes to Ancelotti, he is the antichrist regardless of how many players he gets (all in the same positions) or doesnt get and the fact that he has won Milan things in similar circumstances.
No man, you misunderstood me. Moggi's quote is against Galliani, not against Ancelotti. In there I was commenting them, not Carlo in this case.
by "normal" team I think a team that is a great team and that can win a title. Like every team that wins in england, Italy and Spain is. That was the team Wenger had great players in, and they played brilliantly. that is all I wanted to say. That means a "normal" team in a going-for-title meaning. Of course, I hope you'll admit it, none can except wenger will win titles with every year one or two of his standard players being sold. Ferguson has more money on his disopsal and always had better players, so is the new Chalsea under Abramovic.
Benitez - hew has won ZERO in England ( won CL ! as he is anextraordinary coach ), but I consider him one of world's top coaches. But he simply hasnt got the players to wil 38 rounds league.
no coach in the world can save Milan without players, but with this players we have we are not doing well ENOUGH in any case.
The fact Ferguson won more and Chelsky did also means nothing when we talk about Wenger and his kids he plays with.
And, Im talking friendly in here, please dont bellieve Wenger didnt want to buy players. Coaches say what they need to say in public, I hope you learned that as a Milan fan. You think Arsenal board would say "yes" to a team that canot win EPL just coz manager doesnt want expencive players? Really? Titles mean money, fans, comercials... Arsenal lives off sale. That is why Arsenal is not as big as Barca, Madrid, Milan, Juve, United.
hitmannq8
16-12-2008, 15:44
mrki you are 100% right with everything you said but one. Arsene Wenger is not a coach you compare Ancelotti with. Yea yeah he won a couple of leagues when there was only two teams to compete, but when Chelsea got stronger they havent gotten close. Yea yea they reached the CL final but hey so did Monaco, and Porto and Red Star Belgrade (but the latter 2 teams won it). Wenger is not someone I would ever want at Milan. His mentality is for a UEFA cup team, he is lucky that the premiership is such a poor division and they do not have teams strong enough to fight for CL.
Wenger is not a chicken who sells players coz he wants, and doesnt want to buy new ones. That is a crap written by media. Arsenal is not lead by Wenger but by people who invest money into the club. Wenger was furious when Flamini went, and he simple needed to let go of Vieira, Henry, Hleb etc.
This quote is totally irrational (like the team Milan is building ... if we believe Moggi, the most successfull lier and cheater in football world), especially coming from you !!
Don't you bash Ancelotti for exactly the same thing ??
So, if I understand like it has to be understood, Ancelotti is nothing because he can't say anything to Berlusconi and because he doesn't get what he wants and stays, but Wenger is a genius despite he does exactly the same thing in a smaller club than Milan with, surely, less egocentric "managers" ??
And don't forget that in England, coaches are also managers, not like in Italy, so if tomorrow Wenger comes to Milan (what I really don't hope), he'll just be a coach who'll have to shut up.
I can't understand why some people here underestimate Wenger. He did GREAT job with Arsenal. When MU 'owned' the league, Wenger was the one who broke that tradition (The Gunner competed with MU every year) AND he did with a team that not was supported (money) like MU were supported, for example.
Make it difference between Maurinho (or even Ferguson) and Wenger. Maurinho and Ferguson had the money to buy certain players they want but not Wenger. Wenger did have money for transfer but not as big as MU especially Chelsea (under Maurinho). Beside that thing, Wenger can't also stop his players moving out from London but coach like Maurinho and Fergie (because of their clubs' superiority in money) can stop players leaving out their clubs. This thing made big difference for Arsenal in the last 4-5 years when their big stars left the club (either moved to other club or retired).
Someone mentioned that Wenger's mentality is only for UEFA Cup team and I think this is pure absurd. Had Carlo won CL thropy when he came to Milan?
The problem Wenger has, like others have said, that his character (with respect to transfer policy) is just like Carlo. He can only accept what his boss tells (gives) him.
Carlo is not a coach, as a coach's job is to improve players and develop, and I don't see that in Milan. He's a great manager, tactically a bit naive at times, and stubborn with playing any youth players, unless his hand is forced, but not a great coach.
Gabriel489
17-12-2008, 05:28
and its on channel4 , he just confessed a desire that one day he would like te be a milan coach
Leo just does not seems like the type of Coach we need at the moment. He will be another push over like Carlo.
Having said that, he will be more creative than Carlo, like playing with Two strikers from the start. But at the end, Leo does not and will not have the respect of guys like Seedorf and others.
Gabriel489
17-12-2008, 05:46
To be honest, Wenger is a GREAT PLAYER developer. IF he actually can keep players like Henry, Helb, Ashley COle, Flamini and others, Arsenal will be challenging the league. What Wenger is good at is finding the right players for his system, or changing the player's abilitiy to fit into his system. Something that Carlo can't do. For example, there is nothing wrong with the X'mas tree formation, however, our players just can't fit into that system naturally. On top of that, some of our players(maybe due to their exp and pride) refuse to do what Carlo had asked them to do on the pitch, since they all know that Carlo will play them as long as they are not injured.
Thats the difference between Wenger and Carlo. As of now, players under Wenger still listen to him and do what he said on the pitch, whereas guys like Seedorf is just making sure he does not look bad on the pitch.
Personally, I think Wenger is a better coach, b/c in game wise, his changes are great and he demands his players to do what he plans on the pitch. Carlo in game decision are crap, may I remind you of what he did against Pool a few yrs ago, subbing out Crespo(who scored 2 goals), and since a few yrs back, Carlo just kept playing players by their name only instead of quality.
To be the best coach for a team like Milan are Capello, JM and RB. As they are coachese that will sit their players if they are not performing well, good at max. players strength and great in game adjustment.
since they all know that Carlo will play them as long as they are not injured.
This is the worst thing from Carlo (beside his fear to try something new). No need to tell more, the line-up/formation tells itself.
This quote is totally irrational (like the team Milan is building ... if we believe Moggi, the most successfull lier and cheater in football world), especially coming from you !!
Don't you bash Ancelotti for exactly the same thing ??
So, if I understand like it has to be understood, Ancelotti is nothing because he can't say anything to Berlusconi and because he doesn't get what he wants and stays, but Wenger is a genius despite he does exactly the same thing in a smaller club than Milan with, surely, less egocentric "managers" ??
And don't forget that in England, coaches are also managers, not like in Italy, so if tomorrow Wenger comes to Milan (what I really don't hope), he'll just be a coach who'll have to shut up.
First, lets remove the hostile tunes from our dialogles... :heart: hahaha!
Moggi - Luciano Moggi is ( and Im sure 95% of people in this forum will say it, and most valuebly people like Tony29, Giovanni and Giancarlo :) ) one of the best experts in football in the past 30 years. The fact he is a liar and a mafioso doesnt mean a thing when we talk about his mercato and tactical accomplishments. Players Moggi took for Juve ( most of the transfers were simply brilliant and he RARELLy missed with invested money ), the way HE turned Zidane into central attacking midfielder ( that is PURE truth, you can check it if you can find it, I dont lie I swear, Zizou said so. ), the way he choose coaches for Juve and sold players when they needed to be sold. Moggi is a man that knows everything about football. Subjective feelčing that we dont like him in irelevant in that matter.
Ancelotti is a coward ( in my oppinoin, which doesnt touch yOU, but speaks directly on thesubject . Wenger vs Carlo -), and with the players he gets he doesnt do as much as he needs to do. Wenger does much more with the quality of the players he has on his disposal and makes 100% of each player he has in his team, while players in Milan fall like they have been playing football and thought about tactical setup for the first time in their lives.
Talking about league titles: You need to understand that in EPL Arsenal is NOT a top club like Milan in Italy is. United, L'pool and Shelsea are. With L'pool being a sleepy giant and most prestigous club in England.
Ancelotti had ONE scudetto: With Parma he simply needed to take it and he blew it away, with Juve he was 9th ( 9th with Moggi's Juve! ) and now Milan will end X-mas season with -9 after completely missplaied games vs Torino, Cagliari, Lecce, Palermo, Bologna etc. Juve loss is not a disaster, its Juve in Torino and they are always favorites there.
Imagine Wenger having Milan team and not selling any players each summer, but just bringing 3 young guys ( Silva, LB and one midfielder ). And the rest of the team stays as it is. The important for coaches is that they get maximum out of their players, and I dont think Ancelotti is able to do so.
Managers in EPL does not mean they run the club, its not the right translation for that manner.
Ancelotti had ONE scudetto...
All seems to make good sense except this piece. We know he also won the CL more often than Wenger, reaches final more often (and screw up more often too lol), though I agree that Ancelotti may not be the best league performer as far as Milan is concerned.
First, lets remove the hostile tunes from our dialogles... :heart: hahaha!
No hostility from me against you :beer:
If you think there is, so I said something in a wrong way and you would be very nice to tell me where (to allow me to change that), and if it is because I often reply you, it's just that we almost always disagree !! lol
About Moggi, ok, it was just a joke, umh not really a joke, just irony, he made "amazing" job in Juventus in the choice of players, but he made it in a way that cost so much to this club (Serie B, players sold) and so, I clearly can't take him as an example in anything.
Ancelotti is a coward ( in my oppinoin, which doesnt touch yOU, but speaks directly on thesubject . Wenger vs Carlo -), and with the players he gets he doesnt do as much as he needs to do. Wenger does much more with the quality of the players he has on his disposal and makes 100% of each player he has in his team, while players in Milan fall like they have been playing football and thought about tactical setup for the first time in their lives.
But if he is a coward because he doesn't get any of the players he asks for and doesn't leave, so Wenger is a coward too ?!
Anyway, about these two coaches, I'll explain later in this same reply ...
Imagine Wenger having Milan team and not selling any players each summer, but just bringing 3 young guys ( Silva, LB and one midfielder ). And the rest of the team stays as it is. The important for coaches is that they get maximum out of their players, and I dont think Ancelotti is able to do so.
Managers in EPL does not mean they run the club, its not the right translation for that manner.
Here comes my vision of Ancelotti and Wenger ...
You say that Wenger would do amazing things if he was in Milan by bringing our best players and adding young ones each year ... what I think about that is that it would be impossible, the best players, the ones who have the most developped ego generally too, would leave the club with Wenger as a coach. Henry didn't leave because he was more paid in Barcelona, Gallas won't leave to be paid more (even if for Gallas, the problem is also himself being totally stupid lol), etc.
For me, Wenger can develop players, like Gabriel said, and he's even probably the best coach to develop young players in the world ... but he can't manage a complete team with young promising players and older established ones. He is ok with young ones, probably because of authority of something like that, but that doesn't work with older ones, they don't need another "father".
Ancelotti is the contrary, he knows how to manage established players in a same team, but he gets some problems with the younger ones ...
Actually, if we replace Ancelotti today, it would be to find a coach who is a fusion between Wenger and Ancelotti ... the most complete coach I think.
And about our loss against Juventus, I won't agree again with you mrki (sic, I thought we would agree about this match, but apparely, not lol), I think this defeat is very important ... not because we lost 4-2 in Turin, but because I never saw "grinta", motivation, etc in our players (even if some of our best players missed, but it's not an excuse), it was the first time I saw our team like that against one our main rivals, we played great or at least we played with a lot of motivation against Inter and Napoli, but we did nothing against Juventus ... I end there, it has nothing to do in a mercato topic anyway, sorry.
Here comes my vision of Ancelotti and Wenger ...
You say that Wenger would do amazing things if he was in Milan by bringing our best players and adding young ones each year ... what I think about that is that it would be impossible, the best players, the ones who have the most developped ego generally too, would leave the club with Wenger as a coach. Henry didn't leave because he was more paid in Barcelona, Gallas won't leave to be paid more (even if for Gallas, the problem is also himself being totally stupid lol), etc.
For me, Wenger can develop players, like Gabriel said, and he's even probably the best coach to develop young players in the world ... but he can't manage a complete team with young promising players and older established ones. He is ok with young ones, probably because of authority of something like that, but that doesn't work with older ones, they don't need another "father".
Did you already watch Arsenal under Wenger when his players were like Tony Adams, David Seeman (spelling?), Emmanuel Pettit, etc?
Your bold part I think is really absurd. Wenger did win the EPL couple of times with a combined squad (old and young players). Like in the year he win EPL without any single lost.
The problem Wenger has in Arsenal, like you said, are that he has same mentality with Carlo with respect of transfer policy made by his boss and Arsenal don't have money as much as other team so he can't stop his best players going out from London and also can't buy experienced players like other big club spending their money on world class players.
It's like Real Madrid or Chelsea wanted Kaka. They (Real and Chelsea) have the money for Milan (a huge offer), they have money for Kaka (super salary) and they have prestige (Real Madrid). But Milan have 'bumper' to prevent Kaka's transfer because Milan are the same club as Real or Chelsea. Milan have money for Kaka (big salary) and also have prestige like Real Madrid.
Make the same case for Arsenal. Arsenal players will easily go to other club like Barca, Real or Chelsea if these clubs offer huge amount of money for players (and also big salary) except the players have no intention to leave Arsenal (this is a different case, like Fabregas' case). Arsenal also don't have prestige like Real Madrid, Barca even Juventus.
From channel4 :
One of Galliani's comment : “We think that we have an ultra-competitive squad, but six or seven injuries is a lot."
LOL Galliani!
Did you already watch Arsenal under Wenger when his players were like Tony Adams, David Seeman (spelling?), Emmanuel Pettit, etc?
Your bold part I think is really absurd. Wenger did win the EPL couple of times with a combined squad (old and young players). Like in the year he win EPL without any single lost.
A good manager doesn't only win, he's able to keep a good atmosphere in the team ... and, as far as my memory goes, there's always been problems.
Graeme C
17-12-2008, 16:58
Having such a old squad, its not surprising we have so many injuries...
Bundesliga
15.12.2008 13:18:44
Vedad Ibisevic has scored 18 goals in the first half of the season
Ibisevic - the goalgetter
He scores and scores and scores. If Vedad Ibisevic carries on like that, even Gerd Müller's all-time record could be threatened.
1899 Hoffenheim's Bosnian goalgetter has scored 18 goals in the first half of the season and could at least come close to the 40 goals Müller scored for FC Bayern in 1971/72.
Müller, who had scored an all-time record 365 Bundesliga goals in total, reckons that Ibisevic has the quality to break his record.
"Not normal"
Hoffenheim coach Ralf Rangnick claims that ibisevic is more prolific than anyone he has seen during his whole career.
Ibisevic, who had joined Hoffenheim from Alemannia Aachen, is struggling to explain why he scores so many goals: "That's not normal!"
Berlu and Galliani should move heaven and earth to sign this season's deadliest striker ! :510:
Gabriel489
17-12-2008, 23:59
Am I the only one here that is glad Sanderous got hurt by just kicking a ball last nite.
Now if Galli and Berlu still don't see this guy is useless for the rest of the season, I don't know what will.
With NEsta and Bonera out for at least another two months, Sanderous is useless, and Kaladaze's mind is off having a vacation. Milan is only left with Maldini and Favalli as CB, with Darmian. Well, sounds like Zapata is coming to Milan to me.
remote2book
18-12-2008, 00:22
omg anyone read this!! http://www.goal.com/en/news/1711/chelsea/2008/12/18/1017477/alex-i-must-leave-chelsea
alex really wants to leave chelsea!! i know he is non-eu is there ANY possible way we can get him in january!! it would be amazing!!
No hostility from me against you :beer:
If you think there is, so I said something in a wrong way and you would be very nice to tell me where (to allow me to change that), and if it is because I often reply you, it's just that we almost always disagree !! lol
About Moggi, ok, it was just a joke, umh not really a joke, just irony, he made "amazing" job in Juventus in the choice of players, but he made it in a way that cost so much to this club (Serie B, players sold) and so, I clearly can't take him as an example in anything.
But if he is a coward because he doesn't get any of the players he asks for and doesn't leave, so Wenger is a coward too ?!
Anyway, about these two coaches, I'll explain later in this same reply ...
Here comes my vision of Ancelotti and Wenger ...
You say that Wenger would do amazing things if he was in Milan by bringing our best players and adding young ones each year ... what I think about that is that it would be impossible, the best players, the ones who have the most developped ego generally too, would leave the club with Wenger as a coach. Henry didn't leave because he was more paid in Barcelona, Gallas won't leave to be paid more (even if for Gallas, the problem is also himself being totally stupid lol), etc.
For me, Wenger can develop players, like Gabriel said, and he's even probably the best coach to develop young players in the world ... but he can't manage a complete team with young promising players and older established ones. He is ok with young ones, probably because of authority of something like that, but that doesn't work with older ones, they don't need another "father".
Ancelotti is the contrary, he knows how to manage established players in a same team, but he gets some problems with the younger ones ...
Actually, if we replace Ancelotti today, it would be to find a coach who is a fusion between Wenger and Ancelotti ... the most complete coach I think.
And about our loss against Juventus, I won't agree again with you mrki (sic, I thought we would agree about this match, but apparely, not lol), I think this defeat is very important ... not because we lost 4-2 in Turin, but because I never saw "grinta", motivation, etc in our players (even if some of our best players missed, but it's not an excuse), it was the first time I saw our team like that against one our main rivals, we played great or at least we played with a lot of motivation against Inter and Napoli, but we did nothing against Juventus ... I end there, it has nothing to do in a mercato topic anyway, sorry.
Thankfully, someone here is talking without any bias!!
One thing I will say is that everybody here goes on about Ancelotti not playing young and unestablished players. OK Gourcuff and Gilardino didnt perform. Yes I admit Ancelotti was totally wreckless and irresponsible with Gourcuff, there are no excuses, but Gilardino had an unlimited number of chances and his failure was down to himself.
Ancelotti has made a success of other young and unestablished players. Why does he get all the blame and none of the credit. He is the one who managed Kaka's integration into the team. He is the one who has used Pato as a starter all season. He is the one who fit Pirlo into the team. He is the one who turned red card magnet Bonera into a reliable defender. He is the one who allowed Gatusso to grow from an average ex Rangers player into Rino. He is the one who has oversaw Ambrosini finally fulflll his potential. Even when Seedorf came to Milan, his career was in trouble and with Carlo's help he has since won two more CL titles. He is the one who has managed to ballance this bunch of Galacticos and get fat Ronaldhinio who Barca had thrown away into a player who is winning us points. These players all had potential and he has brought a hell of alot out of them.
So yes, maybe he failed with Gourcuff and Gila, but how many young and talented players does he honestly get to work with. How many future world stars does this man actually get to develop. People here demand to see Darmian, what a joke. Who was the last Milan youth product to make it big. What makes you think he is even good enough for Carlo to risk his neck for. At the end of the day, the man has to put up with Galliani's insane mercato and for the sake of his own job he cant risk playing young players. Milan does not have the same low expectations as Arsenal.
Now lets consider the so called Messiah Wenger. How many players has he failed. Only days ago Portsmouth sold Diarra to Real Madrid for 20M. Diarra has blasted Wenger for not giving him a chance when he was at Arsenal. Then lets consider players like Francis Jeffers, Jermain Pennant, Geremie Allidierre, Nicolas Anelka. What about Ebboue who was one of the hottest rightbacks in Europe not so long ago. Now Arsenal fans boo him. If Ancelotti gets the blame for Gila then Wenger gets the blame for this. Even Flamini was on the bench for a couple of seasons without getting any playing time. Think of how much development he lost and then Wenger has the nerve to blame us for stealing him when in reality he is the one who burnt his bridges with Flamini by ignoring him.
Carlo has his faults, as do all managers. The fact is that he is having to rely on the worst defence most of us Mian fans have ever seen us have. To add to that we dont have a single striker capable of getting 24 goals. How on earth can anyone expect anything more than this from him?
omg anyone read this!! http://www.goal.com/en/news/1711/chelsea/2008/12/18/1017477/alex-i-must-leave-chelsea
alex really wants to leave chelsea!! i know he is non-eu is there ANY possible way we can get him in january!! it would be amazing!!
I am concerned what Milan has a front 3 of Brazillians and if we get Alex we would have a back two of Brazillians. With all the other nationalities in the team, there is a serious lack of Italian influence.
The problem with Carlo is that he tursts the same players in every game, even some or many of them played terribly. This yields to a conclusion that there is no reward and punishment in his system. The same Kaladze, Seedorf will always play no matter how bad they are. This brings no competition to the team. It's useless to have substitutes if there is rarely fair decision on choosing the players for a game.
What we lack of (or even don't have on certain games) is motivation. There were only few players who play with their heart from one game to another game. Gattuso is one of them. The others are crap with respect of their motivation in a game. This is influenced by the pick order Carlo has IMO. If a player is sure that he will play no matter how bad he plays, then why should he care about his performance?
For me, there are two possibilities to overcome that problem (actuall three but we can't fire Galliani right? :D). The first one is to sack Carlo and bring a new coach to make a new challenge for all players and second to still keep in faith on Carlo but Galliani co. must bring hiqh quality players that can compete (with respect of Carlo standard : established players or wonderkids ala Kaka or Pato) with our current players. This happened with Gattuso.
If Gattuso didn't have his huge motivation this season, he would be easily kicked by Flamini to the bench. He would be trusted by Carlo (like Carlo trusts Kaladze, Seedorf, Pirlo etc.) to play in Gattuso's position (if Gattuso were still same like last season) because Flamini is a high quality player and an established one, a minimum qualification to get Carlo's faith.
I understand about your concern K77SHC. I have no objection to 3 Brasilian strikers as lately Italy doesn't produce many brilliant promising strikers. We just dump one to Firenze.
But personally, I prefer Italian defenders as both Italy and Milan have a glorious tradition of producing world best defenders. It's sad that after Franco and Paolo, no other talented CB came from our youth.
But I'm not worried about the lack of Italian influence, we still have more Italian palyers in starting eleven than our cousin
I understand about your concern K77SHC. I have no objection to 3 Brasilian strikers as lately Italy doesn't produce many brilliant promising strikers. We just dump one to Firenze.
But personally, I prefer Italian defenders as both Italy and Milan have a glorious tradition of producing world best defenders. It's sad that after Franco and Paolo, no other talented CB came from our youth.
But I'm not worried about the lack of Italian influence, we still have more Italian palyers in starting eleven than our cousin
Actually the problem with producing great defenders happens not only with Milan but also with other teams. We can look at now the situation with italian defenders. Who is now great (already not in progress) defender? It's arguably only Chiellini.
So, it's very difficult now to find great or just good italian defenders. I agree with opinion of using italian defenders but if there is no posibility to have them, we should then turn to other nationality IMO.
Nowadays, I think the best defense possible in Italy with Italian players would be something like Zambrotta (not sure at all anyway), Chiellini, Santacroce, and ... probably Bonera.
Siregar, I disagree with your thought about Kaladze remaining in the starting XI every single match even when he is very bad because Ancelotti can't change his mind ...
Let's play a game, you are Ancelotti and you have the following team:
- Nesta is out
- Bonera is out
- Maldini is old and can't play two games in a row
- same for Favalli (who is far from Maldini in defensive skills lol)
- Darmian is ... we don't know how he is (why don't they loan him ??)
- Senderos is out one month after each game played (and he isn't good at all)
- other defenders such as Zambrotta, Antonini and, not a defender at all actually, Jankulovski, have to play on the sides.
Who plays in your defense ??
Kaladze-Favalli and Kaladze-Maldini, you have no other choices with the current team actually.
And let's pray that Kaladze who plays really bad nowadays doesn't get an injury, or we will have an unfit Favalli-Maldini in defense (unfit because after 2 games, they will not be fit anymore).
PS: About Wenger, despite his ability to develop young players (K77SH_C, he wasted many players of course, but when you have a team with 20 kids, you can't use the 20 just to develop them, you need to win too ^^, so you put the best ones on the pitch more often than the other ones), do you seriously think he has the right skills to make good tactics in Serie A ? I'm not sure at all ...
Nowadays, I think the best defense possible in Italy with Italian players would be something like Zambrotta (not sure at all anyway), Chiellini, Santacroce, and ... probably Bonera.
Siregar, I disagree with your thought about Kaladze remaining in the starting XI every single match even when he is very bad because Ancelotti can't change his mind ...
Let's play a game, you are Ancelotti and you have the following team:
- Nesta is out
- Bonera is out
- Maldini is old and can't play two games in a row
- same for Favalli (who is far from Maldini in defensive skills lol)
- Darmian is ... we don't know how he is (why don't they loan him ??)
- Senderos is out one month after each game played (and he isn't good at all)
- other defenders such as Zambrotta, Antonini and, not a defender at all actually, Jankulovski, have to play on the sides.
Who plays in your defense ??
Kaladze-Favalli and Kaladze-Maldini, you have no other choices with the current team actually.
And let's pray that Kaladze who plays really bad nowadays doesn't get an injury, or we will have an unfit Favalli-Maldini in defense (unfit because after 2 games, they will not be fit anymore).
An easy example last game against Wolfsburg. Kaladze was disaster against Juve and again was trusted by Carlo to substitute Senderos. Why not Darmian? UEFA Cup is not our priority. If Carlo 'dared' to play unfit Senderos (in a game where Senderos made debut) why couldn't Carlo trust Darmian who is now on his second year with Milan's first-team squad? But he instead put a defender who his errors can't be accepted anymore.
In Serie A is another example. Carlo used Kaladze instead of Favalli. He did pretty good job partnering with Bonera than Carlo trusted Kaladze again and again.
The reality is that Kaladze's current quality isn't worth for Serie A especially for a big team like Milan!
rinogattuso
18-12-2008, 07:52
An easy example last game against Wolfsburg. Kaladze was disaster against Juve and again was trusted by Carlo to substitute Senderos. Why not Darmian? UEFA Cup is not our priority. If Carlo 'dared' to play unfit Senderos (in a game where Senderos made debut) why couldn't Carlo trust Darmian who is now on his second year with Milan's first-team squad? But he instead put a defender who his errors can't be accepted anymore.
In Serie A is another example. Carlo used Kaladze instead of Favalli. He did pretty good job partnering with Bonera than Carlo trusted Kaladze again and again.
The reality is that Kaladze's current quality isn't worth for Serie A especially for a big team like Milan!
Because Dzeko is much stronger than Darmian and he will crush young boy..
Kaladze is disaster this year and that is that..
Who is Dzeko?
Edit : you mean big striker from Wolfsburg? I don't think that was the reason. Dzeko, from what I watched, was marked by Favalli and not by Kaladze.
But the point is Carlo still and will only trust same players (established one) EVEN they played horribly (no reward and punishment). :)
rinogattuso
18-12-2008, 08:44
Who is Dzeko?
Edit : you mean big striker from Wolfsburg? I don't think that was the reason. Dzeko, from what I watched, was marked by Favalli and not by Kaladze.
But the point is Carlo still and will only trust same players (established one) EVEN they played horribly (no reward and punishment). :)
You are completlly wrong about markink,Favalli plays with more fredom than georgian who had hard battle with Dzeko,he is best player on pitch last night along side Pato!!
Favalli had good game last night,but kaladze was disaster..
Ancelotti want's reinforcment in the defense line..
You are completlly wrong about markink,Favalli plays with more fredom than georgian who had hard battle with Dzeko,he is best player on pitch last night along side Pato!!
Favalli had good game last night,but kaladze was disaster..
Ancelotti want's reinforcment in the defense line..
Well, what I watched is that that big striker was on Favalli's position and Favalli who was the one that was responsible to guard him. So, if you say 'completely wrong' it could be you watched other game. LOL.
Kaladze is (almost) always disaster this season.
a) When we talk about quality of CB's we need to understand that its always a pairing of two players we are talking about. Why Kaladze performed some extraordinary games as a CB for Milan ( yes he did have his brilliant games )? Becouse he palyed next to Nesta. Defenders depend on their CB pair as no other two players on the field. To play alongside Nesta makes you 30% better player. Nesta copntrolls space and allows you to just go and clean the passes, but with slower Maldini, Senderos, Bonera, Favalli that is not possible for Kaladze. Kaladze is a "violent" and aggresive player (not that he is unfair, but he is not playing with brains but with power ). Just wanted to explain that.
b) Geo Tav its all ok, no hard feelings. But right now I cannot talk about Wenger vs Carlo again as I dont have enough time to respond to all those posts ( which were very nice to see on MM, a real football debate ).
I just want to say that I do not say Wenger is a Millan messiah ( someone constantly is putting that words in my mouth, Im sorry but I cannot remember which poster exactly says that right now. No offence to that person. ).
About Wenger and players in and out of Arsenal. Players didnt leave Arsenal coz of Wenger, or coz of money, but becouse Arsenal is not a top european culb like the big ones that dominate Europe ( milan, Juve, Barcelona, Madrid, United...). People want to play in the best possible club and they just leave. A coach cannot stop players go. But a coach can choose which players to bring in, and he rarelly misses. Yes he had some misses, but comparing to sucessfull players he brought in, its nothing.
Eboue failed becouse Sagna was simply better, aldough I really liked the way Eboue plays.
Wenger in Milan? You asked me that: I was just sayin', if Wenger has Milan players and yout picks few kids (3 players ) like he did in Arsenal he would be able to construct a great team. But if Galliani and Berlusconi buy players FOr Wenger, than there is no point of bringing Wenger to Milan in ANY case. They are doing it for Carlo and things are not working as you can see.
I want to say this: bring Wenger, let him bring 3 young players and bring back Yoan, ( lb, CM and one forward he chooses ) and he will not ruin them. Pato and Yoan will play good and some players will be benched. We lack profesionalism right now, its visible.
Same guilt goest to Berlusconi who doesnt want to pay as much as today's football asks to. So Ancelotti is a manager for him, that is the way things go when you dont want to spend money.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Alex ( Chelsea ) - great player, but is a non-eu. Fortunately we bought VIUDEZ! ( maybe he is a son of an important politician or something...but to use non-eu place for him is .....its.....(Im just wawing my hands now!).
Cheers people, continue with good posts.
Great post Mrki
But i ought to disagree with you on a couple of points.
1) players didn't leave Arsenal because its not a top club but because they didnt see it becoming a big club anytime in the near future. Wenger is an arrogant man who does not like to be corrected. He is a top manager but he's stuck up on a few things and those exact things are not letting Arsenal become the best in England.
Arsenal has done everything a top club has.. they've also reached the Champions League Final and had an unbeaten season but yet he fails to reach that highest level. David Villa is a top top player and he wanted to join them. It's not about attracting players.
2) Professionalism is what Arsenal lack because kids are not professional. We must understand that Wenger will do things in a way that might not suit Milan. He's not made for every club.
I do agree with what you sad about Eboue. I liked him a lot until became a twunt. His ability to bring useful players is also high. Plus he knows when to sell them. Look at Benitez.. pathetic at the transfer market.. just awful.
But i have a serious problem with him. I agree with Platini about the whole poaching issue and even though Milan have done it as well, they still arent as bad as Wenger who is of course the leader. His contribution to domestic English football players is close to nil and I dont want a Milan which has no players in the Italian squad.
Bring back Rijkaard and give him some money Berlusconi you corrupt b*****d and watch him turn things around.
Graeme C
18-12-2008, 13:16
saying that Carlo played kakas brother last year and he was useless. Darmian should start, worst case sub him in the game. We will never know how good he is unless we try.
Grill me if you will, but I think the problem with players in italy is the same as in England. Theres too many foreign players comming through. Milan has gone brazilian crazy... I cant see what Dida, Emerson and even Pato at times could do that italian player couldnt? Ive always thought milans defence should be a italian, and it troubles me with the rumours of brazilians comming in defence. After Baresi and Tassoti left, Milan signed dutch players and it was a big mistake.. i can see it happening again!
kastriot
18-12-2008, 13:23
Bring back Rijkaard and give him some money Berlusconi you corrupt b*****d and watch him turn things around.
Did i miss anything, or just greatly insulted Berlusconi...regardless of your opinion,there are people here who beside considering Berlu as the president of the team they love, they support his politics too, and dont forget that he is still the PM of some Italians in this forum,who might feel highly offended by your comment.
Giovanni
18-12-2008, 17:40
I haven't followed the debate of the last month, so you will forgive me.
I'm always been a pro- Carlo and always defended him, but in all honesty some of his decisions by late have let me completely shocked.
I think Carlo's future is already decided if he doesn't win the scudetto, which is almost impossible with the current team and its inability to open tactically closed teams.
We can argue that he didn't have enough resources, but Juve tore us apart with a bunch of youngsters.
I couldn't understand why he exposed a balanced team: an unfit Pirlo was put into the team again, pairing him with an unfit Ambrosini.
It's some years we aren't able to play against small teams. It's a lot of years we get goals on set pieces.
These things are into the coach responsibility.
Can we talk about the fact that this team is too often relaxed? If Capello coached these players, they would be on the edge of a razor week in week out.
I hope Carlo will prove everyone wrong once again, but from the last comments of Berlusconi i think this will be last Carlo's year in Milan.
kastriot
18-12-2008, 18:30
I wouldnt care, and i dont think I`m the only one...if carlo leaves....but at the moment I simply dont see a better option out there, Rajkard and Don are not the solution... Juande ramos wasnt that bad, I think
I also dont see us going after a coach whos engaged with some team...if different, than maybe Hiddink or Martin Joll are some options...i`ve heard some great things about Joll....his considered one of the best from his colleagues....and he graduated with straight As from the academy(that should mean smth).
To be more clear...the ones that want carlos head...pls give a specific option who could replace him..I simply dont see one, at the mom.
EDIT:
one more thing, we might replace carlo and win scudetto...there are plenty of coaches that can deliver with a decent team,all u need is consistency. But the next 3 years we will want the CL...and that is not for every coach... i can name just few who are capable of delivering...We just want the scuddeto because, Inter has it and we havent won it in years,me too.
But when u think of a new coach..think long term...not just Scudetto and thats it.With Carlo we always struggled in Seria A, but we were the team to beat every single year in CL.
Giovanni
19-12-2008, 04:19
I wouldnt care, and i dont think I`m the only one...if carlo leaves....but at the moment I simply dont see a better option out there, Rajkard and Don are not the solution... Juande ramos wasnt that bad, I think
I also dont see us going after a coach whos engaged with some team...if different, than maybe Hiddink or Martin Joll are some options...i`ve heard some great things about Joll....his considered one of the best from his colleagues....and he graduated with straight As from the academy(that should mean smth).
To be more clear...the ones that want carlos head...pls give a specific option who could replace him..I simply dont see one, at the mom.
EDIT:
one more thing, we might replace carlo and win scudetto...there are plenty of coaches that can deliver with a decent team,all u need is consistency. But the next 3 years we will want the CL...and that is not for every coach... i can name just few who are capable of delivering...We just want the scuddeto because, Inter has it and we havent won it in years,me too.
But when u think of a new coach..think long term...not just Scudetto and thats it.With Carlo we always struggled in Seria A, but we were the team to beat every single year in CL.
You bring two remarkable objections.
The only option that satisfy all the requests is Rijkaard.
He's a former milanista, has already won a CL and has already won a league. Don't forget that he beated us in 2006 using an italian gameplan. And he did it masterfully.
At the moment he seems the only option.
Another coach i highly respect is Benitez. Isn't he having some problems with the Liverpool board?
If the board want to change the coach in order to win the Serie A, forget it. With 9 points behind the first place and start with a new coach, wining Serie A is extremly difficult (it's like a miracle if the new coach can win Serie A with Milan).
So, it depends on the board, what the purpose of the change of the coach? Only to win the Serie A? Or to start a new 'life' for the team with a new challenge (caused by the new coach)?
For me, both questions can't be (or extremly difficult) to be 'asked' by Carlo especially the second one. Carlo can do the second one if (only if) he has a really new squad. With new coach, 'at least' the second question should be able to be overcomed but the new coach must have certain character, an attitude to bench every unfit especially unmotivated player which could lead to competition among the players (not like now). At the end these players (unfit and unmotivated) can be only better (regarding their motivation and form) or they should find their new home if they don't want to sit on the bench in the rest of their careers.
I only know little about other coaches. Two of them are ex Milan players : Rijkaard and Van Basten. Rijkaard, as far as I know, have that kind of attitude. He sent Decco to the bench in in 2006/07 or 2007/08 (sorry I forget), the same happened to Ronaldinho. If Deco mostly stayed on the bench or started from the bench in his last season(s), R80 sometimes started as starter (but the poin is that R80 was not a first-team player in that time).
I find Basten is similar too. He 'dared' to use young player instead of using Seedorf even Seedorf was in his very top form in that time until the last European Cup when Seedorf rejected the call-up from Basten (poor Seedorf :D). In European Cup 2008 Basten also used many players who had only some games with the national team. The point is that Basten has some kind of attitude that to use only very fit (fitness and motivation) players.
That's true that Basten has never haved his own team with its established players that have played years for Basten but from how he coached Dutch NT, I think Basten won't do what Carlo has done (using the same players no matter how bad they are).
The problem with Basten is that he has little exprience with club but Rijkaard had had the same case too before he came to Barca. It's also important to mark that Rijkaard failed to deliver Spanish title to Barca in his first year and he was also almost fired by Barca in the middle of the season (because he needed time to bring Barca run smoothly in the right path). It means, the board must be patient if a new coach comes.
If the board want to change the coach in order to win the Serie A, forget it. With 9 points behind the first place and start with a new coach, wining Serie A is extremly difficult (it's like a miracle if the new coach can win Serie A with Milan).
It isn't extremely difficult at all. In fact Sacchi, Capello, and Zaccheroni won scudetto in their first year as head coach in Milan. Perhaps after all these years, a new coach can bring refreshment in terms of idea and motivation, two things that we seem to lack of lately
kastriot
19-12-2008, 06:29
I seriously doubt Rajkard can pull it of with this team, he won the CL and the League with the best team of the last decade(bar Milan 2005:devf:), when dinho was simply unstoppable. And If Sheva`s goal stood in Camp Nou(which should have) Would Rajkard win it???? I dont think so
Good point Gio, yes he does have both CL and League but Mancini has three scudettos also, I dont hear nobody calling for his name!! Because we know how he won them, with no real competition.
So now when Milan is doing badly, where are all those posters?? There is like 10 people now in MM...
Giovanni welcome back. I will answer why Carlo cant do all the things that dissaponited you, and you mentioned them: becouse he is not top qualkity coach. If Ancelotti had a team like Reggina he would be 20th with like 8 points won.
Rijkaard is no better coach then Ancelotti and I an praying he doesnt come to Milan. My pick was always Lippi and Cappello, but now that's impossible. Maybe our people like Baresi and Billy can handly Milan, why not? All the players say costacirta is an extraordinary worker in trainings.
And about all the torn muscles and back injuries - it always has somthing to do with training program. I've read a comment in italian that says Galliani messed with training regime and its not well dont this year. To be honest I cant rmember when did Milan last time start a season ready for playing top speed football, summers were always miss-lead by wrong programs.
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Milan will buy/loan a midfielder, be sure. Who will it be? Ledesma, DESSENA ( my pick, he is naturally gifted and can play on the right like Rino ), Brighi ( apparently not according to Galliani ), and so on... My pick is Dessena.
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And MORe important thing, Milan NEEDS to buy a good CB in the winter. If Gallas can be bought we cant miss that. This defence cant go on. And Nesta's career may be at the end.
rinogattuso
19-12-2008, 07:01
One midlefilder coming for sure Apiah,Mmbia',Palombo or someone else..Galliani have an agreement with Ancelotti about type of player..Carlo said that he need new CD.
Snapster
19-12-2008, 07:02
So now when Milan is doing badly, where are all those posters?? There is like 10 people now in MM...
Giovanni welcome back. I will answer why Carlo cant do all the things that dissaponited you, and you mentioned them: becouse he is not top qualkity coach. If Ancelotti had a team like Reggina he would be 20th with like 8 points won.
Rijkaard is no better coach then Ancelotti and I an praying he doesnt come to Milan. My pick was always Lippi and Cappello, but now that's impossible. Maybe our people like Baresi and Billy can handly Milan, why not? All the players say costacirta is an extraordinary worker in trainings.
And about all the torn muscles and back injuries - it always has somthing to do with training program. I've read a comment in italian that says Galliani messed with training regime and its not well dont this year. To be honest I cant rmember when did Milan last time start a season ready for playing top speed football, summers were always miss-lead by wrong programs.
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Milan will buy/loan a midfielder, be sure. Who will it be? Ledesma, DESSENA ( my pick, he is naturally gifted and can play on the right like Rino ), Brighi ( apparently not according to Galliani ), and so on... My pick is Dessena.
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And MORe important thing, Milan NEEDS to buy a good CB in the winter. If Gallas can be bought we cant miss that. This defence cant go on. And Nesta's career may be at the end.
Baldy shouldn't even touching the training program! It should be something decided between the doctors, physio's, players and coach what programs they should be doing, but yes you are right in that we always seem unprepared for every season. Too many injuries from players who's body's are too old to play the games we need to, and not even a legendary (not so sure now) Milan Lab can cure these problems.
I wanted Gallas when he was leaving Chelsea as I thought he was the perfect replacement for Stam being a solid, stong and capable defender.
Did i miss anything, or just greatly insulted Berlusconi...regardless of your opinion,there are people here who beside considering Berlu as the president of the team they love, they support his politics too, and dont forget that he is still the PM of some Italians in this forum,who might feel highly offended by your comment.
One doesn't have to of any nationality to pass a critical judgment of any political figure. The whole world abuses Bush.. should we not do it because it offends Americans?
All the Italians I've ever met have criticised him and his politics and my assessment of him is similar. Berlusconi is also the president of the team I love and he's done a lot for the club but that doesn't erase a lot of bad that I'm not saying here.
There is no reason why me or anyone else shouldn't criticise Berlusconi, Galliani or anyone else from Milan or outside of it irrespective of their nationality.
Im sure everyone here agrees that who ever manages Milan needs Galliani to bring in some quality players. Without this happening NO ONE can do anything for Milan.
The attitude from the top right down to the bottom stinks. Berlusconi isnt worried about battling Morriati. Galliani's fetish for narrow choices displayed perfectly by his love for yellow ties has weakened us to the core. How many 30 somethigns do we haev that are just not quite cutting it? The captain Maldini never speaks up the way other captains do and is just happy to be there for the ride rather than even daring to bring up the topic of his replacement. Inzaghi, recently used the phrase "Its only the Uefa Cup" after to Portsmouth match. the youth team has produced a single star for donkey years. All of this id reflected on the pitch in people liek Seedorf who just hobble around.
Milan is totally and utterly dependent on "Moments of brilliance" from individuals. We do not have a team. We will not win another single trophy as long as Galliani continues with his yellow tie syndrome famine mercato. That is the truth.
kakacmilan best
19-12-2008, 07:21
Milan vs Werdar!!
I hope that Diego will show Silvio and Carlo what he can do we will buy him!!!
I love this player!
I wanted Gallas when he was leaving Chelsea as I thought he was the perfect replacement for Stam being a solid, stong and capable defender.
Gallas is just another Zambrotta. If we had bought Zambrotta from Juve it would have been great. But instead we bought him at 31 in a season we cant challenge for the Seria A and we are not even in the Champions League. We still wont be prepared to challenge for anything next season and if we are, he will be 32 for Gods sake. The same goes for Gallas, if we signed him a couple of seasons ago when we had the chance, we would have benefitted and would still be in the CL. His day is gone as has Zambrotta's. Our transfers defy logic and give our team no future.
Brasileiro
19-12-2008, 08:56
[QUOTE=Siregar;517265]Hai Brasileiro, long time no see mate. :D I hope you are fine.
Ah tja, congrats for the Thiago Silva's signing (if it happens) as I know you are a big 'fan' of him. :D
Iīm fine, Siregar...to be fair, Iīm more a fan of Alex and David luiz, but Thiago Silva has all the tools to be a great defender in Europe
I have asked here about Thiago Silva's olympic games. Do you know why Thiago Silva played very rarely (as starter) in the last Olympic games? Dunga prefered Alex Silva to Thiago Silva. Thiago only played one game in the group phase as starter when Brazil have already qualified. Did Thiago have injury before the Olympic games?
Yep, Thiago picked up a injure before the Olympics(when he was a starter), and Dunga one more time, did what he do as best as anyone, a bonehead decision, a mess...
As I said before, Alex Silva is a good defender at his best, and didnīt deserved the hype around him...and as his play in Olympics(and now in Germany) showed, only Dunga would have started him above Thiago Silva. Thank God Galliani & co didnīt buy that hype...
By the way, how is David Luiz now? I read your post on a certain thread (Kaka's thread) and you said that the best defender produced by Brazil after Alex is David Luiz. Did he have great games and developing in his current club (still Benfica?)?
Yep, heīs still a Benfica player. Only last month he came back from a serious ankle injure, SERIOUS...he needs to go to USA to work on that ankle. Right now heīs on the bench, because since the young Sidnei(yep, the same 18years old from Internacional, that we were linked in the past - Kakaīs thread), had a chance to play, impressed and became the new starter. Now David will have to fight to get his starter job back...but if that injure is really healed, I have no doubt he will be a starter again.
The last question is (since you still have time :D) : how is Apodi now? Is he having good season this year? Is he getting much better now (defensive and offensive abilities)?
No, Apodi only declined this year...huge failure at Santos. As I said, he was talented, but raw, and needs to show he can perform in a big club...
Sorry for the delay to answer, Siregar but Iīm traveling a lot, and the time isnīt helping;)
Gabriel489
19-12-2008, 09:28
I read on a Chinese website who quoted an Italian paper, stating that Milan is willing to pay 14million for Santacroce, anyone can confirm this?
Iīm fine, Siregar...to be fair, Iīm more a fan of Alex and David luiz, but Thiago Silva has all the tools to be a great defender in Europe
It's a pity Alex doesn't have EU-pass, otherwise we can bring him in January (if the news about him in Chelsea can be trusted)
Yep, Thiago picked up a injure before the Olympics(when he was a starter), and Dunga one more time, did what he do as best as anyone, a bonehead decision, a mess...
That makes sense. I kept thinking in that time why on earth Thiago Silva was not a starter in the Olympic Games.
As I said before, Alex Silva is a good defender at his best, and didnīt deserved the hype around him...and as his play in Olympics(and now in Germany) showed, only Dunga would have started him above Thiago Silva. Thank God Galliani & co didnīt buy that hype...
Dunga finally put Thiago Silva as his DC (partnering with Luisao) against Portugal and I did enjoy Thiago's play in the first half. Luisao looked good in the first half because of Thiago I think (I watched only the first half of that game).
Yep, heīs still a Benfica player. Only last month he came back from a serious ankle injure, SERIOUS...he needs to go to USA to work on that ankle. Right now heīs on the bench, because since the young Sidnei(yep, the same 18years old from Internacional, that we were linked in the past - Kakaīs thread), had a chance to play, impressed and became the new starter. Now David will have to fight to get his starter job back...but if that injure is really healed, I have no doubt he will be a starter again.
It's a pity if a player has already a serious injury in his young age.
No, Apodi only declined this year...huge failure at Santos. As I said, he was talented, but raw, and needs to show he can perform in a big club...
Yes, you have said it when you gave your view about him. From the video someone gave in Kaka's thread, it can also be see that he was still rough-talent.
Sorry for the delay to answer, Siregar but Iīm traveling a lot, and the time isnīt helping;)
No, problem mate and many thanks for your view. Have nice trips then!
savage_mau
19-12-2008, 11:08
So now when Milan is doing badly, where are all those posters?? There is like 10 people now in MM...
I had been visiting this web for around 4 years daily but seldom make any comment of posting .Even when Milan is doing badly. I believe the bad situation is only because on the injury. If all the player is available, we will be back to our best. The fight for first 11 will be fears again and we will seldom see EMERSON to play. Just luck is not on our side.. ANYway MILAN FOR LIFE AND FORZA MILAN!!!
Lebanese
19-12-2008, 13:42
I read on a Chinese website who quoted an Italian paper, stating that Milan is willing to pay 14million for Santacroce, anyone can confirm this?
I read that too, on an arabic ac milan site. i dont know about this bid but let us hope its true
I've only seen Thiago Silva play a couple of times times so I don't know much about him but looking at the comments by people that say they've watched him more then it should be an exciting signing and finally a defender for the future. That's great........the problem is we need a defender RIGHT NOW. I pray that Nesta will be back because like Mrki said a little while ago, with him in the back even Kaladze looks good.
Mrki, about the comment that Nesta's career might be at an end, I hope you are wrong.......but also it's far too early to say that. The reason Nesta is out for this long is because the doctors chose to let the injury heal on its own with some good therapy. Surgery is the last option and it will surely repair the problem, however it is always a risk to perform a surgery on the back which involves the spinal chord. So as of right now there is not mention of a surgery which means therapy is going good. If Nesta's career is nearing an end, it won't happen until a surgery is completed and if that causes a prolem then we can stop hoping. I believe he'll be back in January. I pray that he'll be OK as in my eyes he is one of the best ever.
In any case, we are going to need a defender this winter and a midfielder to cover for Gattuso.
I understand that we may need an emergency midfield signing to cover for Rino, but I do wonder sometimes why we signed the 2 Uruguayan players (one of whom is a defensive midfielder) use up our non-EU spot, and also sign Flamini---and then when one of our key players get injured, we don't use them and end up dipping in the transfer market again. If Flamini is good enough, he should start every game until Rino comes back. If Vuidez/Cardacio are as good as they seem, then let's start playing them before we consider buying someone else.
Whenever Milan sign youngsters on the cheap, they never use them. Coloccini, Grimi, Commandini, Borriello (first time), Pozzi, etc.
I don't understand why they keep doing that. A few million dollars is still money, not to forget the precious non-EU spots. :mad:
THe one I have most regrets about is Gourcuff---what a player and we could see that from his very first game with us. Problem is Carlo plays him one game, then benches him for 4....if only Seedorf played less...
ACMILAN1983
20-12-2008, 03:46
THe one I have most regrets about is Gourcuff---what a player and we could see that from his very first game with us. Problem is Carlo plays him one game, then benches him for 4....if only Seedorf played less...
I have a positive feeling he'll return to Milan at the end of the year. I'm sure the upper management were impressed by him on the whole in the last two seasons and this season he's shown himself as a capable player at a high level.
Quite frankly, if we do let him slip away now then we're plain stupid.
Milan doesnt have the right scouts for young italian players. Juve took very good and even great players like De Cehlie 8 this boy will be a great LB when he matures a bit ), Marchisio, Criscito ( on loan but still a Juve player, too young still for serious CB ), Giovinco(!), Chiellini. There was also Nocerino who did well after eventually being swaped in a deal with AMAURI.
Milan could use few italy U21 players as those man can play real italian football: players like Cigarini and Dessena right now. And some defenders.
Gourcuff, Gilardino and Pato are/were(Gila) promising player, but Milan dosnt have the mentality to inculde younger players in. Pozzi, Albertazzi, Darmian, Grimi are not that good. they are players for Reggina.
Abate is ok, Dio Gennaro I dont know how he ios doing, while Paloschi is simipar to Pippo, he will need time and experience for the way he plays.
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In the meantime lets stop buying famous figurines ( Beckham ) and start buying real players for a serious team.
Albertazzi, Darmian are not that good. they are players for Reggina.
you can't put those two names as they are still so young (albertazzi 17 years old, darmian 19 years old). plese also note that those two names are junior nation team (U-19) players which means they are potential players, just like abate.
Hasan Rossonero
20-12-2008, 09:11
Hopefully, no one shows up for Beckham's presentation. That will send a message to management that they need to either quit or stop being fools.
Wishful thinking maybe.
Hopefully, no one shows up for Beckham's presentation. That will send a message to management that they need to either quit or stop being fools.
Wishful thinking maybe.
I also hope, this is not LA. But some people will show up eventually.
Giovanni
20-12-2008, 15:15
All the Italians I've ever met have criticised him and his politics and my assessment of him is similar. Berlusconi is also the president of the team I love and he's done a lot for the club but that doesn't erase a lot of bad that I'm not saying here.
There is no reason why me or anyone else shouldn't criticise Berlusconi, Galliani or anyone else from Milan or outside of it irrespective of their nationality.
Two points:
1) you met all the italians who lost the elections
2) there's a difference between a critic and an insult: the second one, which you used and abused, is not legal.
So sue him...really.:sweeteye:
Relax people, he insulted allmighty Berlusconi, so what? Its just a stupid forum in which people all around the world come to joke around.
And about the elections - who cares anyway in a CALCIO forum.
Giovanni
20-12-2008, 15:25
So sue him...really.:sweeteye:
Relax people, he insulted allmighty Berlusconi, so what? Its just a stupid forum in which people all around the world come to joke around.
And about the elections - who cares anyway in a CALCIO forum.
In facts we were talking about football UNTIL someone brought extra football subjects.
Filipéz 182
20-12-2008, 15:29
guys, check www.acmilan.com and watch the intro :)
sorry if you feel bad after watchin it...
Lebanese
20-12-2008, 16:23
guys, check www.acmilan.com and watch the intro :)
sorry if you feel bad after watchin it...
he is the news of the day, the movie of the week. he will fade away. take it easy. we have a game tomorrow which i hope we win
Bosniaco
20-12-2008, 16:44
I think Galliani is trying to fullfill his dream of having all these great player that he could not have when their were in their prime, so now he is bringing them in. Ronaldo, Ronaldinho, Beckham, players like these.
Lebanese
20-12-2008, 17:21
I think Galliani is trying to fullfill his dream of having all these great player that he could not have when their were in their prime, so now he is bringing them in. Ronaldo, Ronaldinho, Beckham, players like these.
if you think that R80 is finished then think again... there is a big difference between unfit and finished
Bosniaco
20-12-2008, 17:39
if you think that R80 is finished then think again... there is a big difference between unfit and finished
Buddy read my post the keyword is prime. He was at this prime at Barca ok. Back then nobody could get Roni, when Milan got him who wanted him? Maybe Man City maybe nobody.
Milano84
20-12-2008, 23:48
I understand that we may need an emergency midfield signing to cover for Rino, but I do wonder sometimes why we signed the 2 Uruguayan players (one of whom is a defensive midfielder) use up our non-EU spot, and also sign Flamini---and then when one of our key players get injured, we don't use them and end up dipping in the transfer market again. If Flamini is good enough, he should start every game until Rino comes back. If Vuidez/Cardacio are as good as they seem, then let's start playing them before we consider buying someone else.
flam has had a minor knock which is why he didnt play. no argument for cardaccio but he's more a CM/cam definitely not gattuso
Slow day in mercato and guess what before meeting with other Scotland team aka Rangers we have a news from their rival, Celtic..
CELTIC, Milan wants back Donati
20.12.2008 14.32 by Andrea Nannarelli read 398
Source: The Sun
AC Milan are looking to take Celtic midfielder Massimo Donati on a six-month loan to ease their injury problems.
transfermarketweb.com
Donati is not good enough, never was. Nocerino, Blasi and Dessena can take the role better.
But my choice for this spot is Senna from Villareal. He has prooved he is a top class player, aldough he still plays for Villareal. Srong, also technical, with extreme shot. Tactically great. Spanish 8 but Brazilian :) ). This is a man for Milan. But Galliani/Silvio will not pay for him. Buy the man and we will not have problems in DM position untill the end. Trust me this man can play.
Senna is still a great player and has alot of energy. However, at Villareal he is their main player, the fulcrum of the side and at 33 next year why would he want to leave a side where he's playing regularly to join a team where he'll just be a squad player?
A good player, but a few years too late for him to join us i think.
http://www.calciomercato.com/index.php?c=&a=106470
Wenger to Madrid?
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P.S.
Yes,yes I know I'm here all the time but these days I've got nothing to do :) Few exames till the end of the study, and all the time in the world to use. As its mostly raining and Im having a bit of a cold Im just bashing Carlo and stuff in the meantime :wave::5nana:
rosoneri_11
21-12-2008, 07:37
A great defensive midfilder is lassana diarra from portsmuth.I think he is going to R.Madrid after M.diarra's injury.It is said R.madrid will spend 24m for him.
Thats a transfer, they are are buying a better player in that position and not a third or fourth class player like Milan does.
Hasan Rossonero
21-12-2008, 09:48
A great defensive midfilder is lassana diarra from portsmuth.I think he is going to R.Madrid after M.diarra's injury.It is said R.madrid will spend 24m for him.
Thats a transfer, they are are buying a better player in that position and not a third or fourth class player like Milan does.
This guy couldn't even get a regular starting spot at Arsenal and Chelsea. He did well for mighty Portsmouth only.
kastriot
21-12-2008, 10:35
http://www.calciomercato.com/index.php?c=&a=106470
Wenger to Madrid?
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P.S.
As its mostly raining and Im having a bit of a cold Im just bashing Carlo and stuff in the meantime :wave::5nana:
You must be having a lot of rain in Croatia!!! :cheers: LOL
Graeme C
21-12-2008, 16:14
Am i watching the right game, or did ancelotti actually bring on Darmian and Strasser?
Finally Carlo gave chance for our youngsters especially for Darmian. In my opinion, Darmian should have played more often but at least he played in this game.
Finally Carlo gave chance for our youngsters especially for Darmian. In my opinion, Darmian should have played more often but at least he played in this game.
Are you in love with Darmian ??
I joke of course, but you often claim that you want him to play, but from what I saw today in about 14 minutes, he wasn't as good as expected, he even lost one or two easy balls that could have given a conceded goal against a more confident and stronger team ... Actually, I know why he never started now, he isn't ready, he has to be loaned or he will never play for our first team.
The contrary for Strasser: he's the kind of guy we could need in our midfield sometimes, he already seems strong physically and seems technically skilled and he's young, he can only improve.
I kind of remember when we signed Strasser. Im sure he was fro Ghana or another African country and was described as an Essien type defensive midfielder. Its interesting to see he has made such a good first impression
Are you in love with Darmian ??
I joke of course, but you often claim that you want him to play, but from what I saw today in about 14 minutes, he wasn't as good as expected, he even lost one or two easy balls that could have given a conceded goal against a more confident and stronger team ... Actually, I know why he never started now, he isn't ready, he has to be loaned or he will never play for our first team.
The contrary for Strasser: he's the kind of guy we could need in our midfield sometimes, he already seems strong physically and seems technically skilled and he's young, he can only improve.
I agree with you. Damian didn't look confident to me. On the other hand, Strasser was so relaxed and at ease.
It is only one game though. Also, maybe it has to do with their different positions. A defender always needs to make sure not to make big mistake; while a midfielder is less burdened with such concern.
Hopefully both would turn out useful. We are in dire need and could definitely use some young blood.
Are you in love with Darmian ??
I joke of course, but you often claim that you want him to play, but from what I saw today in about 14 minutes, he wasn't as good as expected, he even lost one or two easy balls that could have given a conceded goal against a more confident and stronger team ... Actually, I know why he never started now, he isn't ready, he has to be loaned or he will never play for our first team.
The contrary for Strasser: he's the kind of guy we could need in our midfield sometimes, he already seems strong physically and seems technically skilled and he's young, he can only improve.
Of course he would make mistake(s), it's normal for a player who never play for the first team in this season. He is also very young (unexperienced). A mature player would also mistakes if he never played for the team before, like we saw on Simic in the past when he was out for months. I want him to play because Kaladze's mistakes are already so many and unacceptable. It's better to play young and unexperienced players to established players who make errors very often (read : mature players who don't pay the coach's faith).
About your comparing Darmian and Strasser I disagree as both played like young players : they made mistake(s). Darmian played not so concentrated in the first minutes while Strasser made a bad challenge who gave him a yellow card BUT both are promising. Darmian was good at covering the defence except the first minutes and Strasser was clever with his ability at reading the game.
The last is that I think you don't understand completely what I hate from Carlo. I don't expect him to play youngsters, what I expect him is make fair competition for ALL players. If his beloved players play terribly or without motivation from one game to another game , he should punish them by not playing them in the next game(s).
I like Carlo but never love him like you do. Just kidding.
Lebanese
21-12-2008, 19:27
Of course he would make mistake(s), it's normal for a player who never play for the first team in this season. He is also very young (unexperienced). A mature player would also mistakes if he never played for the team before, like we saw on Simic in the past when he was out for months. I want him to play because Kaladze's mistakes are already so many and unacceptable. It's better to play young and unexperienced players to established players who make errors very often (read : mature players who don't pay the coach's faith).
About your comparing Darmian and Strasser I disagree as both played like young players : they made mistake(s). Darmian played not so concentrated in the first minutes while Strasser made a bad challenge who gave him a yellow card BUT both are promising. Darmian was good at covering the defence except the first minutes and Strasser was clever with his ability at reading the game.
The last is that I think you don't understand completely what I hate from Carlo. I don't expect him to play youngsters, what I expect him is make fair competition for ALL players. If his beloved players play terribly or without motivation from one game to another game , he should punish them by not playing them in the next game(s).
I like Carlo but never love him like you do. Just kidding.
Totally agree with you, man utd is interested in signing our player, The one you have as avatar
Totally agree with you, man utd is interested in signing our player, The one you have as avatar
Where did you read it?
Well, I really like our young players now since I have watched them play in some games and also they (Darmian, Albertazzi, Osuji, Strasser, Pierre Aubameyang, Ugmunebu) look promising to me. :D
Lebanese
21-12-2008, 20:28
Where did you read it?
Well, I really like our young players now since I have watched them play in some games and also they (Darmian, Albertazzi, Osuji, Strasser, Pierre Aubameyang, Ugmunebu) look promising to me. :D
Siregar i read that on an arabic ac milan fan site. about our youngsters i hope they got a chance but i hate to have a great talents wasted. Man Utd are willing to pay 1.5 mil pound for Osuji. they already poached two italian talents and now they are heading for the 3rd. what is the use of youth players if you are not gonna use them. i hope this changes one day very soon as we all saw today that our young players are some players you can relay on.
POTATO head show these youngsters some trust and i think and i am sure all of milan fan wouldnot mind losing with a team has some youngsters instead of losing with some big names in.
I'm going to be serious back (no joke anymore lol): if our young players, I mean, the most promising ones, don't play some games between now and the end of the season, they will never I think ... It's this year or never, we have no Champion's League, we can include one young sometimes (not putting them all together and then say "they are bad, look at that, we lost 4-1 because of these 4 youngsters").
The problem is that Ancelotti sees them at training, and if he doesn't play them, there is probably a reason ... why no player said something like "Darmian is the next big Italian defender", or "Strasser can play alongside Gattuso and Flamini", etc ?? When we have young very promising players (for moment, Pato and Paloschi from last year), the "olders" always speak about them ... nothing on our current youngsters. It's what makes me being balanced there.
Gabriel489
22-12-2008, 06:51
I'm going to be serious back (no joke anymore lol): if our young players, I mean, the most promising ones, don't play some games between now and the end of the season, they will never I think ... It's this year or never, we have no Champion's League, we can include one young sometimes (not putting them all together and then say "they are bad, look at that, we lost 4-1 because of these 4 youngsters").
The problem is that Ancelotti sees them at training, and if he doesn't play them, there is probably a reason ... why no player said something like "Darmian is the next big Italian defender", or "Strasser can play alongside Gattuso and Flamini", etc ?? When we have young very promising players (for moment, Pato and Paloschi from last year), the "olders" always speak about them ... nothing on our current youngsters. It's what makes me being balanced there.
Well, agree and disagree. As Gila was and is spoken badly from our players and he is scoring goals left right front and back. Gourcuff was not mentioned by anyone too, and yet he is playing great in Ligue and CL. Then there are guys like Martin Laursen and Coloccini, whom people did not have faith in at Milan and yet they are doing well in EPL and for their country. To be honest, I would love to see them at Milan now instead of SImic, Favalli and Kaladaze.
Now I am not blaming Carlo but to certain extent, Carlo must take blame for not allowing youngster a chance to flourish.
FOr example, whats the point of bringing in Sheva, if it is not for Berlu's politics, he would be better off bringing on some other youngsters to get more exp. AS even if Sheva scored a hattrick in a 5-1 game, he probably won't be able to do that next game as whatever form he was on, he would probably lose it after the X'mas break.
_MaJi_tz
22-12-2008, 08:39
Calcio Debate: Maicon’s Offside Law - Time To Introduce Tennis Challenging System In Football?
Last weekend’s round of Serie A action was overshadowed by two high-profile refereeing blunders that enabled Juventus and, in particular, Inter to win their respective games. Carlo Garganese asks whether it is now time to introduce some form of video technology, and he has a solution…
ŧComments Print This Story Send To A Friend Contact Us galleria zoom Calcio fans will remember the furore that was caused by a report in the Gazzetta dello Sport last season, which created an alternative Serie A table based on where teams would be without officiating errors. Juventus topped the standings, having been penalised on nine occasions, Inter were relegated to second, having obtained eight extra points, while Milan were the most harshly treated and would have eventually ended the campaign in a Champions League place were it not for the referees.
For a long time I have been very much against calls for the introduction of video technology and, to an extent, I still very much am. Part of the beauty of football is that it is so unpredictable, and so by replacing referees with computers, we are removing the human error that makes the game so exciting. With football already becoming more of a business than a sport, this would be yet another blow to the traditionalists who are seeing all the age-old values, instilled by the founding fathers, slowly disappear. There is also the issue that technology would seriously disrupt the flow of the game.
However, Douglas Maicon’s scandalous late winner for Inter at Siena on Saturday night, when the Brazilian was so far offside that it seemed simply impossible that the linesman could miss it, got me thinking…
I am sure I am not the first to propose this solution, but how about football introduces a tennis-style challenge system? Each team are allowed to challenge three refereeing calls per game. If they make an incorrect dispute, they lose a challenge, but if they are correct, their number of challenges remain as they are.
This system has been a huge success since it was introduced to tennis, and it has had no real adverse effect on slowing down the game. To ensure this is not the case in football, perhaps a maximum of two challenges would be sensible.
When the challenge is made, the referee or fourth official is notified, a call is made to a fifth official, who has a television in front of him, the correct decision is taken, and 15 seconds later the game resumes again.
So what calls would coaches or captains be allowed to challenge? This is where things get tricky, and it is perhaps where you readers can offer your suggestions.
I would propose that you can only challenge a referee for what he awarded, rather than what he didn’t award. For example a team can argue AGAINST a penalty, an offside or over-the-line goal, or a red card, but they cannot demand that the referee award a penalty, or send a player off.
Only the big decisions are allowed to be challenged. These would include penalties, offsides that led to goals, and over-the-line goals, but not free kicks, corners, throw-ins, and other less major infringements.
Much more analysis is required than what I have provided here, but the original, simple idea, from which to build upon, is there, and that is that a tennis-style challenging system may actually benefit football.
It would partly put to an end the accusations that the most powerful men in Calcio, such as Luciano Moggi, Massimo Moratti or Silvio Berlusconi are running the game, while it would also stop the complaints from the likes of Maurizio Zamparini, who say that the smaller teams are the ones who are always penalised.
Most importantly, the formula that each team are only allowed two or three challenges a match would not destroy the flow or the traditions of the game, aspects which simply must be retained to keep the sport beautiful.
We played a african kid strasser last weekend, Chinese media here describe him 'new sissko'.that's great,we lack such kind of DM in our squad.Dose anyone kown his details ?
ACMILAN1983
23-12-2008, 03:34
It appears the club's changed ideas for the winter market and are looking for defenders rather than a Rino replacement now. Seems to be Jankulovski convinced them that he's probably best used in midfield.
So, Dossena and Rinaudo are the two names linked at the moment, though other names like Christian Terlizzi, Paolo Castellini and Moris Carrozzieri have been mentioned.
Personally, I'd rather see this be the case (us buying defenders not midfielders and pushing Janku up) than looking for a Rino replacement.
It appears the club's changed ideas for the winter market and are looking for defenders rather than a Rino replacement now. Seems to be Jankulovski convinced them that he's probably best used in midfield.
So, Dossena and Rinaudo are the two names linked at the moment, though other names like Christian Terlizzi, Paolo Castellini and Moris Carrozzieri have been mentioned.
Personally, I'd rather see this be the case (us buying defenders not midfielders and pushing Janku up) than looking for a Rino replacement.
If its true that we are after a defender then it is one step forward.
But the players we are linked to are no better than what we already have so would therefore mean us AGAIN taking one step forward and two steps backwards
Yeah, we need a CD who can kick out Kaladze from the starting line-up.
Two targets which said by channel4 (Rinaudo and Carrozzieri) has a similarity : both are giant (with height more than 190cm). Of course the two players are also mediocre players. :D
Filipéz 182
23-12-2008, 06:28
I like Dossena and Carrozzieri, they are better then Senderos and favalli. And they are at a good age. I wouldnt mind one of them.
but also midfielders have been linked with us in recent weeks, Palombo, Blasi, Brighi and donati. From that list I would take Palombo or Brighi with my eyes closed, Brighi is having an excellent season so far at roma and palombo is also a very good player who is too good for playing at samp IMO.
Nesta is not going to Dubai, I think his season is over. I have heard some doctors that work for Milan, they say Nesta's career is in realistic doubt.
It's sad news ... so the best would be to have Thiago Silva (done) + a 27-28yo World Class CD (or at least, excellent CD) with some experience.
I don't care if the guy comes tomorrow or only next year actually, all I want is to be sure there will be a new CD for at least the next season !!
This way, if Nesta comes back, we'll be able to have one of the best defenses in the world (only if he comes back at a good level, which could be long for example if he only comes back next season ...), and if he doesn't come back, we'll be ok as we will have Kaladze as a sub (and not as our first choice).
Anyway, again, it's sad to know that a guy like Nesta could stop ... we need this kind of football players, in Milan, but not only, we need this kind of players most generally in football world ...
ACMILAN1983
23-12-2008, 11:01
Nesta is not going to Dubai, I think his season is over. I have heard some doctors that work for Milan, they say Nesta's career is in realistic doubt.
Ancelotti was quoted as saying this:
"Nesta may not be able to train with the players in Dubai, but he will could be back as soon as January,"
HO-YOUNG
23-12-2008, 12:32
Is it possible to sign Elano from Man City???... i hear he is not getting along with the manager... i think his quality and abilities should be displayed in a milan shirt.
Galliani says Milan will go for LB, and Marek will play in the middle with the rest, in Rino's place. That is a good decision. We can patch up the defence and Marek plays better in midfield. In any case, Rino is insostituibile by any player in the world.
Dossena is being mentioned.
rinogattuso
23-12-2008, 16:08
Galliani says Milan will go for LB, and Marek will play in the middle with the rest, in Rino's place. That is a good decision. We can patch up the defence and Marek plays better in midfield. In any case, Rino is insostituibile by any player in the world.
Dossena is being mentioned.
That is decision by Ancelotti,he said that had superp display and run a lot,covering midlefield,great game by him and favalli on left side..first goal was product of that.
Dossena said today that he is staying in Lpool..
now we want rinaudo..i just dont get why(if its true),would we prefer rinaudo out of napoli's defenders,it makes no sence to me,even if it is for financial reasons..and i ve heard about dossena too which i hope is false..i dont think we can play with no dmc at all,i mean we have players like flamini,who by the way is an extraordinary half but he needs some time to adjust with the others,i cant remember any defensive med not needing time at his new team..marek is a lm but when we play with 2 dms then marek can easily play as a lb cause he gets help fom the halfs..
i insist that we need a world class defender..the ideal ones imo would be santacrocce or mexes..
It's great to hear galliani's words about bringing an left back.but no dossena please,he is no better than favalli except couple of years younger.
Milan need a top wingback,or young guys who have potential to be classy.Few names come to my mind, how about that russian guy zhirkov or real madrid's marcelo.
Bosniaco
23-12-2008, 23:01
Well, we could go for Pasqual or Vargas from Fiorentina. We could buy De Silvestri or Rafinha and then push Antonini to left and have a good back up for right side. We could buy also Santacroce. There is few options, but I dont like the onces that are mentioned above. I rather see then a primavera player come in.
Janku had a great game against Udinese. For once we have a DM who can cross the ball. Hopefully he continues to do well in midfield, but for me, he is a liability in defense. For that reason I agree with Galliani, we ought to get either a central defender (Alex?) and maybe move Kaladze to LB or get a good LB, or get a versatile defender who can do both.
Originally posted by Bosniaco
Well, we could go for Pasqual or Vargas from Fiorentina. We could buy De Silvestri or Rafinha and then push Antonini to left and have a good back up for right side. We could buy also Santacroce. There is few options, but I dont like the onces that are mentioned above. I rather see then a primavera player come in.
Pasqual,vargas are good players,but they are no big club first team caliber yet(and I doubt they will ever be).Pasqual has limited physical presence which his skill and game awareness level can not compensate.vargas is quite strong,but like janku,he is a weak link on the defenceline in games need tactical tightness.
Antonini is a perfect sub, If he becomes our first team regular next year,I will seriously doubt our scudetto hope. santacrocche is very promising,but his nature position is CD,only in big games,we play a CD as a wingback to strengthen defence.
I think Zhirkov and marcelo are the sharpest two on the left wing. and defend quite decently at the same time,both are young,perfect defence skills will come with age.
hitmannq8
24-12-2008, 02:25
Zhirkov would be ideal but he is Non-EU, and we already have signed our Non-EU for 2009/2010! We will need to sell one of our Non-EU's so we can have a space for him (and this is all for next year, so that means this deal will not go through in january)
Pasqual is good, but wont be able to get him for the same reason we won't be getting Santacroce, they are important for their plans future plans. Marcelo would be an awesome, awesome buy but I dont think Real are about to let him go. Dossena can rot in the EPL, he is a very average player - nothing special at all.
Having Antonini + Zambrotta in this side is something really great, because they both can play on either side. I hope Galliani does not limit his search just for LB's because it wouldn't be such a bad idea to bring a RB instead (and send Zambro to the left). I mean, we should go for which ever we could find, a RB or LB. BTW - What's the status on Grosso? How about Oddo, he seems to be playing real well at Bayern.
Pasqual is a good average player excpt his left foot longballs. and we need to splash 7-8 million to get him which I think is a waste.
The leftback question is whether we need a cover-shorthand solution or to find a longterm replacement to continue our M3 legacy.
If it's the former, I suggetest 3 alternative options.
plan1, move k4 to left, and find a decent CD(such as zapata,mexes,santacroce)
Plan2, move B32 to rightwing or bring back abate,move antonini or zambrotta to left.
Plan3, go for grosso,maybe he is at the end of his contract,and we can get him free.
If it's the latter,I strongly petiton the milanboard to consider zhirkov,marcelo such caliber(or potential caliber). no matter left or right wings
ACMILAN1983
24-12-2008, 03:54
IF (and I'm pretty certain we won't this winter) we get Santacroce by some fluke, then it is worth noting he's very good at RB. I'd rather see him moved to RB than see Kala at LB. The main reason is Kaladze has bulked up and slowed down since moving to CB and he doesn't seem able to play LB anymore. In fact, for the new year if we were to get Santacroce, my defence for the second half of the season would be...
Santacroce------Nesta---Maldini/Bonera------Zambrotta
If Nesta isn't available, then...
Santacroce-----Bonera----Maldini--------Zambrotta
I can dream can't I? :D
Unless Dossena suddenly turns into a confident talented player, we should stay well clear of him. Surely we can get a defender or two on loan? No need to waste millions on mediocre players in January. Not many decent players become available in the winter period, so if we're to get mediocre players, i'd rather it be mediocre players we can hand back in the summer rather than being stuck with them on a 4 year contract!
What about Sirl from Zenit, he's a pretty useful left-back.
IF (and I'm pretty certain we won't this winter) we get Santacroce by some fluke, then it is worth noting he's very good at RB. I'd rather see him moved to RB than see Kala at LB. The main reason is Kaladze has bulked up and slowed down since moving to CB and he doesn't seem able to play LB anymore. In fact, for the new year if we were to get Santacroce, my defence for the second half of the season would be...
Santacroce------Nesta---Maldini/Bonera------Zambrotta
If Nesta isn't available, then...
Santacroce-----Bonera----Maldini--------Zambrotta
I can dream can't I? :D
You know, even though Santacroce might a pretty good RB (basing on your estimation), I think he would be much better at CD. Since Bonera is liable to make errors (he's becoming like K4), I think Santacroce would provide cover with Maldini. Bonera is a decetn enough RB, I think he can play there.
We should really think about Rafinha. He's going to be big in a few years and is good both defensively and in attack.
Throw Dossena out the window please. :p231:
According to Channel four we are after F Cannavaro, we should have bought him about 10 years ago but not now!
A loan deal untill the rest of the season could be good but I doubt that will be the case. Since we are offering an 18 months deal or if he get's to leave in the summer a 6months deal with an complete year salary...
I hope you realise Cannavaro is still one of the best CB's in the world. An 18 month deal is a great job for us. People will laugh,m but Cannais not a better player thenb Samuel, Cordoba, Maldini, bonera, Legrottaglie etc...
I would sign him without a doubt.
And dossena also, aldough he has underperformed in EPL. He played well for Azzuri and has shown he can play in Italy. It was just 6 months ago. We need a new LB, evan if he is not world class. Marek is now "officially" a midfielder as Rino is gone.
ACMILAN1983
24-12-2008, 07:11
You know, even though Santacroce might a pretty good RB (basing on your estimation), I think he would be much better at CD. Since Bonera is liable to make errors (he's becoming like K4), I think Santacroce would provide cover with Maldini. Bonera is a decetn enough RB, I think he can play there.
We should really think about Rafinha. He's going to be big in a few years and is good both defensively and in attack.
Throw Dossena out the window please. :p231:
Bonera's been really solid in the years he's been at Milan and has rarely been the cause of problems in the defence (though that isn't to say he's not had bad games). I doubt very much that he'd be as bad as K4, who's simply a joke this year. In fact, I'd argue Bonera's been our most consistent performer in defence this season, and that's why I wouldn't mind seeing him as a starter in CB.
However, I still expect stronger defenders being drafted in next summer.
And now it's Cannavaro
Finally some good news..although that means we'll need a world class defender after 2 years again..just imagine the dream duo nesta-canna(i know canna is not like 2-3 years ago,and nestas injuries have left him behind but still)
Canna is still very very good. He is class.
Everytime I come back to this forum standards (for players) have gone down a little further. Cannavaro is no where near the player he was and he will be even worse with the old squad we are assembling here at Milan. Maldini is at the very end of his career, so is Cannavaro. We need someone with a future not a past.
Is it so bad for us to want a good defence?
Graeme C
24-12-2008, 13:40
it is arguable, in January we arent going to get a quality of player we need to fix the problem. Players like rinauldo and dossena may be younger players but questions have to be asked about there quality. And clubs dont usually let there best players go halfway through a season.
The Cannavaro rumour is interesting, hes an older player. But hes experience and quality speaks for itself. If we are going to have any defender for 6-8 months then i wouldnt mind Cannavaro.
Rumours are that he wants to retire at Napoli. He could play for us until the summer, then get traded to napoli in part exchange for Santacroce :hihihi:
He's not that great. He performs well in big games (like in the El Classico) but he was crap otherwise. He's great technically but he makes a lot of errors, something Kaladze provides enough. Real Madrid have been bad defensively for 3 seasons now (check the stats if you dont believe me). Cannavaro is not even close to his former self. Plus we dont need another retirement candidate.
Anyway, i'm pretty sure he's joining his brother next season.
Ronaldinho10
24-12-2008, 15:28
Canna is still very very good. He is class.
But he is too old...
For defence i prefer Agger, and i hope he'll join to milan !
But he is too old...
For defence i prefer Agger, and i hope he'll join to milan !
Agger,Santaccroce,Zapata the best options.
Bosniaco
24-12-2008, 18:16
I cant belive people are actually liking the Cannaaro link. The guy is 35 years old !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
hitmannq8
24-12-2008, 18:57
Cannavaro is ideal! hope the deal would go through, then we can use him as bait for Santacroce :)
Milano84
24-12-2008, 19:30
I cant belive people are actually liking the Cannaaro link. The guy is 35 years old !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
man lets get pannuci too..... pannucci--nesta--cannavaro--maldini.... the best defense ever...
in 2000
Cannavaro is ideal! hope the deal would go through, then we can use him as bait for Santacroce :)
What ever happened to using money as bait? Napoli would never be interested in letting go of potentially one of the best defenders around for Cannavaro (By the time we have used up what little he has left to offer).
Yea Cannavaro has definitely not been at his best...don't know how much of Madrid you guys watch but I watch a decent amount and he's definitely not what we need.
By a team like Madrid now, who play offensive football with offensive formation (4-3-3) but lack of defensive players (DMs or defensive fullbacks), the CDs will never look good. Part of defence which can be looked good is only the GK.
Are you guyz crazy???????????
Cannavaro is ****TTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT now
a 36 y old defender
What a ****ty team we have become
We NEED 2 out of the folowing 3
Agger Santa and Zapata
Nooooooooooo Cannavaro PLSSSSSSSS
Too much complaining.
It's true that Cannavaro has been bad in Madrid and he has been at most a decent defender in La Liga but nowhere near the word "great". From what I've seen, and I've seen a big ammount of Real games in the past few years.....Cannavaro has made plenty of mistakes and is far away from the player he was when in Italy.
Now, those were the negatives of the past few seasons in Spain........but I still think he is a good defender. He still has great tactical awareness and organizes well. If protected by a solid midfield (something he hasn't had in Real) he can still be a great CB even at 35. (Please keep in mind that at 35 Maldini won the CL and was alongside Nesta the best CB in Europe) Canavaro has been playing at the highest level and has always kept himself in tremendous shape so I don't see why he can't be good for us for a year or so. On top of that he has always kept his solid performances for the national team so that is a proof that he still has something to offer.
Now keeping that in mind.....Let's stop looking at the age, but judge by the ability of the player. Cannavaro at present......even if nowhere as good as he once was is
#1: still a good defender;
#2: better then the defenders we have now so therefore an upgrade
#3: probably the best available and possible option.
Look at #2 and #3 before posting a reply please and honestly think if that's right or wrong. I know we all want Zapata (who if we are looking at form.....the guy's been injured for longer then he has been playing good football in his career but that's besides the point), we all want Santacroce, or Agger, or Chiellini, or Mexes, or ........etc. But the fact of the matter is that it's January market, most of these players play for well supported clubs and have a good status in their club.
-Napoli WILL NOT sell Santacroce unless we offer a huge ammount of money although how big the sum....we don't know because apparently they don't need money and are building for the future so it will take a lot to tempt them.
-Udinese will probably sell Zapata, but they've been in bad form so they will probably decide at this point to keep him untill the summer so they can stay in Euro contention. Another problem about the transfer is that obviously he has been injured for so long, that it a HUGE liability of how the hell he is going to help us in January?
-Liverpool might decide to sell Agger, but they certainly won't be forced to do it for a small sum. They are in the running for the Premier League and they do need the deep squad. They also are reportedly in a little financial slump, but that doesn't mean they'll gift us Agger. We will have to pay up big for him, I think think as big as 17/18 mil Euro. He played against Chelsea the other day so he is obviously still a dependable figure at Liverpool. They won't just give him to us.
So there you have it....my view on the 3 most mentioned players here but the reality of the possibility of these transfers is sour and this simply isn't football manager. The market is what it is at this moment and we must go for the best possible solution for this moment. There are sometimes when we can blame the managment, but there are others when we just have to understand the reality and not act like spoiled children.
I know that the managment made a huge mistake by not buying a solid CB, but somehow I doubt the way to fix that is to splash out a lot of cash on a player in Janurary who MIGHT help us. I am saying MIGHT simply because out of the mentioned only Agger might be a dependable enough option even if there are a lot of question marks around him as well. I already gave my two cents on Zapata....and as far as Santacroce goes, I love the way he plays. He is a very good defender with a solid base to become a great one. But let's not jump into this hype all too soon and splash out all we got. After all where are all the people that were cursing the managment for not buying Ilsinho, Cicinho, Marcelo, Sobis....etc.
Let me make this clear, I DO want us to buy Santacroce and I hope that it happens but I simply don't think that it's possible to do that for as much as he is actually worth and we will be milked for all we got by Napoli for him therefore the move seems impossible at the moment. There are just too many obstacles and things to consider regarding Santacroce that it might be way too soon to jump inside the fire. Let's at least wait untill the summer.
I am not saying that Cannavaro is the best and let's get him period. But judging from the situation he might not be as bad as it first seems. Let's not forget that the club already made an investment in Thiago Silva so we already have a signing comming in the summer. I do want another CB to come in the summer preferably Santacroce or simply a world class defender........but right now none of those are available and Cannavaro might just be the best bet to stabilaze our defence. Add to that a healthy Nesta (I pray that it happens) then our defence might not be as bad as it looks all of a sudden.
Sorry for the long post.....it just seemed like an interesting subject.
Very strong analysis Nefremo! I agree with you about the level of how realistic it is to buy each other; but I also wonder how realistic it is to actually get Cannavaro. The key is I think Real still needs him, and unless they are absolutely stupid, they won't let him go when they are still in for Champion League.
At the end of the day, I don't think we'll be able to acquire the right person for next year for our DC; someone as a temporary solution perhaps but definitely it's unlikely that we will be able to buy someone we really want.
Very strong analysis Nefremo! I agree with you about the level of how realistic it is to buy each other; but I also wonder how realistic it is to actually get Cannavaro. The key is I think Real still needs him, and unless they are absolutely stupid, they won't let him go when they are still in for Champion League.
At the end of the day, I don't think we'll be able to acquire the right person for next year for our DC; someone as a temporary solution perhaps but definitely it's unlikely that we will be able to buy someone we really want.
Thanks Jeff. I never really mentioned that because I just wanted to respond to the people who say that he is no good and lets go for this player that player so I just wanted to point out that he probably is the best option right now. You are probably right that Real needs him and I never put that in perspective. At the same time however they'll lose him for free in June so this might be a chance for them to make a few bucks from him. So looking at that, he might be a good solution for us and there is also a good chance that Real will want to do business even though they can really use him for the remainder of his contract. The fact of the matter is that we haven't heard anything else besides that article from Channel 4 for the time being so after a few more days and few more rummors we can hopefully know the realistic opportunity of that option as well.
Great post,nefremo.
Cannavaro is probably the best available and sensible solution for midseason reinforcemnt.And I think he's got alot left in his tank. Are you sure his current contract expire next june? If we can secure him under 5Mil. That will truly be a Chrismas present.
Originally posted by Jim Uk
Unless Dossena suddenly turns into a confident talented player, we should stay well clear of him. Surely we can get a defender or two on loan? No need to waste millions on mediocre players in January. Not many decent players become available in the winter period, so if we're to get mediocre players, i'd rather it be mediocre players we can hand back in the summer rather than being stuck with them on a 4 year contract!
What about Sirl from Zenit, he's a pretty useful left-back.
Who is this Sirl? any detail information? Here in china we don't see lots of euro football other than italy,england,germany,spain,french league.
Milano84
25-12-2008, 03:24
for defense.. i'd rather us buy cannavaro than next 'new thing' u want proven defenders. of course you want high prospects like santacroce, but u cant just poach them. they take a while to come free cause good defenders r hard to find.
cannavaro is not my first choice by any stretch but he is proven world class, RARELY injured and id rather take that then flavor of week kaladze-clone. Wait it out and when a nesta like player frees up (like he did w/ lazio) JUMP in.
defense is something were exerience matters more and counts for more than athletism
Filipéz 182
25-12-2008, 03:27
The people who want cannavaro to join must take some things in mind.
One of the major problems of this team is that it is too old, the players have won it all and they look unmotivated. it seems like they can only motivate themselfves for the big games. we cant have another 35+ player in the team, not even a 30yo + player!! we need some young players who still want to win and fight for it!
+ Why spend money on canna now and sign another defender next year while we can just sign one now... with no money wasted on canna. why again looking for the short term option. why doesnt galliani ever think about the future of milan, this idiot is destroying a beautifull team.
There are many good defenders on the market, players who are at a good age and can be here for many years. we dont need more experienced players as we have enough of them, we need young enthusiatic players!!
some names: Alex, Mexes, Ivanovic, Agger, Zapata... all good defenders and they are available.
Please silvio and galliani stop this ridiculous project of signing ex-players, what do you want to prove?
To be honest I really cant understand why they are doing this sh*t, theyre really destroying AC Milan. we are the joke of europe these days
Alex - we can't sign him as he is a non-EU....we don't have a spot for him right now and we can't wait untill the summer as we need help in the back NOW
Ivanovic - We tried, Chelsea didn't want to do business....they only wanted to loan him with no option. Now it's even more unlikely that he'll leave because Alex openly said that he will probably leave Chelsea..........They will certainly not sell both Ivanovic and Alex. Forget about this guy for now, he is not leaving Chelsea
Zapata - as mentioned earlier he has been injured for so long, how is he going to help us in January. We don't know his condition or anything. If Arsenal had a bid of 14/15 mil euro rejected in the summer (that's what rummors were saying this past summer and fall) then how much does it take to buy this player who by the way hasn't made a single appearance due to injury this year. Are you suggesting that we pay 20 (just a number judging at Arsenal's rejected offer) for a player that hasn't played and then ask him to save our backline? That's not a smart move.......we should let him come back from injury at Udine and then evaluate the situation.
Agger - probably the safest option but is he available and for how much? Read my above post to see why I don't think his signature is possible at this moment.
Mexes - are you sure he is available? I think there is not a single possible chance that Roma will sell him to us right now. Maybe in the summer, but that's a whole different topic that'll probably come up a lot during the summer.
If Milan had been Arsenal, it probably wouldve been okay to buy a 36 year old player.. however, we, under no circumstances should add to the long list of 32+ year olds.. i am in no way saying that old players cant cut it at the top.. but there is a need for balance.
Filipéz 182
25-12-2008, 05:09
Alex - we can't sign him as he is a non-EU....we don't have a spot for him right now and we can't wait untill the summer as we need help in the back NOW
Ivanovic - We tried, Chelsea didn't want to do business....they only wanted to loan him with no option. Now it's even more unlikely that he'll leave because Alex openly said that he will probably leave Chelsea..........They will certainly not sell both Ivanovic and Alex. Forget about this guy for now, he is not leaving Chelsea
Zapata - as mentioned earlier he has been injured for so long, how is he going to help us in January. We don't know his condition or anything. If Arsenal had a bid of 14/15 mil euro rejected in the summer (that's what rummors were saying this past summer and fall) then how much does it take to buy this player who by the way hasn't made a single appearance due to injury this year. Are you suggesting that we pay 20 (just a number judging at Arsenal's rejected offer) for a player that hasn't played and then ask him to save our backline? That's not a smart move.......we should let him come back from injury at Udine and then evaluate the situation.
Agger - probably the safest option but is he available and for how much? Read my above post to see why I don't think his signature is possible at this moment.
Mexes - are you sure he is available? I think there is not a single possible chance that Roma will sell him to us right now. Maybe in the summer, but that's a whole different topic that'll probably come up a lot during the summer.
once upon a time we were AC Milan! we could get what we wanted, even in january. why the hell is it impossible to sign bench players from other teams?
But you are correct about alex and zapata. We shouldve signed a defender in the summer, silvio and galliani made one hell of mess in recent years and its hard to fix it in january.
some more names, dont know if they are available or not, but they could be options. Santacroce, Gonzalo, Naldo, Kompany. Players like that must be looked at before an emergency option like cannavaro.
hitmannq8
25-12-2008, 05:33
some of you fellas have mentioned 1 or 2 reasons that Cannavaro should not come to Milan, and you are right..however I am glad you are not the management because I, just like the management, see 101 reasons to get Cannavaro. He is perfect, PERFECT! And yeah he has been sucking at Real, but who hasn't? Notice how great he is for Italy, each and every game, and then the weekend straight after he is sucking for Real Madrid. I really am 100% sure we will see the Cannavaro we know at Milan because of our Italian environment.
I'd also love to see this defense line that was destined once to be one of the all-time greats, but they fell short because of Byron Moreno. Maldini - Nesta - Cannavaro - Zambrotta. Daaaaaaaaaaaamn!! And besides the fact that Galliani will now start talking alotta crap now that we would have 4 Ballon D'Or winners.
Really guys, there are alot of reasons why Cannavaro would be the best solution at the moment. Kaladze, Senderos really cannot be depended upon. Nesta is not around no more, and Maldini's age isn't helping him play regularly. Only player we have is Bonera (Favalli is a LB not a CB). We really need a world-class partner for Bonera and who better than the Captain of the World Champions?
An 18-month deal would be perfect but I am certain that Real will ask the world for Cannavaro, because they see us as being stubborn when they tried to negotiate for Kaka, so they will probably try to do the same. Getting Cannavaro will not be easy..but he is the best option out there this January.
Guyz
Arsenal ran circles around our old team last season. A 31 yr old Nesta could not even keep up.
Now u guys want a 35-36 yr old washed up player??????????????????????.
If we had a young midfield full of players like Fabregas, Iniesta, Ribery etc full of running and young strikers like Adebayor and a relatively young average age team, then Canna would not be a problem
But under no circumstance should we adda defender that is 30+ to this team
Maldini, Kaladze, Nesta, Favalli, Janku. Thatz already too many defenders above 30. We need 2 balance our team
No Cannavaro guyz
First, Nesta played excellent vs Arsenal and Arsenal was better coz they dominated in midfield. Obviously you have no clue what you are talking about since you saw Nesta uncapable of defending vs Arsenal. No more comments needed against that. Nesta is the best defender in the world.
Hitmann - Cannavaro doesn not suck in Madrid. Have you seen El Classico? If they didnt have Cannavaro it would have been 10-0... He wasnt passed ONCE! He plays between Ramos ( cant defend and has no tactical abilities ), Metzelter (???) and Heinze/Marcelo. From which one is violent and other is a super talent but also cant defend.
For me a deal for 18 months for Cannavaro would be great. We cannot expect Mexes, Santacroce etc. in january...
It would be nice now that Milan goes out and pays 25mln for Santacroce and 8for Dossena, but that will not happen.
Players like Canini ( look at him play ), Zapata are also good solutions, but wihout Nesta there is a different dimension of a plyer Milan needs. You can pair up everyone with Nesta, but you cant with 40 year old Maldini and Kaladze/Bonera. Senderos is a circus, no need to talk about him.
And stop talking about Agger - the defender of a leading team in EPL and a team that goes for CL and EPL. And you people ask L'pool to sell Agger to Milan in january....get serious.
Sounds to me like:
"Who is the next Cannavaro and can Milan get him?"
Hitmann - Cannavaro doesn not suck in Madrid. Have you seen El Classico? If they didnt have Cannavaro it would have been 10-0... He wasnt passed ONCE! He plays between Ramos ( cant defend and has no tactical abilities ), Metzelter (???) and Heinze/Marcelo. From which one is violent and other is a super talent but also cant defend.
Even though I completely disagree with your views about Ramos I wont discuss them right now. I would like to add that Ramos was playing out of position at a time when he's completely out of form.
I saw the El Classico twice (bored the next day) and even though Cannavaro played well I would have to say Metzelder was better (except that momentary error in marking Puyol). He made atleast 3 goals saving tackles. Neither Marcelo nor Hienze played in that game as both were injured (seriously did you even watch the match?). Salgado played that match as RB.
Before you go on attacking the rest of the backline in that match I would like to add Cannavaro didnt face Messi like Ramos and Metzelder did. Even though Messi wasnt in the best form, he was still beating his men comfortably and I'm sure he wouldve beaten Cannavaro too if he had faced him. Anyway, he was marking Eto'o who played badly that night.
Metzelder and Ramos faced Messi and Alves whereas Cannavaro and Salgado faced Abidal and Henry.. which is more difficult? I dont think it's the most difficult question.
Getting back to Cannavaro, his performances prior to this match for the whole of this and the last season were nowhere near his days at Juventus. The number of mistakes he has made this season are many. He raised his game with the moment (shows his character). Plus he has looked out of sorts in international matches (I can recall 2 where he sucked).
For those who are being falsely convinced of Cannavaro's abilities by the two titles Madrid have won in the past couple of seasons, look back at how poor Barcelona have been in both of those seasons. Also look at Madrid's performances in cup ties and champions league matches.
I'm not saying he's bad.. he's just not the same.
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